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Israel Folau

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote SA14 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 April 2019 at 9:33pm
Originally posted by SospanMawr SospanMawr wrote:

Originally posted by BlackwoodScarlet BlackwoodScarlet wrote:

Originally posted by ladram ladram wrote:

Originally posted by BlackwoodScarlet BlackwoodScarlet wrote:

Freedom of speech is dead

there's freedom of speech and being a ****

Still his right to say it though, then others can judge him
Exactly. He has been judged. He’s lost his job.
What’s your issue?


That’s slander Ladram.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote scarletsrules Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 April 2019 at 10:16pm
At the end of the day. Folau is an international rugby player. An inspiration to alot of younger fans and a role model. By allowing him to get away with this then its allowing youngsters to think it's okay to hate gay people. He is quick enough to accept the big cash which I'm sure he gets/got paid so he should accept the responsibility that being a professional rugby player also holds and that's being a role model and not being so stupid to state what he did knowing that it wasnt very professional. He is entitled to his opinion but why feel the need to broadcast it like he did . Not a very good professional sportsman and I'm glad Australian rugby have sacked him and shown that no person is bigger than the sport itself and what most in the sport believe for
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ladram Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 April 2019 at 10:35pm
Originally posted by SA14 SA14 wrote:

Originally posted by SospanMawr SospanMawr wrote:

Originally posted by BlackwoodScarlet BlackwoodScarlet wrote:

Originally posted by ladram ladram wrote:

Originally posted by BlackwoodScarlet BlackwoodScarlet wrote:

Freedom of speech is dead

there's freedom of speech and being a ****

Still his right to say it though, then others can judge him
Exactly. He has been judged. He’s lost his job.
What’s your issue?


That’s slander Ladram.
against whom?asterix the gaul?
30th june 1986- 30th june 2011.25 years roofing,i wouldn't call that dodgy.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote SA14 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 April 2019 at 10:37pm
Originally posted by ladram ladram wrote:

Originally posted by SA14 SA14 wrote:

Originally posted by SospanMawr SospanMawr wrote:

Originally posted by BlackwoodScarlet BlackwoodScarlet wrote:

Originally posted by ladram ladram wrote:

Originally posted by BlackwoodScarlet BlackwoodScarlet wrote:

Freedom of speech is dead

there's freedom of speech and being a ****

Still his right to say it though, then others can judge him
Exactly. He has been judged. He’s lost his job.
What’s your issue?


That’s slander Ladram.

against whom?asterix the gaul?


Yes. No need. If I said fatty Obelisk that’s true.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote BlackwoodScarlet Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 April 2019 at 8:45am
Point out the fact the media e,g Wales on line have been pushing this story every day , yet other stories i.e the labour MP where buried rather quickly
If it bleeds we can can kill it
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote dr_martinov Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 April 2019 at 9:27am
Don't think many have challenged his right to hold or speak those views, more that it is not acceptable for an employee of the ARU to be posting them and he was in breach of his contract. Seems as though he's chosen his faith over playing for the ARU, which is his decision and I respect even if I find his views unpleasant and my opinion is he should keep them to himself as they are offensive to a large number of people. Or he just wanted out of his contract to play League instead.

Funny thing with this is he's only 40 years out of date from his views being far more mainstream. Common belief is a curious thing. As is freedom of speech: some people seem to interpret this as a right to say whatever they wish without repercussion.

We should get Corbyn's view of Israel... That may help.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Wil Chips Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 April 2019 at 9:35am
Actually homosexuality was only legalized across Australia in the late 90's, so it's possibly considered a fairly new thing.

Thanks for the posts Dr. Spot on.






Edited by Wil Chips - 16 April 2019 at 9:36am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote dyniol53 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 April 2019 at 9:39am
Originally posted by dr_martinov dr_martinov wrote:

Don't think many have challenged his right to hold or speak those views, more that it is not acceptable for an employee of the ARU to be posting them and he was in breach of his contract. Seems as though he's chosen his faith over playing for the ARU, which is his decision and I respect even if I find his views unpleasant and my opinion is he should keep them to himself as they are offensive to a large number of people. Or he just wanted out of his contract to play League instead.

Funny thing with this is he's only 40 years out of date from his views being far more mainstream. Common belief is a curious thing. As is freedom of speech: some people seem to interpret this as a right to say whatever they wish without repercussion.

We should get Corbyn's view of Israel... That may help.


Great post. It's not a freedom of speech issue in this case because he signed a contract and breached the terms of that contract.

Another poster should beware that calling someone homophobic is a libellous slur, especially if unsubstantiated, as it is illegal to be homophobic in the UK.

It is interesting though that for years the Church's point of view on homosexuality was "you can have the thoughts and feelings but you can't act on them" don't lie with a man as you would a woman etc.

Now society is telling people with sincere religious view that "you can have those views, thoughts and feelings. You just can't express them" 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ladram Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 April 2019 at 9:45am
Originally posted by dyniol53 dyniol53 wrote:

Originally posted by dr_martinov dr_martinov wrote:

Don't think many have challenged his right to hold or speak those views, more that it is not acceptable for an employee of the ARU to be posting them and he was in breach of his contract. Seems as though he's chosen his faith over playing for the ARU, which is his decision and I respect even if I find his views unpleasant and my opinion is he should keep them to himself as they are offensive to a large number of people. Or he just wanted out of his contract to play League instead.

Funny thing with this is he's only 40 years out of date from his views being far more mainstream. Common belief is a curious thing. As is freedom of speech: some people seem to interpret this as a right to say whatever they wish without repercussion.

We should get Corbyn's view of Israel... That may help.


Great post. It's not a freedom of speech issue in this case because he signed a contract and breached the terms of that contract.

Another poster should beware that calling someone homophobic is a libellous slur, especially if unsubstantiated, as it is illegal to be homophobic in the UK.

It is interesting though that for years the Church's point of view on homosexuality was "you can have the thoughts and feelings but you can't act on them" don't lie with a man as you would a woman etc.

Now society is telling people with sincere religious view that "you can have those views, thoughts and feelings. You just can't express them" 
religion has a lot to answer for all over the world,always has and always will.
30th june 1986- 30th june 2011.25 years roofing,i wouldn't call that dodgy.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote dyniol53 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 April 2019 at 9:46am
Originally posted by scarletsrules scarletsrules wrote:

At the end of the day. Folau is an international rugby player. An inspiration to alot of younger fans and a role model. By allowing him to get away with this then its allowing youngsters to think it's okay to hate gay people. ... He is entitled to his opinion but why feel the need to broadcast it like he did . Not a very good professional sportsman and I'm glad Australian rugby have sacked him and shown that no person is bigger than the sport itself and what most in the sport believe for

It could also be said that the way it's been handled the rugby community has said to it's young followers that perfectly acceptable to abuse people who express religious views. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote dyniol53 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 April 2019 at 9:47am
Originally posted by ladram ladram wrote:

religion has a lot to answer for all over the world,always has and always will.

Understatement LOL
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Sosban bach Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 April 2019 at 10:53am
Originally posted by dyniol53 dyniol53 wrote:

Originally posted by scarletsrules scarletsrules wrote:

At the end of the day. Folau is an international rugby player. An inspiration to alot of younger fans and a role model. By allowing him to get away with this then its allowing youngsters to think it's okay to hate gay people. ... He is entitled to his opinion but why feel the need to broadcast it like he did . Not a very good professional sportsman and I'm glad Australian rugby have sacked him and shown that no person is bigger than the sport itself and what most in the sport believe for


It could also be said that the way it's been handled the rugby community has said to it's young followers that perfectly acceptable to abuse people who express religious views. 

Exactly, freedom of speech and what’s acceptable are large grey areas as what’s acceptable is pretty much subjective. Now we’ll have people taking the piss out of Christianity and will be fairly unlikely of any repercussions. Social media has a lot to answer for every [beep]er wants their voice heard no matter how offensive it is yet would they be like that face to face?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Rob o'r Bont Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 April 2019 at 11:06am
Originally posted by dyniol53 dyniol53 wrote:

Originally posted by scarletsrules scarletsrules wrote:

At the end of the day. Folau is an international rugby player. An inspiration to alot of younger fans and a role model. By allowing him to get away with this then its allowing youngsters to think it's okay to hate gay people. ... He is entitled to his opinion but why feel the need to broadcast it like he did . Not a very good professional sportsman and I'm glad Australian rugby have sacked him and shown that no person is bigger than the sport itself and what most in the sport believe for

It could also be said that the way it's been handled the rugby community has said to it's young followers that perfectly acceptable to abuse people who express religious views. 
No not really.

Falau has shown hostility towards gays for no other reason than that they are gay. In this country, it could potentially be reported as a hate crime - thats the message.  
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote GPR - Rochester Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 April 2019 at 11:12am
I would have thought that the Christian message in this day and age is tolerance. Tolerance of people's ideals, beliefs and sexuality. There can be no place surely for suggesting that certain members of your community are destined for Hell. Being an agnostic myself my first reaction is to laugh it off but of course that is not the way. 

Folau's case though is not about freedom of speech - it is about breach of contract.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote roy munster Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 April 2019 at 12:55pm
Originally posted by ladram ladram wrote:

Originally posted by dyniol53 dyniol53 wrote:

Originally posted by dr_martinov dr_martinov wrote:

Don't think many have challenged his right to hold or speak those views, more that it is not acceptable for an employee of the ARU to be posting them and he was in breach of his contract. Seems as though he's chosen his faith over playing for the ARU, which is his decision and I respect even if I find his views unpleasant and my opinion is he should keep them to himself as they are offensive to a large number of people. Or he just wanted out of his contract to play League instead.

Funny thing with this is he's only 40 years out of date from his views being far more mainstream. Common belief is a curious thing. As is freedom of speech: some people seem to interpret this as a right to say whatever they wish without repercussion.

We should get Corbyn's view of Israel... That may help.


Great post. It's not a freedom of speech issue in this case because he signed a contract and breached the terms of that contract.

Another poster should beware that calling someone homophobic is a libellous slur, especially if unsubstantiated, as it is illegal to be homophobic in the UK.

It is interesting though that for years the Church's point of view on homosexuality was "you can have the thoughts and feelings but you can't act on them" don't lie with a man as you would a woman etc.

Now society is telling people with sincere religious view that "you can have those views, thoughts and feelings. You just can't express them" 
religion has a lot to answer for all over the world,always has and always will.
It does have a lot to answer for. Then again dont all massive institutions? The parliaments the BBC the police ? etc There is always a level of corruption. 

But institutional discrimination against gay people is something the Church has wrestled with for decades. The fact same sex marriage is legal shows things have progressed though and thats a good thing. Without wishing to get too theological. Even if you take every word of the Bible literally, which I do not. The rare and vague parts that may or may not relate to gay relationships in the new testament are rare comments are certainly ambiguous and open to interpretation. The book says a great deal more about love being the greatest of all things as well as faith hope and charity and perhaps we should all focus on those words more.

But the Churches do also carry out a phenomenal amount of good work too , raises billions and feeds and clothes and of millions of the poorest sickest and most vulnerable people across the world. Sadly all the vast amounts of good work gets lost in the bad stories. In the age of the internet surely instead of endlessly butting heads over these issues , surely the Church can be utilised better by the masses to fight against poverty and disease.  Even by atheists, agnostics and so on. 

I think the fall of Notre Dame will really hit home how sometimes we take these magnificent places for granted. Certainly in Llanelli many beautiful Churches have fallen into rack and ruin. What a waste. We're talking about an 850 year old masterpiece that took two centuries to build. To think of the numbers of people that place has inspired? How many have visited, how many have prayed and sang there, how many have married there , have been Christened there or have been buried there in all those centuries? How much art has been hung there? How much art has it inspired in the city of love? How has it inspired the rest of parisians architecture ? These cathedrals are magnificent inspiring places. The more inclusive the Church is the better. The more everyone feels a part of it and the more it can be utilised for a common good. I notice millions are already pouring in to help rebuild Notre Dame. Clap
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote SA14 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 April 2019 at 1:07pm
Originally posted by roy munster roy munster wrote:

Originally posted by ladram ladram wrote:

Originally posted by dyniol53 dyniol53 wrote:

Originally posted by dr_martinov dr_martinov wrote:

Don't think many have challenged his right to hold or speak those views, more that it is not acceptable for an employee of the ARU to be posting them and he was in breach of his contract. Seems as though he's chosen his faith over playing for the ARU, which is his decision and I respect even if I find his views unpleasant and my opinion is he should keep them to himself as they are offensive to a large number of people. Or he just wanted out of his contract to play League instead.

Funny thing with this is he's only 40 years out of date from his views being far more mainstream. Common belief is a curious thing. As is freedom of speech: some people seem to interpret this as a right to say whatever they wish without repercussion.

We should get Corbyn's view of Israel... That may help.



Great post. It's not a freedom of speech issue in this case because he signed a contract and breached the terms of that contract.

Another poster should beware that calling someone homophobic is a libellous slur, especially if unsubstantiated, as it is illegal to be homophobic in the UK.

It is interesting though that for years the Church's point of view on homosexuality was "you can have the thoughts and feelings but you can't act on them" don't lie with a man as you would a woman etc.

Now society is telling people with sincere religious view that "you can have those views, thoughts and feelings. You just can't express them" 

religion has a lot to answer for all over the world,always has and always will.

It does have a lot to answer for. Then again dont all massive institutions? The parliaments the BBC the police ? etc There is always a level of corruption. 

But institutional discrimination against gay people is something the Church has wrestled with for decades. The fact same sex marriage is legal shows things have progressed though and thats a good thing. Without wishing to get too theological. Even if you take every word of the Bible literally, which I do not. The rare and vague parts that may or may not relate to gay relationships in the new testament are rare comments are certainly ambiguous and open to interpretation. The book says a great deal more about love being the greatest of all things as well as faith hope and charity and perhaps we should all focus on those words more.

But the Churches do also carry out a phenomenal amount of good work too , raises billions and feeds and clothes and of millions of the poorest sickest and most vulnerable people across the world. Sadly all the vast amounts of good work gets lost in the bad stories. In the age of the internet surely instead of endlessly butting heads over these issues , surely the Church can be utilised better by the masses to fight against poverty and disease.  Even by atheists, agnostics and so on. 

I think the fall of Notre Dame will really hit home how sometimes we take these magnificent places for granted. Certainly in Llanelli many beautiful Churches have fallen into rack and ruin. What a waste. We're talking about an 850 year old masterpiece that took two centuries to build. To think of the numbers of people that place has inspired? How many have visited, how many have prayed and sang there, how many have married there , have been Christened there or have been buried there in all those centuries? How much art has been hung there? How much art has it inspired in the city of love? How has it inspired the rest of parisians architecture ? These cathedrals are magnificent inspiring places. The more inclusive the Church is the better. The more everyone feels a part of it and the more it can be utilised for a common good. I notice millions are already pouring in to help rebuild Notre Dame. Clap


Whilst many more worthy causes go without money. But that’s another debate.
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