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totallybiasedscarlet View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote totallybiasedscarlet Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 March 2017 at 3:28pm
Originally posted by KID A KID A wrote:

I don't really understand the negativity Biggar get sometimes. He's a class 10.


IMHO he plays too deep and although much improved, the blinkers seem a perennial problem. To be honest it's a style issue. He has great character, guts and a prodigious boot. I just feel he has a very narrow game. Biggar and Doc Rob together are an awful combo. Rhys showed us again on Friday why he has the makings of a quality 10 for Wales and we all know about Sam D. I think we should go for those two and build a team around them, developing both of them simultaneously as competitors and understudy for the position. We know what we'll get with Biggar. Dependable. Determined. Competitor. Limited.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Why Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 March 2017 at 3:31pm
Originally posted by RedZep RedZep wrote:

Originally posted by KID A KID A wrote:

I don't really understand the negativity Biggar get sometimes. He's a class 10.


Can only speak for myself and of course it's just my opinion but I will try and quantify.

Wales scored just 8 x tries during the 6N, Biggar was involved in only one of those - a simple 1 up pass to Scott Williams who then made the telling pass that created the try. I believe the 10 should be the most creative player on the pitch, especially from 2nd/3rd etc phases and from broken play, where playing what's in front of you is so important. Biggar can't do that, he can't play heads-up.

For me he epitomises if you don't try anything then you can't do anything wrong. He doesn't make the mistakes that say a Priestland or Sam Davies will make because he doesn't try to create anything. I honestly feel this is why he has never had the same levels of criticism aimed at him as some of the other 10's to play for Wales. His individual skills are excellent - his kick and chase under the high ball is superb, his intercept v England was too, as is his goal kicking (but while 1/2p is in the side this is surplus to requirement). None of these skills led to a single try for Wales, though. Unfortunately rugby isn't an individual game - he's too much of an individual in a team sport for my liking.

He has missed many a tackle that would have saved tries, he butchered a simple 2 on 1 v France by delaying the pass too long (identical position to earlier in the day when Hogg put Seymour over for the try) and I haven't even mentioned his petulance yet. If he played rugby as well as he can moan at refs and gesticulate he'd be some player - bit more substance and less image, maybe.

Sexton, Ford, Russell and Farrell are streets ahead of him, imo.

he has been one is the biggest reasons why we have been so poor far last couple of years even in World Cup he was one dimensional all very good to have a good up and under and chase but as a ten you need more than that. He is poor in defence he kicks far to often to back threes who often run back at us with interest. he very good at pro 12 level but very poor at intl. His childish behvaviour is a disgraceful example to youngsters if my 10 year old behaved like him I would take him out of the game. Why he is protected by Welsh press I will never know Rhys got far more stick for a lot less the tens for the future of Wales should be from Davies Williams and Patchell.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote KID A Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 March 2017 at 5:23pm
Originally posted by RedZep RedZep wrote:

Originally posted by KID A KID A wrote:

I don't really understand the negativity Biggar get sometimes. He's a class 10.


Can only speak for myself and of course it's just my opinion but I will try and quantify.

Wales scored just 8 x tries during the 6N, Biggar was involved in only one of those - a simple 1 up pass to Scott Williams who then made the telling pass that created the try. I believe the 10 should be the most creative player on the pitch, especially from 2nd/3rd etc phases and from broken play, where playing what's in front of you is so important. Biggar can't do that, he can't play heads-up.

For me he epitomises if you don't try anything then you can't do anything wrong. He doesn't make the mistakes that say a Priestland or Sam Davies will make because he doesn't try to create anything. I honestly feel this is why he has never had the same levels of criticism aimed at him as some of the other 10's to play for Wales. His individual skills are excellent - his kick and chase under the high ball is superb, his intercept v England was too, as is his goal kicking (but while 1/2p is in the side this is surplus to requirement). None of these skills led to a single try for Wales, though. Unfortunately rugby isn't an individual game - he's too much of an individual in a team sport for my liking.

He has missed many a tackle that would have saved tries, he butchered a simple 2 on 1 v France by delaying the pass too long (identical position to earlier in the day when Hogg put Seymour over for the try) and I haven't even mentioned his petulance yet. If he played rugby as well as he can moan at refs and gesticulate he'd be some player - bit more substance and less image, maybe.

Sexton, Ford, Russell and Farrell are streets ahead of him, imo.


Thanks for clarifying. I can only say that I'd love the option of a 10 like Biggar at the Scarlets. Tries don't have to come from the 10. What he does is do alot of the simple stuff a 10 should do, and he does it well.

In my opinion, blaming the 10 is a very Welsh thing to do. In years gone by it was easier as the 10 was a far more pivotal playmaker. A quarterback. But these days I just don't see it applies as much. I'd love to knock an Ospreys player but I don't think Dan Biggar is worth knocking I'm afraid. Petulent yes. Rubbish no.

Criticising his defence, when Patchell is not one of the best defensive 10s in the league of 1st phase play - is also mystifying to me, and I'm a big Patchell fan.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote totallybiasedscarlet Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 March 2017 at 5:34pm
Originally posted by KID A KID A wrote:

Originally posted by RedZep RedZep wrote:

Originally posted by KID A KID A wrote:

I don't really understand the negativity Biggar get sometimes. He's a class 10.


Can only speak for myself and of course it's just my opinion but I will try and quantify.

Wales scored just 8 x tries during the 6N, Biggar was involved in only one of those - a simple 1 up pass to Scott Williams who then made the telling pass that created the try. I believe the 10 should be the most creative player on the pitch, especially from 2nd/3rd etc phases and from broken play, where playing what's in front of you is so important. Biggar can't do that, he can't play heads-up.

For me he epitomises if you don't try anything then you can't do anything wrong. He doesn't make the mistakes that say a Priestland or Sam Davies will make because he doesn't try to create anything. I honestly feel this is why he has never had the same levels of criticism aimed at him as some of the other 10's to play for Wales. His individual skills are excellent - his kick and chase under the high ball is superb, his intercept v England was too, as is his goal kicking (but while 1/2p is in the side this is surplus to requirement). None of these skills led to a single try for Wales, though. Unfortunately rugby isn't an individual game - he's too much of an individual in a team sport for my liking.

He has missed many a tackle that would have saved tries, he butchered a simple 2 on 1 v France by delaying the pass too long (identical position to earlier in the day when Hogg put Seymour over for the try) and I haven't even mentioned his petulance yet. If he played rugby as well as he can moan at refs and gesticulate he'd be some player - bit more substance and less image, maybe.

Sexton, Ford, Russell and Farrell are streets ahead of him, imo.


Thanks for clarifying. I can only say that I'd love the option of a 10 like Biggar at the Scarlets. Tries don't have to come from the 10. What he does is do alot of the simple stuff a 10 should do, and he does it well.

In my opinion, blaming the 10 is a very Welsh thing to do. In years gone by it was easier as the 10 was a far more pivotal playmaker. A quarterback. But these days I just don't see it applies as much. I'd love to knock an Ospreys player but I don't think Dan Biggar is worth knocking I'm afraid. Petulent yes. Rubbish no.

Criticising his defence, when Patchell is not one of the best defensive 10s in the league of 1st phase play - is also mystifying to me, and I'm a big Patchell fan.



Pawb a'i farn I guess. For me Biggar's defence is one of his strong points. I've got to say though I'm more than happy with the 10's we've got and if Biggar was available, I wouldn't take him over and above what we've got. Depends how you want to play the game I suppose and he just ain't what I'd be looking for.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Dafen Boy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 March 2017 at 5:55pm
Originally posted by RedZep RedZep wrote:

As much as I'm laughing uncontrollably about the O's result, I'd still love to see 2 x Welsh teams taking on 2 x Irish teams in the play-offs.

Munster vs Scarlets

Leinster vs Ospreys
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote RedZep Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 March 2017 at 3:07pm
Originally posted by KID A KID A wrote:

Originally posted by RedZep RedZep wrote:

Originally posted by KID A KID A wrote:

I don't really understand the negativity Biggar get sometimes. He's a class 10.


Can only speak for myself and of course it's just my opinion but I will try and quantify.

Wales scored just 8 x tries during the 6N, Biggar was involved in only one of those - a simple 1 up pass to Scott Williams who then made the telling pass that created the try. I believe the 10 should be the most creative player on the pitch, especially from 2nd/3rd etc phases and from broken play, where playing what's in front of you is so important. Biggar can't do that, he can't play heads-up.

For me he epitomises if you don't try anything then you can't do anything wrong. He doesn't make the mistakes that say a Priestland or Sam Davies will make because he doesn't try to create anything. I honestly feel this is why he has never had the same levels of criticism aimed at him as some of the other 10's to play for Wales. His individual skills are excellent - his kick and chase under the high ball is superb, his intercept v England was too, as is his goal kicking (but while 1/2p is in the side this is surplus to requirement). None of these skills led to a single try for Wales, though. Unfortunately rugby isn't an individual game - he's too much of an individual in a team sport for my liking.

He has missed many a tackle that would have saved tries, he butchered a simple 2 on 1 v France by delaying the pass too long (identical position to earlier in the day when Hogg put Seymour over for the try) and I haven't even mentioned his petulance yet. If he played rugby as well as he can moan at refs and gesticulate he'd be some player - bit more substance and less image, maybe.

Sexton, Ford, Russell and Farrell are streets ahead of him, imo.


Thanks for clarifying. I can only say that I'd love the option of a 10 like Biggar at the Scarlets. Tries don't have to come from the 10. What he does is do alot of the simple stuff a 10 should do, and he does it well.

In my opinion, blaming the 10 is a very Welsh thing to do. In years gone by it was easier as the 10 was a far more pivotal playmaker. A quarterback. But these days I just don't see it applies as much. I'd love to knock an Ospreys player but I don't think Dan Biggar is worth knocking I'm afraid. Petulent yes. Rubbish no.

Criticising his defence, when Patchell is not one of the best defensive 10s in the league of 1st phase play - is also mystifying to me, and I'm a big Patchell fan.


This certainly isn't an anti-Osprey sentiment, I hold a similar opinion when we've played Aled at 10 ourselves. And it's definitely not an ignorant "Wales are doing crap so let's blame the 10" rhetoric, just why I believe the 10 Wales have chosen isn't as great as many make out. I believe far more blame lies at the coaches' door for Wales performances than any individual player.

We'll have to disagree on how pivotal the 10 position is as well, I'm afraid, mate. The 4 x players I've named above prove to me on a regular basis, for club and country, just how key the 10 position remains. It's that critical to England that they pick two of them at the same time. Ireland without Sexton were completely rudderless, all creativity comes from him. The role and skills required have certainly changed over the years but firing a back line still begins with that first receiver.

I agree that what Biggar does he does very well. His kicking is world class - at goal, drop kicking and kicking from hand. It's the kick and chase for me that sums him up and why so many have the opinion of him as a "great" player. If he kicks the ball 10 times, on 8 or 9 occasions the full back catches and so be it. That happens many times in every game. On the 1 or 2 occasions he leaps salmon-like and gathers his own kick it looks heroic, instant national hero. (It's a great individual skill that requires a lot of courage and commitment, something else I'm not criticising him for). I'd personally rather have an outside half that will try 10 back moves that may come to nothing on 8 or 9 occasions, but will lead to crossing the try line once or twice. The kind of performance Patchell put in on Friday which led to a BP victory.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote KID A Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 March 2017 at 3:15pm
Agree about Sexton, I think he's a shoe in for Lions 10. But Ireland have one of the greatest innovative coaches in world rugby though. Wales don't. You only have to look at how Sam Davies has played in a Wales shirt to know that whoever is going to be 10 in this current Wales setup is going to have an incredibly difficult time.

Edited by KID A - 27 March 2017 at 3:15pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote RedZep Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 March 2017 at 3:34pm
Originally posted by KID A KID A wrote:

Agree about Sexton, I think he's a shoe in for Lions 10. But Ireland have one of the greatest innovative coaches in world rugby though. Wales don't. You only have to look at how Sam Davies has played in a Wales shirt to know that whoever is going to be 10 in this current Wales setup is going to have an incredibly difficult time.

Very fair point. It doesn't matter who you pick at 10 if the coaches don't allow them to express themselves, but I don't believe Biggar has the ability even if he was given that freedom. Glad we found common ground.
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