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Johnny ponders Wales eligibility

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote GPR - Rochester Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 June 2018 at 8:22am
Originally posted by Craca Hyll Craca Hyll wrote:

Liam already has 48 caps. He needs 12 caps over 2 years to become exempt. Wales will play a minimum of 22 games by the time his contract comes to an end. He'll be fine as long as he stays healthy.

I wouldn't be too sure on that score. On this season's form Liam will be lucky to go to the World Cup. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote aber-fan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 June 2018 at 9:08am
Originally posted by GPR - Rochester GPR - Rochester wrote:

Originally posted by Craca Hyll Craca Hyll wrote:

Liam already has 48 caps. He needs 12 caps over 2 years to become exempt. Wales will play a minimum of 22 games by the time his contract comes to an end. He'll be fine as long as he stays healthy.

I wouldn't be too sure on that score. On this season's form Liam will be lucky to go to the World Cup. 

Liam's form has taken a dip since he left the Scarlets... it's happened to others before now. Competition for back 3 places is pretty fierce, with 1/2p, North, Steff, Amos and Josh Adams all playing very well... I sort of think Liam will get his mojo back and make the trip, but it's too early to say.
“You cannot reason a man out of what he never reasoned himself into.” (Jonathan Swift)
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Fscarlet Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 June 2018 at 9:13am
In all seriousness, we (the Welsh rugby public) have heavily critised Gatland & co for picking the same old 23 (barring injuries) for so long which means we have no strength in depth. However fair play to him, & the management team, for being bold this tour as a lot of what one might class as fringe players have really stepped up & I don't think I would be wrong to say it has been a long time since we have had this level of quality in the Welsh squad & those who aren't selected.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote aber-fan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 June 2018 at 9:23am
Originally posted by Fscarlet Fscarlet wrote:

In all seriousness, we (the Welsh rugby public) have heavily critised Gatland & co for picking the same old 23 (barring injuries) for so long which means we have no strength in depth. However fair play to him, & the management team, for being bold this tour as a lot of what one might class as fringe players have really stepped up & I don't think I would be wrong to say it has been a long time since we have had this level of quality in the Welsh squad & those who aren't selected.

True - too often in the past, the coaches have selected the same old faces, even for tests which are 'friendlies' as opposed to being 6N... for once, they went with young, hungry players who have repaid their faith in spades. Gatland has some serious depth after this tour.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Fscarlet Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 June 2018 at 9:29am
Originally posted by aber-fan aber-fan wrote:

Originally posted by Fscarlet Fscarlet wrote:

In all seriousness, we (the Welsh rugby public) have heavily critised Gatland & co for picking the same old 23 (barring injuries) for so long which means we have no strength in depth. However fair play to him, & the management team, for being bold this tour as a lot of what one might class as fringe players have really stepped up & I don't think I would be wrong to say it has been a long time since we have had this level of quality in the Welsh squad & those who aren't selected.

True - too often in the past, the coaches have selected the same old faces, even for tests which are 'friendlies' as opposed to being 6N... for once, they went with young, hungry players who have repaid their faith in spades. Gatland has some serious depth after this tour.


Agreed & lets be honest when you look at a full strength England side have been average at best in South Africa, Gatland must be very happy right now.

He is going to have massive selection headaches, not only in the back row but also the back 3 for me... it isn't inconceivable that we could have a back three in the RWC or 6 Nations North or Sanjay - who would have thought it?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote GPR - Rochester Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 June 2018 at 9:39am
Originally posted by Fscarlet Fscarlet wrote:

Originally posted by aber-fan aber-fan wrote:

Originally posted by Fscarlet Fscarlet wrote:

In all seriousness, we (the Welsh rugby public) have heavily critised Gatland & co for picking the same old 23 (barring injuries) for so long which means we have no strength in depth. However fair play to him, & the management team, for being bold this tour as a lot of what one might class as fringe players have really stepped up & I don't think I would be wrong to say it has been a long time since we have had this level of quality in the Welsh squad & those who aren't selected.

True - too often in the past, the coaches have selected the same old faces, even for tests which are 'friendlies' as opposed to being 6N... for once, they went with young, hungry players who have repaid their faith in spades. Gatland has some serious depth after this tour.


Agreed & lets be honest when you look at a full strength England side have been average at best in South Africa, Gatland must be very happy right now.

He is going to have massive selection headaches, not only in the back row but also the back 3 for me... it isn't inconceivable that we could have a back three in the RWC or 6 Nations North or Sanjay - who would have thought it?

Yes we have criticised Gatland for his selections but that criticism was correct. He has now proven how wrong he was previously by his bold selections for this tour. Well done on that tho. England's situation is interesting. Jones complains of having 25 players unavailable but he is trying to make excuses. The 15 starting Saturday would only have changed by about 3 with everyone fit - Dan Coles at 3, Underhill at 7 & Joseph at 13. The team are rudderless; Farrell is no captain, they do not have a genuine 7 in the country; the breakdown work is poor; their discipline is non existent. Mako Vunipola should have been binned for a mindless shove in the face and Hughes's yellow card at the end for a blatant foul in front of the ref was the height of stupidity. 

Jones is a dead man walking at the moment who doesn't have any answers. I have said it before I will be surprised of he makes the World Cup.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Fscarlet Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 June 2018 at 9:47am
Originally posted by GPR - Rochester GPR - Rochester wrote:


Yes we have criticised Gatland for his selections but that criticism was correct. He has now proven how wrong he was previously by his bold selections for this tour. Well done on that tho. England's situation is interesting. Jones complains of having 25 players unavailable but he is trying to make excuses. The 15 starting Saturday would only have changed by about 3 with everyone fit - Dan Coles at 3, Underhill at 7 & Joseph at 13. The team are rudderless; Farrell is no captain, they do not have a genuine 7 in the country; the breakdown work is poor; their discipline is non existent. Mako Vunipola should have been binned for a mindless shove in the face and Hughes's yellow card at the end for a blatant foul in front of the ref was the height of stupidity. 

Jones is a dead man walking at the moment who doesn't have any answers. I have said it before I will be surprised of he makes the World Cup.


Add to that Itoje's continued indiscipline, in particular where he kicked out at Faf De Klerk (who I felt has been outstanding for the Boks this summer!).

ETA: You're right, the criticism of Gatland has been warranted, but I will say this for the man, he does seem to get Wales to peak at the right time for the RWC.


Edited by Fscarlet - 18 June 2018 at 9:48am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote GPR - Rochester Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 June 2018 at 10:32am
Originally posted by Fscarlet Fscarlet wrote:

Originally posted by GPR - Rochester GPR - Rochester wrote:


Yes we have criticised Gatland for his selections but that criticism was correct. He has now proven how wrong he was previously by his bold selections for this tour. Well done on that tho. England's situation is interesting. Jones complains of having 25 players unavailable but he is trying to make excuses. The 15 starting Saturday would only have changed by about 3 with everyone fit - Dan Coles at 3, Underhill at 7 & Joseph at 13. The team are rudderless; Farrell is no captain, they do not have a genuine 7 in the country; the breakdown work is poor; their discipline is non existent. Mako Vunipola should have been binned for a mindless shove in the face and Hughes's yellow card at the end for a blatant foul in front of the ref was the height of stupidity. 

Jones is a dead man walking at the moment who doesn't have any answers. I have said it before I will be surprised of he makes the World Cup.


Add to that Itoje's continued indiscipline, in particular where he kicked out at Faf De Klerk (who I felt has been outstanding for the Boks this summer!).

ETA: You're right, the criticism of Gatland has been warranted, but I will say this for the man, he does seem to get Wales to peak at the right time for the RWC.

Yes Fscarlet you are right about Itoje. You are also spot on with Gatland and his World Cup preparations. I am going to be very interested to see how he deals with the big issues of the back row make up, no 10 who plays & the back 3. I still have this nagging doubt that he will revert to type & conservatism when push comes to shove. Cubby has surely shown that he is the 7 Wales need if they want to play an expansive gameplan. No other 7 combines his pace, handling, offloading & breakdown skills. Likewise Rhys's performances should have ended any speculation about the best 10 in Wales. His back 3 selections are now enviable so hopefully he will select on form at the time. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Fscarlet Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 June 2018 at 10:36am
Originally posted by GPR - Rochester GPR - Rochester wrote:


Yes Fscarlet you are right about Itoje. You are also spot on with Gatland and his World Cup preparations. I am going to be very interested to see how he deals with the big issues of the back row make up, no 10 who plays & the back 3. I still have this nagging doubt that he will revert to type & conservatism when push comes to shove. Cubby has surely shown that he is the 7 Wales need if they want to play an expansive gameplan. No other 7 combines his pace, handling, offloading & breakdown skills. Likewise Rhys's performances should have ended any speculation about the best 10 in Wales. His back 3 selections are now enviable so hopefully he will select on form at the time. 


Itoje really seems to have gone backward, certainly for England, in the last year or so...

I was very, very happy with the way that Cubby & Jenkins worked in tandem on the weekend & agree with you that he has to be the 7 for that style of game.

FWIW even the WoL have said that Patchell should now be the starting 10 & we know how much they love Biggar,
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Haruki Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 June 2018 at 12:13pm
Originally posted by GPR - Rochester GPR - Rochester wrote:

Originally posted by Fscarlet Fscarlet wrote:

Originally posted by GPR - Rochester GPR - Rochester wrote:


Yes we have criticised Gatland for his selections but that criticism was correct. He has now proven how wrong he was previously by his bold selections for this tour. Well done on that tho. England's situation is interesting. Jones complains of having 25 players unavailable but he is trying to make excuses. The 15 starting Saturday would only have changed by about 3 with everyone fit - Dan Coles at 3, Underhill at 7 & Joseph at 13. The team are rudderless; Farrell is no captain, they do not have a genuine 7 in the country; the breakdown work is poor; their discipline is non existent. Mako Vunipola should have been binned for a mindless shove in the face and Hughes's yellow card at the end for a blatant foul in front of the ref was the height of stupidity. 

Jones is a dead man walking at the moment who doesn't have any answers. I have said it before I will be surprised of he makes the World Cup.


Add to that Itoje's continued indiscipline, in particular where he kicked out at Faf De Klerk (who I felt has been outstanding for the Boks this summer!).

ETA: You're right, the criticism of Gatland has been warranted, but I will say this for the man, he does seem to get Wales to peak at the right time for the RWC.

Yes Fscarlet you are right about Itoje. You are also spot on with Gatland and his World Cup preparations. I am going to be very interested to see how he deals with the big issues of the back row make up, no 10 who plays & the back 3. I still have this nagging doubt that he will revert to type & conservatism when push comes to shove. Cubby has surely shown that he is the 7 Wales need if they want to play an expansive gameplan. No other 7 combines his pace, handling, offloading & breakdown skills. Likewise Rhys's performances should have ended any speculation about the best 10 in Wales. His back 3 selections are now enviable so hopefully he will select on form at the time. 

I think it will be a straight shoot out between Cubby and Tips to make the WC squad. I don't think Wales can carry more than 1 player who can only play at 7, especially seeing as some of his options at 6 can also play 7. Assuming that there are 5 back row slots available then Faletau, Moriarity and Warburton are dead certs (as long as Sam comes back at the same level post injury). That leave Tips v Cubby for the seven specialist slot and Ellis Jenkins v Navidi v Shingler for the last slot. Ellis looks like he has his nose infront at the moment in that fight.

number 10 is horses for courses between Patch and Bigger. I think they are now the clear two as Anscombe has lost ground on the summer tour. Gats will probably go Patch in the open games against lesser opposition and revert to the safety approach of Bigger in the tight games
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote SA14 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 June 2018 at 4:43pm
Originally posted by Fscarlet Fscarlet wrote:

In all seriousness, we (the Welsh rugby public) have heavily critised Gatland & co for picking the same old 23 (barring injuries) for so long which means we have no strength in depth. However fair play to him, & the management team, for being bold this tour as a lot of what one might class as fringe players have really stepped up & I don't think I would be wrong to say it has been a long time since we have had this level of quality in the Welsh squad & those who aren't selected.


Wait until we lose a game. He’ll be public enemy number one again. The welsh public are very fickle. 3 wins and he’s great.
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