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B&I Lions squad announcement

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KID A View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote KID A Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 May 2017 at 3:04pm
Exactly Reesy. I wasn't aware of the extent to which clubs do this until recently. Singling out Saracens and Billy V here, is a bit short sighted. Just my opinion.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote aber-fan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 May 2017 at 3:53pm
Originally posted by reesytheexile reesytheexile wrote:

All clubs do it .Players want to play and clubs want them to play, especially the big names.

We call it "nursing an injury " it sometimes gets nursed for months and ends up with an operation announcement usually close to the end of the season. It's normal. No cunning plan.

No, indeed. But it does mean that Vunipola now misses out on a chance to represent the Lions. Maybe he doesn't care? If he does - could he have persuaded the club to let him get treated earlier?

The point here is, the summer tour is not some Mickey Mouse national tour to give young players a chance to come through, but (in effect) a sort of world championship between (most of) the best of the NH against (most of) the best of the SH. And the Lions have only ever won once in NZ, in 1971. (Those were the days of setting the alarm for 3am and tuning in to the radio...) Vunipola's absence makes a very big challenge even harder to overcome.

Maybe the younger generation in general have little interest in the Lions?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote KID A Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 May 2017 at 4:01pm
Originally posted by aber-fan aber-fan wrote:

Originally posted by reesytheexile reesytheexile wrote:

All clubs do it .Players want to play and clubs want them to play, especially the big names.

We call it "nursing an injury " it sometimes gets nursed for months and ends up with an operation announcement usually close to the end of the season. It's normal. No cunning plan.


No, indeed. But it does mean that Vunipola now misses out on a chance to represent the Lions. Maybe he doesn't care? If he does - could he have persuaded the club to let him get treated earlier?

The point here is, the summer tour is not some Mickey Mouse national tour to give young players a chance to come through, but (in effect) a sort of world championship between (most of) the best of the NH against (most of) the best of the SH. And the Lions have only ever won once in NZ, in 1971. (Those were the days of setting the alarm for 3am and tuning in to the radio...) Vunipola's absence makes a very big challenge even harder to overcome.

Maybe the younger generation in general have little interest in the Lions?


So the other alternative is for Billy Vunipola to have an operation and to not work for his employers for the last few months of the season yet go on tour with another team during the Summer.

Would you be happy if the Scarlets had done that with Ken, Foxy or Sanjay?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote aber-fan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 May 2017 at 4:14pm
Originally posted by KID A KID A wrote:

Originally posted by aber-fan aber-fan wrote:

Originally posted by reesytheexile reesytheexile wrote:

All clubs do it .Players want to play and clubs want them to play, especially the big names.

We call it "nursing an injury " it sometimes gets nursed for months and ends up with an operation announcement usually close to the end of the season. It's normal. No cunning plan.


No, indeed. But it does mean that Vunipola now misses out on a chance to represent the Lions. Maybe he doesn't care? If he does - could he have persuaded the club to let him get treated earlier?

The point here is, the summer tour is not some Mickey Mouse national tour to give young players a chance to come through, but (in effect) a sort of world championship between (most of) the best of the NH against (most of) the best of the SH. And the Lions have only ever won once in NZ, in 1971. (Those were the days of setting the alarm for 3am and tuning in to the radio...) Vunipola's absence makes a very big challenge even harder to overcome.

Maybe the younger generation in general have little interest in the Lions?


So the other alternative is for Billy Vunipola to have an operation and to not work for his employers for the last few months of the season yet go on tour with another team during the Summer.

Would you be happy if the Scarlets had done that with Ken, Foxy or Sanjay?

My point is more to do with the way things have changed over time.

In the amateur era, if a player was carrying an injury and stood a good chance of being a Lion, he could tell his club to go and get stuffed if they wanted him to play on and risk aggravating the injury. Nowadays, with the club paying (most of) the player's salary, there is an implicit pressure - and may be explicit, for all I know - for the player to carry on through the pain. (Gareth Edwards used to take some flak from Cardiff fans for often missing their games - he was always fit for Wales and played 50 consecutive matches!) 

There is also the point that, IMO, if the injury is as bad as it seems, both Vunipola and Sarries were taking a risk in playing through the injury for so long. With any luck, and modern surgical techniques, no permanent damage will have been done. I'm not sure if it was wise to do it, though. Time will tell.

So, to sum up - this is a lament for changing values in the game. It's down to professionalism, which has its downsides as well as its benefits. I really do hope the Lions manage to win, regardless of withdrawals - but the odds have just lengthened significantly.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote roy munster Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 May 2017 at 6:19pm
Originally posted by KID A KID A wrote:

Originally posted by roy munster roy munster wrote:

Originally posted by KID A KID A wrote:

Originally posted by roy munster roy munster wrote:

haskell is an odd replacement, surely we need another specialist number 8


Who would you have called up?


Good question, Haskell seems more of an impact player ...Id rather a specialist number 8. Maybe Heaslip or barclay


I'm not sure Barclay is a specialist number 8 Roy.

Heaslip is injured.

hmm ok if heaslip is out then maybe even ben morgan?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ladram Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 May 2017 at 6:25pm
Originally posted by KID A KID A wrote:

Originally posted by aber-fan aber-fan wrote:

Originally posted by reesytheexile reesytheexile wrote:

All clubs do it .Players want to play and clubs want them to play, especially the big names.

We call it "nursing an injury " it sometimes gets nursed for months and ends up with an operation announcement usually close to the end of the season. It's normal. No cunning plan.


No, indeed. But it does mean that Vunipola now misses out on a chance to represent the Lions. Maybe he doesn't care? If he does - could he have persuaded the club to let him get treated earlier?

The point here is, the summer tour is not some Mickey Mouse national tour to give young players a chance to come through, but (in effect) a sort of world championship between (most of) the best of the NH against (most of) the best of the SH. And the Lions have only ever won once in NZ, in 1971. (Those were the days of setting the alarm for 3am and tuning in to the radio...) Vunipola's absence makes a very big challenge even harder to overcome.

Maybe the younger generation in general have little interest in the Lions?


So the other alternative is for Billy Vunipola to have an operation and to not work for his employers for the last few months of the season yet go on tour with another team during the Summer.

Would you be happy if the Scarlets had done that with Ken, Foxy or Sanjay?
30th june 1986- 30th june 2011.25 years roofing,i wouldn't call that dodgy.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ladram Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 May 2017 at 6:26pm
meant to add that pretty much sums up gatlands position.
30th june 1986- 30th june 2011.25 years roofing,i wouldn't call that dodgy.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote KID A Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 May 2017 at 6:59pm
Originally posted by roy munster roy munster wrote:

Originally posted by KID A KID A wrote:

Originally posted by roy munster roy munster wrote:

Originally posted by KID A KID A wrote:

Originally posted by roy munster roy munster wrote:

haskell is an odd replacement, surely we need another specialist number 8


Who would you have called up?


Good question, Haskell seems more of an impact player ...Id rather a specialist number 8. Maybe Heaslip or barclay


I'm not sure Barclay is a specialist number 8 Roy.

Heaslip is injured.


hmm ok if heaslip is out then maybe even ben morgan?


I think you're just naming number 8s now. Ben Morgan is never Lions quality as much as I like him.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Dai38 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 May 2017 at 7:20pm
Heaslip has played across the bach row and was 1st choice 7 last season. I feel he is a good choice, even if l do not rate him, a good squad choice neededfor a hard tour.
Be careful when you pick up the stick.........IT MAY BE THE WRONG END!!!!!!!!!!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote KID A Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 May 2017 at 7:57pm
Originally posted by Dai38 Dai38 wrote:

Heaslip has played across the bach row and was 1st choice 7 last season. I feel he is a good choice, even if l do not rate him, a good squad choice neededfor a hard tour.


He is injured.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Dai38 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 May 2017 at 8:06pm
Sorry i meant Haskell old age l fear
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