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Are our expectations now higher?

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Topic: Are our expectations now higher?
Posted By: Fscarlet
Subject: Are our expectations now higher?
Date Posted: 12 June 2018 at 12:20pm
I was talking to a friend of mine who is a season ticket holder over the Loughor & he said that the Ospreys should be looking at a semi final place in the challenge cup as a minimum this year, though with the calibre of teams in it they may not make it that far.

Anyway that got me thinking about what our expectations are now. Three seasons ago if someone had said to anyone us, within 3 years you will win the Pro 12, make the final the following year & reach the semi finals of the Champions Cup, I am sure many of us would have said "if you say so". But we are coming off the back of quite a couple of seasons.

So what do we think will constitute a successful 2018/19 season?

I would like to think we will make the semi finals of the Pro 14 & certainly the knock out stages of the Champions Cup though if I am greedy I would love a home QF & 'home' semi final too.

I also look forward to the development of younger players such as Ioan Nicholas & Ryan Conbeer.

I appreciate we are weeks away from the start of the season but what, for you, are you looking for next season?



Replies:
Posted By: ChrisX
Date Posted: 12 June 2018 at 12:34pm
Pro 14 Final
Champions Cup Semi Final
Keep our Home Pro 14 record going


Posted By: PE SA
Date Posted: 12 June 2018 at 12:46pm
Pivac came in, set targets and has achieved them all.
Its now time to look at those targets and raise the bar.
We became Pro 12 champions IN 16/17. We defended the title in the final 17/18.
We reached the semi final of Europe 17/18.
 
For 18/19 from my point of view:
We need to continue being highly competitive in Pro14.
Reaching the knock out stages yet again in Europe.
 
Its all about progress.


Posted By: Tim Opolis
Date Posted: 12 June 2018 at 1:28pm
We have a stronger non test team next season, the target for the league should be a home semi. Also if we can get a home quarter final in Europe again then we could hope for that elusive home semi in Europe. By damn we're due one!
 
My expectations are higher. A Euro final or even the grail has to be in our sights.


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Tymor nesa Duw, plis tymor nesa.


Posted By: Wasp
Date Posted: 12 June 2018 at 1:29pm
It's difficult to target winning competitions, but our target should be to be in the KO rounds of both major competitions every year. 

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Posted By: Micro Duck
Date Posted: 12 June 2018 at 1:42pm
Win the lot. 

Boom.


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Posted By: Craca Hyll
Date Posted: 12 June 2018 at 2:13pm
Any season where we get to watch entertaining rugby with meaningful games towards the end of the season is a successful one in my book. That means making the knockout stages of either the Pro14 or the Champions Cup.


Posted By: T_RICHARDS_94
Date Posted: 12 June 2018 at 2:59pm
I'd be more than happy with Pro 14 semi-final and Euro quarter-final next season.
 
Big season for the youngsters coming through - Conbeer I expect will play a lot more and Ioan and Corey should also be in the mix.
 
Having said that, we may struggle to be the top Welsh region after Dragons recruitment have turned them into the Gwent All Blacks (sorry for the sarcasm!) Approve


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Posted By: aber-fan
Date Posted: 12 June 2018 at 3:28pm
Originally posted by ChrisX ChrisX wrote:

Pro 14 Final
Champions Cup Semi Final
Keep our Home Pro 14 record going

Those have got to be the targets!


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I share no-one's ideas. I have my own.
(Ivan Turgenev)


Posted By: aber-fan
Date Posted: 12 June 2018 at 3:31pm
Originally posted by T_RICHARDS_94 T_RICHARDS_94 wrote:

I'd be more than happy with Pro 14 semi-final and Euro quarter-final next season.
 
Big season for the youngsters coming through - Conbeer I expect will play a lot more and Ioan and Corey should also be in the mix.
 
Having said that, we may struggle to be the top Welsh region after Dragons recruitment have turned them into the Gwent All Blacks (sorry for the sarcasm!) Approve

I'm not quaking in my boots yet.

True, they have signed some serious quality - but it takes a while for new players to gel and fit into a system. Also, it's not clear if the Drags coaching staff have what it takes - not on this season's show, but they could maybe blame the quality of players for that. They'll have no excuses, next season. (FWIW, I think the Blues will prove to be more of a challenge, unless their new coach is a dud.)


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I share no-one's ideas. I have my own.
(Ivan Turgenev)


Posted By: Mundoscarlet
Date Posted: 12 June 2018 at 4:26pm
Where is this serious quality?


Posted By: seany61
Date Posted: 12 June 2018 at 4:27pm
Semi Final in Pro 14
QF in Europe

Playing knockout rugby consistently in both competitions should be where we are aiming. The more we play in those pressure games the more accustomed to the pressure the players will be and the more attractive proposition we become for potential players and coaches. Also, crucially, KO rugby generally brings fans through the gates. 


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Think, Think, Think .... Its a thinking game.


Posted By: Fscarlet
Date Posted: 12 June 2018 at 4:27pm
If I am being hyper critical I think I would like to see some of the young forwards starting to come through to the seniors this year.


Posted By: SospanMawr
Date Posted: 12 June 2018 at 5:30pm
Originally posted by Fscarlet Fscarlet wrote:

If I am being hyper critical I think I would like to see some of the young forwards starting to come through to the seniors this year.
Yep I’ll agree here, would like to see some of Rhys Fawcett, Daf Hughes/Taylor Davies, Javen Sebastian, Josh Helps, Tom Phillips (if fit), Shaun Evans all given a run of 2-3 games with the first team to see if they will be able to step up.


Posted By: mr geraint
Date Posted: 12 June 2018 at 10:02pm
Originally posted by Mundoscarlet Mundoscarlet wrote:

Where is this serious quality?


I'm no Dargon but I reckon that Ross Moriarty is a definite improvement.

They've taken some punts which might be worth taking: Hibbard is a good shout if he still has the engine, Rhodri looked good for us, Jordan might have learnt to tackle by now...

So, um yeah, Moriarty.


Posted By: GPR - Rochester
Date Posted: 13 June 2018 at 8:23am
i appreciate that this is not meant to be a Dragons thread but it seems to have developed into that. I am not comfortable with the continuing attacks on the Dragons. There can be no doubt that they have a vastly improved squad for next season. Moriarty & Rhodri are seriously good signings. They will have Amos, Morgan, Rhodri, Dee, Brown, Hill, Moriarty & Griffiths pushing very hard for a place in the World Cup squad next year. Surely posters can see that as progress.


Posted By: Fscarlet
Date Posted: 13 June 2018 at 9:05am
Originally posted by SospanMawr SospanMawr wrote:

Yep I’ll agree here, would like to see some of Rhys Fawcett, Daf Hughes/Taylor Davies, Javen Sebastian, Josh Helps, Tom Phillips (if fit), Shaun Evans all given a run of 2-3 games with the first team to see if they will be able to step up.


I hope that these guys will get a bit more game time/opportunities this season. I feel like we have done very well in bringing through the young backs but we seem to be recruiting forward cover, so fingers crossed they get a shout this year.


Posted By: GPR - Rochester
Date Posted: 13 June 2018 at 9:18am
With a larger better quality squad being assembled young players have to be exceptional to warrant a place. Conbeer, Nicholas & Baldwin have been blooded so should go on to play bigger parts. One of the young hookers will definitely get his chance next season. Shaun Evans is in for very strong competition from Dan Davis. I have not seen much of Ellis Jones the back 5 player but I believe he has some good skills.

A huge amount of development will go into these young players when they start to live as full time professionals and great strides can be made. We certainly could do with developing some front 5 forwards & a carrying No 8. 


Posted By: scarletnut
Date Posted: 13 June 2018 at 9:39am
Originally posted by GPR - Rochester GPR - Rochester wrote:

With a larger better quality squad being assembled young players have to be exceptional to warrant a place. Conbeer, Nicholas & Baldwin have been blooded so should go on to play bigger parts. One of the young hookers will definitely get his chance next season. Shaun Evans is in for very strong competition from Dan Davis. I have not seen much of Ellis Jones the back 5 player but I believe he has some good skills.

A huge amount of development will go into these young players when they start to live as full time professionals and great strides can be made. We certainly could do with developing some front 5 forwards & a carrying No 8. 
I think Tuipulotu is going to be developed as a carrying 8 so fingers crossed on that one

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I still wake up late at night and think of what might have been when tim stimpson hit that jammy penalty1


Posted By: GPR - Rochester
Date Posted: 13 June 2018 at 9:42am
Originally posted by scarletnut scarletnut wrote:

Originally posted by GPR - Rochester GPR - Rochester wrote:

With a larger better quality squad being assembled young players have to be exceptional to warrant a place. Conbeer, Nicholas & Baldwin have been blooded so should go on to play bigger parts. One of the young hookers will definitely get his chance next season. Shaun Evans is in for very strong competition from Dan Davis. I have not seen much of Ellis Jones the back 5 player but I believe he has some good skills.

A huge amount of development will go into these young players when they start to live as full time professionals and great strides can be made. We certainly could do with developing some front 5 forwards & a carrying No 8. 
I think Tuipulotu is going to be developed as a carrying 8 so fingers crossed on that one

Yes he certainly possesses some great raw materials and has a decent family pedigree.


Posted By: Fscarlet
Date Posted: 13 June 2018 at 9:50am
Originally posted by scarletnut scarletnut wrote:

Originally posted by GPR - Rochester GPR - Rochester wrote:

With a larger better quality squad being assembled young players have to be exceptional to warrant a place. Conbeer, Nicholas & Baldwin have been blooded so should go on to play bigger parts. One of the young hookers will definitely get his chance next season. Shaun Evans is in for very strong competition from Dan Davis. I have not seen much of Ellis Jones the back 5 player but I believe he has some good skills.

A huge amount of development will go into these young players when they start to live as full time professionals and great strides can be made. We certainly could do with developing some front 5 forwards & a carrying No 8. 
I think Tuipulotu is going to be developed as a carrying 8 so fingers crossed on that one


I haven't heard a player, that I haven't seen play, talked about so much for a long time.... lets hope he develops nicely.


Posted By: GPR - Rochester
Date Posted: 13 June 2018 at 9:53am
Originally posted by Fscarlet Fscarlet wrote:

Originally posted by scarletnut scarletnut wrote:

Originally posted by GPR - Rochester GPR - Rochester wrote:

With a larger better quality squad being assembled young players have to be exceptional to warrant a place. Conbeer, Nicholas & Baldwin have been blooded so should go on to play bigger parts. One of the young hookers will definitely get his chance next season. Shaun Evans is in for very strong competition from Dan Davis. I have not seen much of Ellis Jones the back 5 player but I believe he has some good skills.

A huge amount of development will go into these young players when they start to live as full time professionals and great strides can be made. We certainly could do with developing some front 5 forwards & a carrying No 8. 
I think Tuipulotu is going to be developed as a carrying 8 so fingers crossed on that one


I haven't heard a player, that I haven't seen play, talked about so much for a long time.... lets hope he develops nicely.

That is perfectly true. It does however appear that some very good judges of potential were persuaded that he had a bright future. Lets hope that this forward thinking is given time to fulfil its potential. If he gets to be the best he can be that is all anyone can ask. 


Posted By: SA14
Date Posted: 13 June 2018 at 11:01am
Knockout stages Europe and pro24 final again for me. World Cup season will be a whole different matter. If we are still supplying a large chunk to Wales our squad will be decimated.


Posted By: Fscarlet
Date Posted: 13 June 2018 at 11:08am
Originally posted by SA14 SA14 wrote:

Knockout stages Europe and pro24 final again for me. World Cup season will be a whole different matter. If we are still supplying a large chunk to Wales our squad will be decimated.


Bloody hell, I knew South Africa wanted to get more teams in but surely adding 10 next season will be a logistical nightmare WinkWink


Posted By: Legendinmybathroom
Date Posted: 13 June 2018 at 11:15am
Pro 12 final and champions cup 1/4 or semifinals. Remember last season we were top seeds in the draw but next season that will be Leinster, so our group might be tougher than last year. The champions cup as a whole will be very tough, who’d have thought that Toulon would be as low a fourth tier plus there are a lot of top sides who didn’t even qualify. I’d be happy to get into the knockout stages and maybe finally get that elusive home semifinal.
Our squad will be stronger during the international periods because of our new signings, but these signings will probably hold back the development of some of the younger academy players coming through, but we can’t have it all ways can we.


Posted By: Exkixu
Date Posted: 13 June 2018 at 11:49am
Originally posted by Legendinmybathroom Legendinmybathroom wrote:

Pro 12 final and champions cup 1/4 or semifinals. Remember last season we were top seeds in the draw but next season that will be Leinster, so our group might be tougher than last year. The champions cup as a whole will be very tough, who’d have thought that Toulon would be as low a fourth tier plus there are a lot of top sides who didn’t even qualify. I’d be happy to get into the knockout stages and maybe finally get that elusive home semifinal.
Our squad will be stronger during the international periods because of our new signings, but these signings will probably hold back the development of some of the younger academy players coming through, but we can’t have it all ways can we.

66% chances we'll be tier 1 again I think.

Pro14 Final and champions QF will be a good season
Champions Home Semi would be a fantastic achievement.




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More carries than any of our forwards. Priestland Fan Club Proud Member


Posted By: Sosban bach
Date Posted: 13 June 2018 at 12:11pm
There is no chance for us getting a home semi! Only teams who play some home games at the big boy stadiums have that opportunity. Best you can get is in Cardiff I think?


Posted By: Fscarlet
Date Posted: 13 June 2018 at 12:15pm
Originally posted by Sosban bach Sosban bach wrote:

There is no chance for us getting a home semi! Only teams who play some home games at the big boy stadiums have that opportunity. Best you can get is in Cardiff I think?


The EPCR pick the 'home' venues for the Semi Finals hence my use of 'home' when I said I would love to get a home Semi.

The big issue from this season was the fact that Leinster played their big matches including the QF at the Avivva.

I think for the majority of us a 'home' semi in Cardiff is much more doable that a semi in Ireland or Scotland.


Posted By: GPR - Rochester
Date Posted: 13 June 2018 at 12:38pm
Originally posted by Fscarlet Fscarlet wrote:

Originally posted by Sosban bach Sosban bach wrote:

There is no chance for us getting a home semi! Only teams who play some home games at the big boy stadiums have that opportunity. Best you can get is in Cardiff I think?


The EPCR pick the 'home' venues for the Semi Finals hence my use of 'home' when I said I would love to get a home Semi.

The big issue from this season was the fact that Leinster played their big matches including the QF at the Avivva.

I think for the majority of us a 'home' semi in Cardiff is much more doable that a semi in Ireland or Scotland.

That would be a huge occasion. Can you imagine the atmosphere with 50k + fans in the Principality for say Scarlets against Munster, Leinster, Racing or Saracens. The Heineken is the pinnacle for club tournaments in World Rugby and to be serial knock out stage participants is some achievement. 


Posted By: rygbi11
Date Posted: 13 June 2018 at 4:12pm
We are hopefully safe whatever happens because there is no relegation from the Pro14.


Posted By: Scarletrover
Date Posted: 13 June 2018 at 4:36pm
Glasgow AND Newcastle for me!

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Posted By: supertaf
Date Posted: 13 June 2018 at 5:19pm
Originally posted by Fscarlet Fscarlet wrote:

I was talking to a friend of mine who is a season ticket holder over the Loughor & he said that the Ospreys should be looking at a semi final place in the challenge cup as a minimum this year, though with the calibre of teams in it they may not make it that far.

Anyway that got me thinking about what our expectations are now. Three seasons ago if someone had said to anyone us, within 3 years you will win the Pro 12, make the final the following year & reach the semi finals of the Champions Cup, I am sure many of us would have said "if you say so". But we are coming off the back of quite a couple of seasons.

So what do we think will constitute a successful 2018/19 season?

I would like to think we will make the semi finals of the Pro 14 & certainly the knock out stages of the Champions Cup though if I am greedy I would love a home QF & 'home' semi final too.

I also look forward to the development of younger players such as Ioan Nicholas & Ryan Conbeer.

I appreciate we are weeks away from the start of the season but what, for you, are you looking for next season?
Dreams are different to expectations though. Ospreys may dream of being in a semi but they couldn't do it with the galacticos as they were christened so why now when they are pretty weak in some key areas. We should look to keep our home record as a minimum, depending on pool we should look at semi again in HC and why not challenge for the league. We are now expected to perform, not a one season fluke some some.


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Posted By: Eastern outpost
Date Posted: 13 June 2018 at 5:56pm
Originally posted by Scarletrover Scarletrover wrote:

Glasgow AND Newcastle for me!
Apologies if I’ve got your
profession wrong, however, here goes.

You could pitch those away trips to any rugby supporting learner drivers as an intensive weekend away, designed to accelerate their date with a successful test.

For the French club, maybe there’s some folk who want to have a go at driving on the other side of the road with someone else’s car and insurance.

If there’s a spare seat in the car for that, more difficult to sell, trip you could always add a Con Air member. They’re especially handy on width judgements abroad, I understand.

😇

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Posted By: Speedy
Date Posted: 13 June 2018 at 6:11pm
One area we can improve is by getting ourselves home draws in these knockout stages, thus making our chances of progression far more likely.

Its what Leinsters success is based upon.


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Posted By: SospanMawr
Date Posted: 13 June 2018 at 6:26pm
My expectations (or I suppose these are hopes) are a bit different
- Our website gets better. More content. Better aesthetically. More player biographies etc.
- Our average attendance is over 10k again.
- Three sell outs (home knockout league, home knockout cup, Ospreys, maybe another?)
- Another good season for our age grade teams.


Posted By: Fscarlet
Date Posted: 14 June 2018 at 8:21am
Originally posted by Speedy Speedy wrote:

One area we can improve is by getting ourselves home draws in these knockout stages, thus making our chances of progression far more likely.

Its what Leinsters success is based upon.


Whilst this is true, I think it is very fair to say that our International Window squad is probably going to be one of the strongest we've had this coming season. This is where Leinster, for me, have been at an advantage for so long. So with a bit of luck we will have a squad capable of stepping up during the windows.


Posted By: reesytheexile
Date Posted: 14 June 2018 at 8:45am
Originally posted by Eastern outpost Eastern outpost wrote:

Originally posted by Scarletrover Scarletrover wrote:

Glasgow AND Newcastle for me!
Apologies if I’ve got your
profession wrong, however, here goes.

You could pitch those away trips to any rugby supporting learner drivers as an intensive weekend away, designed to accelerate their date with a successful test.

For the French club, maybe there’s some folk who want to have a go at driving on the other side of the road with someone else’s car and insurance.

If there’s a spare seat in the car for that, more difficult to sell, trip you could always add a Con Air member. They’re especially handy on width judgements abroad, I understand.

😇
Ha Ha 👍

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"I'd rather have been a judge than a miner.Being a miner,as soon as you are too old and tired and sick and stupid to do the job properly,you have to go.The very opposite applies with judges!"P.Cook


Posted By: SA14
Date Posted: 14 June 2018 at 9:05am
Originally posted by Fscarlet Fscarlet wrote:

Originally posted by Speedy Speedy wrote:

One area we can improve is by getting ourselves home draws in these knockout stages, thus making our chances of progression far more likely.

Its what Leinsters success is based upon.


Whilst this is true, I think it is very fair to say that our International Window squad is probably going to be one of the strongest we've had this coming season. This is where Leinster, for me, have been at an advantage for so long. So with a bit of luck we will have a squad capable of stepping up during the windows.


I wouldn’t go that far. I’d say it’s about the same.


Posted By: Fscarlet
Date Posted: 14 June 2018 at 9:19am
Originally posted by SA14 SA14 wrote:

Originally posted by Fscarlet Fscarlet wrote:

Originally posted by Speedy Speedy wrote:

One area we can improve is by getting ourselves home draws in these knockout stages, thus making our chances of progression far more likely.

Its what Leinsters success is based upon.


Whilst this is true, I think it is very fair to say that our International Window squad is probably going to be one of the strongest we've had this coming season. This is where Leinster, for me, have been at an advantage for so long. So with a bit of luck we will have a squad capable of stepping up during the windows.


I wouldn’t go that far. I’d say it’s about the same.


I would say it is slightly stronger given that the young backs that came in this season will have another years experience, plus we have the additions of Blade Thomson, Uzair Cassiem, Clayton Blommetjies who will be available during windows which should help. I know we didn't lose Beirne but still we have recruited well in the pack for window periods.


Posted By: PE SA
Date Posted: 14 June 2018 at 9:29am
Originally posted by GPR - Rochester GPR - Rochester wrote:

i appreciate that this is not meant to be a Dragons thread but it seems to have developed into that. I am not comfortable with the continuing attacks on the Dragons. There can be no doubt that they have a vastly improved squad for next season. Moriarty & Rhodri are seriously good signings. They will have Amos, Morgan, Rhodri, Dee, Brown, Hill, Moriarty & Griffiths pushing very hard for a place in the World Cup squad next year. Surely posters can see that as progress.
But they had those this year - apart from RM!
 
These are players that will miss a large chunks of the season though. So again, I see them complaining about depth again next year. As for Brown, its not certain he will be back playing yet is it?
Everyone can see that they have some promising youngsters. They always have had promising youngsters. Its just that for whatever reason they have never realised their full potential there. Even Faletau left as he was not as good as what was hoped, got extremely stale there. He went to Bath and reached another level.
 
I don't think these lads can be as good as they can under the current set up. Zero man management skills. 
I think the issue everyone has with the Dragons is the way that Scarlets were watched getting rid of all high earners, not signing anyone, and going with kids because of our debt....Ospreys now in major cash troubles - having similar stories to us back then that they are now "struggling to continue as a business", Cardiff Blues have also had their issues...Dragons have had their debts wiped clean, given the go ahead to sign players that wouldn't be cheap (Morroarity, Hibbard etc), and continuous Andy Howell and Robin Davey stupid news days and over the top positive press. Even Scrum V spoke more about Gwent area than Cardiff Blues winning the European trophy! Scrum V also allocated goodness knows how many positive chats about them after their embarrassing losses through the season "its all about next year". The only thing that's happened is that Jackman has managed to get himself unsackable this year after getting people to believe that...even though he is the worst Dragons coach in their entire history results wise.
 
The squad that they will have next year (apart from RM, JW and RW) were embarrassed out in South Africa and Martyn Williams and Jiffy thankfully called it on them that that was the side that they thought was "their strongest side" - everyone else was being released. They went on to say the players that they signed with respect are players that wouldn't get into other regions.
Have they got an improved squad? hard to say as a squad needs depth. They've got rid of players that would give them decent depth! For example, I cant believe for one second they think Jacob Botica and Josh Lewis are better options at 10 than Angus OBrien - who is both younger and far more experienced than Botica and Lewis!
 
So with injuries and call ups, I can see them having no real progress personally. They are targeting 6 wins...we will see.


Posted By: scarletnut
Date Posted: 14 June 2018 at 9:35am
Originally posted by SA14 SA14 wrote:

Originally posted by Fscarlet Fscarlet wrote:

Originally posted by Speedy Speedy wrote:

One area we can improve is by getting ourselves home draws in these knockout stages, thus making our chances of progression far more likely.

Its what Leinsters success is based upon.


Whilst this is true, I think it is very fair to say that our International Window squad is probably going to be one of the strongest we've had this coming season. This is where Leinster, for me, have been at an advantage for so long. So with a bit of luck we will have a squad capable of stepping up during the windows.


I wouldn’t go that far. I’d say it’s about the same.
What are you basing that on? Our international window team is far stronger next season than it has ever been. Pivac and the board made it their main objective when they recruited last season

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I still wake up late at night and think of what might have been when tim stimpson hit that jammy penalty1


Posted By: aber-fan
Date Posted: 14 June 2018 at 9:35am
Originally posted by reesytheexile reesytheexile wrote:

Originally posted by Eastern outpost Eastern outpost wrote:

Originally posted by Scarletrover Scarletrover wrote:

Glasgow AND Newcastle for me!
Apologies if I’ve got your
profession wrong, however, here goes.

You could pitch those away trips to any rugby supporting learner drivers as an intensive weekend away, designed to accelerate their date with a successful test.

For the French club, maybe there’s some folk who want to have a go at driving on the other side of the road with someone else’s car and insurance.

If there’s a spare seat in the car for that, more difficult to sell, trip you could always add a Con Air member. They’re especially handy on width judgements abroad, I understand.

😇
Ha Ha 👍

LOL

Ah... memories of Brive!


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I share no-one's ideas. I have my own.
(Ivan Turgenev)


Posted By: supertaf
Date Posted: 14 June 2018 at 9:38am
Originally posted by PE SA PE SA wrote:

Originally posted by GPR - Rochester GPR - Rochester wrote:

i appreciate that this is not meant to be a Dragons thread but it seems to have developed into that. I am not comfortable with the continuing attacks on the Dragons. There can be no doubt that they have a vastly improved squad for next season. Moriarty & Rhodri are seriously good signings. They will have Amos, Morgan, Rhodri, Dee, Brown, Hill, Moriarty & Griffiths pushing very hard for a place in the World Cup squad next year. Surely posters can see that as progress.
But they had those this year - apart from RM!
 
These are players that will miss a large chunks of the season though. So again, I see them complaining about depth again next year. As for Brown, its not certain he will be back playing yet is it?
Everyone can see that they have some promising youngsters. They always have had promising youngsters. Its just that for whatever reason they have never realised their full potential there. Even Faletau left as he was not as good as what was hoped, got extremely stale there. He went to Bath and reached another level.
 
I don't think these lads can be as good as they can under the current set up. Zero man management skills. 
I think the issue everyone has with the Dragons is the way that Scarlets were watched getting rid of all high earners, not signing anyone, and going with kids because of our debt....Ospreys now in major cash troubles - having similar stories to us back then that they are now "struggling to continue as a business", Cardiff Blues have also had their issues...Dragons have had their debts wiped clean, given the go ahead to sign players that wouldn't be cheap (Morroarity, Hibbard etc), and continuous Andy Howell and Robin Davey stupid news days and over the top positive press. Even Scrum V spoke more about Gwent area than Cardiff Blues winning the European trophy! Scrum V also allocated goodness knows how many positive chats about them after their embarrassing losses through the season "its all about next year". The only thing that's happened is that Jackman has managed to get himself unsackable this year after getting people to believe that...even though he is the worst Dragons coach in their entire history results wise.
 
The squad that they will have next year (apart from RM, JW and RW) were embarrassed out in South Africa and Martyn Williams and Jiffy thankfully called it on them that that was the side that they thought was "their strongest side" - everyone else was being released. They went on to say the players that they signed with respect are players that wouldn't get into other regions.
Have they got an improved squad? hard to say as a squad needs depth. They've got rid of players that would give them decent depth! For example, I cant believe for one second they think Jacob Botica and Josh Lewis are better options at 10 than Angus OBrien - who is both younger and far more experienced than Botica and Lewis!
 
So with injuries and call ups, I can see them having no real progress personally. They are targeting 6 wins...we will see.
Sense.


-------------
Scarlets - Suppliers of fine rugby since 1872


Posted By: NobbySosban
Date Posted: 14 June 2018 at 9:40am
Having made Champs Cup Semi & PRO14 Final, anything less is going to feel like a step back this season.

In reality, being involved and competitive in the knock-out stages of both tournaments for a successive season would be terrific, and would show sustained progress & performance.

However, it will be the players along with this group of coaches who will set the expectations for the season ahead, as they did last season, and I can't see them settling for anything less than they've just tasted. Leinster are the benchmark and will be in our Conference once again, so beating them will be the main focus and motivation as the keystone to greater success.




-------------
Twitterer @ebenezer68


Posted By: RR1972
Date Posted: 14 June 2018 at 9:41am
Originally posted by scarletnut scarletnut wrote:

Originally posted by SA14 SA14 wrote:

Originally posted by Fscarlet Fscarlet wrote:

Originally posted by Speedy Speedy wrote:

One area we can improve is by getting ourselves home draws in these knockout stages, thus making our chances of progression far more likely.

Its what Leinsters success is based upon.


Whilst this is true, I think it is very fair to say that our International Window squad is probably going to be one of the strongest we've had this coming season. This is where Leinster, for me, have been at an advantage for so long. So with a bit of luck we will have a squad capable of stepping up during the windows.


I wouldn’t go that far. I’d say it’s about the same.
What are you basing that on? Our international window team is far stronger next season than it has ever been. Pivac and the board made it their main objective when they recruited last season
 
unless Scotland call up hdc and Thompson ,  not sure what samoa are doing these days but if they play ai games fonotina will be with them
 
 
Plus we will be missing beirne who was available all last season during the international period.
 
So in the ai we could see just the two saffer lads added to our squad and in the 6 nations the two saffer lads plus fonotina
 
 
I'll leave that to others to decide if that makes us far stronger than last year


Posted By: GPR - Rochester
Date Posted: 14 June 2018 at 9:51am
Originally posted by PE SA PE SA wrote:

Originally posted by GPR - Rochester GPR - Rochester wrote:

i appreciate that this is not meant to be a Dragons thread but it seems to have developed into that. I am not comfortable with the continuing attacks on the Dragons. There can be no doubt that they have a vastly improved squad for next season. Moriarty & Rhodri are seriously good signings. They will have Amos, Morgan, Rhodri, Dee, Brown, Hill, Moriarty & Griffiths pushing very hard for a place in the World Cup squad next year. Surely posters can see that as progress.
But they had those this year - apart from RM!
 
These are players that will miss a large chunks of the season though. So again, I see them complaining about depth again next year. As for Brown, its not certain he will be back playing yet is it?
Everyone can see that they have some promising youngsters. They always have had promising youngsters. Its just that for whatever reason they have never realised their full potential there. Even Faletau left as he was not as good as what was hoped, got extremely stale there. He went to Bath and reached another level.
 
I don't think these lads can be as good as they can under the current set up. Zero man management skills. 
I think the issue everyone has with the Dragons is the way that Scarlets were watched getting rid of all high earners, not signing anyone, and going with kids because of our debt....Ospreys now in major cash troubles - having similar stories to us back then that they are now "struggling to continue as a business", Cardiff Blues have also had their issues...Dragons have had their debts wiped clean, given the go ahead to sign players that wouldn't be cheap (Morroarity, Hibbard etc), and continuous Andy Howell and Robin Davey stupid news days and over the top positive press. Even Scrum V spoke more about Gwent area than Cardiff Blues winning the European trophy! Scrum V also allocated goodness knows how many positive chats about them after their embarrassing losses through the season "its all about next year". The only thing that's happened is that Jackman has managed to get himself unsackable this year after getting people to believe that...even though he is the worst Dragons coach in their entire history results wise.
 
The squad that they will have next year (apart from RM, JW and RW) were embarrassed out in South Africa and Martyn Williams and Jiffy thankfully called it on them that that was the side that they thought was "their strongest side" - everyone else was being released. They went on to say the players that they signed with respect are players that wouldn't get into other regions.
Have they got an improved squad? hard to say as a squad needs depth. They've got rid of players that would give them decent depth! For example, I cant believe for one second they think Jacob Botica and Josh Lewis are better options at 10 than Angus OBrien - who is both younger and far more experienced than Botica and Lewis!
 
So with injuries and call ups, I can see them having no real progress personally. They are targeting 6 wins...we will see.

Firstly pe sa I can only agree with you on how poor the Dragons/Jackman have been this season. My gripe is the way some on here don't see any signs of progress in their recruitment. Rhodri & Moriarty are players who we would have welcomed into our squad so they must be good signings. Tyler Morgan & Ollie Griffiths, both quality players missed most of the season through injury. So first up you have 4 top players to boost the team. Add in the 2nd row recently signed and they are starting to look competitive. Don't get me wrong they are going to need to improve the squad over the next couple of seasons to get anywhere near Heineken qualification but they have to start somewhere.

A very large weakness they need to address is at 10. Henson is not the answer now and their signings so far have been pretty underwhelming. 

Amos, Hewitt, Morgan, Dixon, Jordan, Lewis, Rhodri, Bevington, Dee, Brown, New Guy, Hill, Keddie, Moriarty, Griffiths is a pretty decent 15 with Hibbard, Fairbrother, Wainwright & Benjamin providing some forward ballast of the bench. 

As I said nowhere near Heineken level but with another 4-5 top level players next season with good retention they will start to climb the table which is all their long suffering supporters can hope for. 


Posted By: scarletnut
Date Posted: 14 June 2018 at 10:36am
Originally posted by RR1972 RR1972 wrote:

Originally posted by scarletnut scarletnut wrote:

Originally posted by SA14 SA14 wrote:

Originally posted by Fscarlet Fscarlet wrote:

Originally posted by Speedy Speedy wrote:

One area we can improve is by getting ourselves home draws in these knockout stages, thus making our chances of progression far more likely.

Its what Leinsters success is based upon.


Whilst this is true, I think it is very fair to say that our International Window squad is probably going to be one of the strongest we've had this coming season. This is where Leinster, for me, have been at an advantage for so long. So with a bit of luck we will have a squad capable of stepping up during the windows.


I wouldn’t go that far. I’d say it’s about the same.
What are you basing that on? Our international window team is far stronger next season than it has ever been. Pivac and the board made it their main objective when they recruited last season
 
unless Scotland call up hdc and Thompson ,  not sure what samoa are doing these days but if they play ai games fonotina will be with them
 
 
Plus we will be missing beirne who was available all last season during the international period.
 
So in the ai we could see just the two saffer lads added to our squad and in the 6 nations the two saffer lads plus fonotina
 
 
I'll leave that to others to decide if that makes us far stronger than last year
Well Pivac says we have a far stronger squad next season so I'll trust his judgement. Plus Fonotia won't be away with Samoa

-------------
I still wake up late at night and think of what might have been when tim stimpson hit that jammy penalty1


Posted By: SospanMawr
Date Posted: 14 June 2018 at 10:38am
Originally posted by RR1972 RR1972 wrote:

 
unless Scotland call up hdc and Thompson ,  not sure what samoa are doing these days but if they play ai games fonotina will be with them
 
 
Plus we will be missing beirne who was available all last season during the international period.
 
So in the ai we could see just the two saffer lads added to our squad and in the 6 nations the two saffer lads plus fonotina
 
 
I'll leave that to others to decide if that makes us far stronger than last year
Doubt that Hidalgo-Clyne will be called up in his first season here, and Blade will also find it tough to be a starter for Scotland straight away with Denton, Wilson available at 8 and lots of good second rows.
Don't forget we have players who will be another year down the line in terms of development- Elias, Taylor Davies, Steff Hughes, Josh MacLeod, Will Boyde, Dan Jones, Ioan Nicholas etc.
Phil Price is ahead of Dylan (upgrade) and we may see Fawcett come through.
Blommetjies is now our International time full back (upgrade).
Angus O'Brien is now our second choice 10 during internationals (upgrade).
 
Not to mention players returning from injury such as Daf Hughes, Tom Price, Tom Phillips, Paul Asquith etc.
 


Posted By: cymraes
Date Posted: 14 June 2018 at 10:48am

Continuation of our exciting brand of rugby
Youngsters breaking through
Undefeated at home in all competitions
Increased gates
Knock-out stages in PRO14 and Europe

That'll do me!


Posted By: RR1972
Date Posted: 14 June 2018 at 11:19am
Originally posted by SospanMawr SospanMawr wrote:

Originally posted by RR1972 RR1972 wrote:

 
unless Scotland call up hdc and Thompson ,  not sure what samoa are doing these days but if they play ai games fonotina will be with them
 
 
Plus we will be missing beirne who was available all last season during the international period.
 
So in the ai we could see just the two saffer lads added to our squad and in the 6 nations the two saffer lads plus fonotina
 
 
I'll leave that to others to decide if that makes us far stronger than last year
Doubt that Hidalgo-Clyne will be called up in his first season here, and Blade will also find it tough to be a starter for Scotland straight away with Denton, Wilson available at 8 and lots of good second rows.
Don't forget we have players who will be another year down the line in terms of development- Elias, Taylor Davies, Steff Hughes, Josh MacLeod, Will Boyde, Dan Jones, Ioan Nicholas etc.
Phil Price is ahead of Dylan (upgrade) and we may see Fawcett come through.
Blommetjies is now our International time full back (upgrade).
Angus O'Brien is now our second choice 10 during internationals (upgrade).
 
Not to mention players returning from injury such as Daf Hughes, Tom Price, Tom Phillips, Paul Asquith etc.
 
 
hdc started for Scotland last week didn't he? I can't see him not making their squad, if blade is as good as we hope hell be there to
 
Price was already here this season and you make a good point about injured players returning but no doubt other players will get injured it's the nature of the game
 
I agree with you about players being a year older and I agree we are stronger at 15 and 8 but we are going to miss beirne big time so we are weaker at lock
 
I think we will be stronger but not that much stronger as some folk on here would like to make out


Posted By: SospanMawr
Date Posted: 14 June 2018 at 1:33pm
Originally posted by RR1972 RR1972 wrote:

Originally posted by SospanMawr SospanMawr wrote:

Originally posted by RR1972 RR1972 wrote:

 
unless Scotland call up hdc and Thompson ,  not sure what samoa are doing these days but if they play ai games fonotina will be with them
 
 
Plus we will be missing beirne who was available all last season during the international period.
 
So in the ai we could see just the two saffer lads added to our squad and in the 6 nations the two saffer lads plus fonotina
 
 
I'll leave that to others to decide if that makes us far stronger than last year
Doubt that Hidalgo-Clyne will be called up in his first season here, and Blade will also find it tough to be a starter for Scotland straight away with Denton, Wilson available at 8 and lots of good second rows.
Don't forget we have players who will be another year down the line in terms of development- Elias, Taylor Davies, Steff Hughes, Josh MacLeod, Will Boyde, Dan Jones, Ioan Nicholas etc.
Phil Price is ahead of Dylan (upgrade) and we may see Fawcett come through.
Blommetjies is now our International time full back (upgrade).
Angus O'Brien is now our second choice 10 during internationals (upgrade).
 
Not to mention players returning from injury such as Daf Hughes, Tom Price, Tom Phillips, Paul Asquith etc.
 
 
hdc started for Scotland last week didn't he? I can't see him not making their squad, if blade is as good as we hope hell be there to
 
Price was already here this season and you make a good point about injured players returning but no doubt other players will get injured it's the nature of the game
 
I agree with you about players being a year older and I agree we are stronger at 15 and 8 but we are going to miss beirne big time so we are weaker at lock
 
I think we will be stronger but not that much stronger as some folk on here would like to make out
I think there's a good chance they make the squad but making the 23 is something else entirely especially with Horne, Ali Price, Pyrgos, Laidlaw around too.
An international team of:
Price, Elias/Daf, Kruger, Price/Cummins, Bulbring, Blade/MacLeod, Boyde, Cassiem.
HDC, Dinky, Prydie, Asquith, Hughes, Nicholas, Blommetjies
 
Looks pretty good to me and should challenge most in the league during that period.


Posted By: diego6754
Date Posted: 15 June 2018 at 2:37pm
Aims for next season....

Knockout rugby in both comps
Continuation and development of style of play
Development of youngsters. Would be nice to have at least 1 by next season who is first 15.
Increased average gate.
Reduced losses

A word on the Dragons. They will be stronger. I just hope for their sakes and the sake of welsh rugby they stop embarrassing themselves week in, week out and take a few scalps which will help us on our road to glory!


Posted By: PE SA
Date Posted: 15 June 2018 at 3:22pm
Originally posted by GPR - Rochester GPR - Rochester wrote:

Originally posted by PE SA PE SA wrote:

Originally posted by GPR - Rochester GPR - Rochester wrote:

i appreciate that this is not meant to be a Dragons thread but it seems to have developed into that. I am not comfortable with the continuing attacks on the Dragons. There can be no doubt that they have a vastly improved squad for next season. Moriarty & Rhodri are seriously good signings. They will have Amos, Morgan, Rhodri, Dee, Brown, Hill, Moriarty & Griffiths pushing very hard for a place in the World Cup squad next year. Surely posters can see that as progress.
But they had those this year - apart from RM!
 
These are players that will miss a large chunks of the season though. So again, I see them complaining about depth again next year. As for Brown, its not certain he will be back playing yet is it?
Everyone can see that they have some promising youngsters. They always have had promising youngsters. Its just that for whatever reason they have never realised their full potential there. Even Faletau left as he was not as good as what was hoped, got extremely stale there. He went to Bath and reached another level.
 
I don't think these lads can be as good as they can under the current set up. Zero man management skills. 
I think the issue everyone has with the Dragons is the way that Scarlets were watched getting rid of all high earners, not signing anyone, and going with kids because of our debt....Ospreys now in major cash troubles - having similar stories to us back then that they are now "struggling to continue as a business", Cardiff Blues have also had their issues...Dragons have had their debts wiped clean, given the go ahead to sign players that wouldn't be cheap (Morroarity, Hibbard etc), and continuous Andy Howell and Robin Davey stupid news days and over the top positive press. Even Scrum V spoke more about Gwent area than Cardiff Blues winning the European trophy! Scrum V also allocated goodness knows how many positive chats about them after their embarrassing losses through the season "its all about next year". The only thing that's happened is that Jackman has managed to get himself unsackable this year after getting people to believe that...even though he is the worst Dragons coach in their entire history results wise.
 
The squad that they will have next year (apart from RM, JW and RW) were embarrassed out in South Africa and Martyn Williams and Jiffy thankfully called it on them that that was the side that they thought was "their strongest side" - everyone else was being released. They went on to say the players that they signed with respect are players that wouldn't get into other regions.
Have they got an improved squad? hard to say as a squad needs depth. They've got rid of players that would give them decent depth! For example, I cant believe for one second they think Jacob Botica and Josh Lewis are better options at 10 than Angus OBrien - who is both younger and far more experienced than Botica and Lewis!
 
So with injuries and call ups, I can see them having no real progress personally. They are targeting 6 wins...we will see.

Firstly pe sa I can only agree with you on how poor the Dragons/Jackman have been this season. My gripe is the way some on here don't see any signs of progress in their recruitment. Rhodri & Moriarty are players who we would have welcomed into our squad so they must be good signings. Tyler Morgan & Ollie Griffiths, both quality players missed most of the season through injury. So first up you have 4 top players to boost the team. Add in the 2nd row recently signed and they are starting to look competitive. Don't get me wrong they are going to need to improve the squad over the next couple of seasons to get anywhere near Heineken qualification but they have to start somewhere.

A very large weakness they need to address is at 10. Henson is not the answer now and their signings so far have been pretty underwhelming. 

Amos, Hewitt, Morgan, Dixon, Jordan, Lewis, Rhodri, Bevington, Dee, Brown, New Guy, Hill, Keddie, Moriarty, Griffiths is a pretty decent 15 with Hibbard, Fairbrother, Wainwright & Benjamin providing some forward ballast of the bench. 

As I said nowhere near Heineken level but with another 4-5 top level players next season with good retention they will start to climb the table which is all their long suffering supporters can hope for. 
Rhodri is a decent coup for them. Would we have welcomed him? probably - but would he have been further up the pecking order with us than when he left? I don't think so - and SHC is a huge upgrade. More experienced and international. But if Rhodri plays good rugby, he is more than likely going to be missing with Wales playing traveling reserve - similar to when he left us. So he may not be with them during the time they need a boost. they haven't got the squad to cope with more 3 or 4 international call ups at all. And that's before injuries. Tyler Morgan can be a dangerous attacker - but non existent in defence - likewise Jordan. Lewis is not the answer at 10, as much as I liked him when he was with us, he is 26 and next to no experience top flight experience. Morriarity, his injuries a well documented. a reason he is at the Dragons...the only side in for him willing to give him a shot I suppose. when 4 top surgeons refuse to operate...writing on the wall there. Risky signing, but I guess for the dragons, a risk worth taking. Hibbard again, has openly said that he has gone there as they offered him a 3 year deal! He is 34! Their recruitment in some ways has been better than the past, but to get these guys in they have let players they needed to keep go. Brown is still trying to recover from his head injury suffered earlier in the year and that sounds pretty serious. will he be back? Griffiths is quality for them, Dixon another is good in midfield but both are extremely unlucky with injuries - hope they have a run.
challenging for silver wear in 3 years was his mission - but the second year, 6 wins! Asking a lot in the 3rd year!
They do have hot prospects, but the best thing for them is to get a coach who can actually bring them through.
agree but they also need to keep players that will push the players.
but with Cardiff Blues already circulating around Hewitt, I cant really see all their promising youngsters turning down the chance to actually qualify for Europe as I personally can not see it happening any time soon. I also don't think they will be ahead of the Ospreys who are at their worst since the beginning of Regional rugby - they are even far behind them.
Jackman spouting off silver wear in 3 years just undermines the years of development that other sides have done. It took us near 10 years to get where we are today. As well as Scarlets we had Leinster, Munster, Glasgow, Connacht, Ulster, these are Champions that developed their own and took a while for them to get there and build the depth. Rome was not built in a day...something Jackman needs to learn. I cant see any real progress for them next year though as the teams around them have also got stronger and better. What will Jackman spout next year? "We made a load of signings so we need time to gel...its all about next season"!!! 
 



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