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WRU DISGRACE TO RUGBY UNION

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Forum Name: GENERAL RUGBY
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Topic: WRU DISGRACE TO RUGBY UNION
Posted By: salmidach
Subject: WRU DISGRACE TO RUGBY UNION
Date Posted: 25 November 2006 at 5:11pm

THE WRU have brought disgrace to the game of rugby today by not allowing the haka to be performed last...

every true fan in rugby knows the meaning of the haka and every true fan wants to see it. i hope the all blacks smash us into oblivion for what i cosider to be a massive insult....



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They say a little knowledge is a dangerous thing, but it's not one half so bad as a lot of ignorance - Terry Pratchett



Replies:
Posted By: alibongo
Date Posted: 25 November 2006 at 6:09pm
Originally posted by salmidach salmidach wrote:

THE WRU have brought disgrace to the game of rugby today by not allowing the haka to be performed last...

every true fan in rugby knows the meaning of the haka and every true fan wants to see it. i hope the all blacks smash us into oblivion for what i cosider to be a massive insult....

C'mon Sal, why would you want your country to lose because of some old farts decisions??????? If that were the case then we'd be supporting the opposition in most games......



Posted By: Speedy
Date Posted: 25 November 2006 at 6:51pm
well thats the joke part of the season over with. now lets get back to business. to a place where both sides are reffed with the same rules at the break down. not making excuses. but nz constantly lay on our ball/wrong side. fair play they played the ref. but they don`t need to , their good enough. i find the whole international experience infuriating. thank god the scarlets will offer me some excitement and plenty of it this month.

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Posted By: mc scarlet
Date Posted: 25 November 2006 at 6:53pm

WRU = DISSGRACE

As for game not even in same lg, NZ GOT there own every1 eles just got to ain @



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Are you the real radio renegade!?


Posted By: alibongo
Date Posted: 25 November 2006 at 6:55pm
Agree 100% Speedy


Posted By: SA14
Date Posted: 25 November 2006 at 6:58pm

totally agree (apart from the last bit lol) i've purpously watched the beginning of matches in the past just to see the haka and turned off not long after. the crowd showed how they felt and brian moore knocked the nail on the head when he said every supporter there would rather see the haka.

how bout this for a haka(s)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XGfxyxSllAA - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XGfxyxSllAA  



Posted By: mc scarlet
Date Posted: 25 November 2006 at 7:01pm

well i hope thousands contact wru claiming money back i know loads who just picked nz game over az game because they wanted to see haka.

dissgrace sack whoever is responceable



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Are you the real radio renegade!?


Posted By: Chesswithdeath
Date Posted: 25 November 2006 at 7:05pm
Originally posted by salmidach salmidach wrote:

THE WRU have brought disgrace to the game of rugby today by not allowing the haka to be performed last...

every true fan in rugby knows the meaning of the haka and every true fan wants to see it. i hope the all blacks smash us into oblivion for what i cosider to be a massive insult....



The Panto season's here, who needs the Haka?

...he's behind you!


Posted By: Guests
Date Posted: 25 November 2006 at 8:27pm

The Haka (respect it or not) is an integral part of the whole atmosphere surrounding an All Blacks appearance, opposition supporters expect it as it adds to the whole occasion. Dare I day it but players probably enjoy the challenge of facing it as they know they've "arrived", it also gives both sides an extra wind up as opposed to intimidating. Having had the pleasure of witnessing it three times down Stradey (and hopefully the opening game of the new gaff) I can honestly say it's an awesome sight and everyone should have the pleasure of seeing it in person at least once in their lifetime. If this was some sort of retort to that NZ journo t##t then it backfired big time, Henry had the good grace to call that journo a village idiot, the wru should have let it drop (if it is indeed the reason). Massive disrespect to the visitors and it probably wound them up even more!

Some genuine rugby fans paid big money to be part of that today, (forget the "occasion" crowd who doubled it with xmas shopping) they deserved the full spectacle.

 



Posted By: Guests
Date Posted: 25 November 2006 at 8:37pm
get over it boys, it doesn't really matter, in the grand scheme of things


Posted By: Musical Glove
Date Posted: 25 November 2006 at 8:38pm

It's the timing of the Haka that was in question.

The WRU didn't want it right before kick off, as they are pumped going into the game, they requested it be done before the anthems, but they didn't like that idea. Nobody banned them from doing the Haka, it was their choice not to do it.



Posted By: alibongo
Date Posted: 25 November 2006 at 8:42pm
I suspect a little mind games that back-fired quite badly today to be honest. Oh well, roll on the six nations!!!!!!!!!


Posted By: Guests
Date Posted: 25 November 2006 at 8:43pm

well done musical youth, you truly are the voice of reason.

do you fancy coming fishing with me?



Posted By: mc scarlet
Date Posted: 25 November 2006 at 8:44pm
totaly dissagree
Originally posted by rap columbo rap columbo wrote:

get over it boys, it doesn't really matter, in the grand scheme of things


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Are you the real radio renegade!?


Posted By: Musical Glove
Date Posted: 25 November 2006 at 8:44pm

Yes thats right, like last year when they tried to lower a giant welsh flag during the the Haka and it didn't open, just hung there, and the kickoff was late.

Comical



Posted By: Guests
Date Posted: 25 November 2006 at 8:47pm

ah, mc scarlet i see a pattern developing, you still can't spell disagree!



Posted By: Musical Glove
Date Posted: 25 November 2006 at 8:49pm
I also disagee or dissagree or smoething ?Wink


Posted By: Guests
Date Posted: 25 November 2006 at 8:53pm
mussical glovve, i'dd likke too welcomme youu too thiis forrum


Posted By: Musical Glove
Date Posted: 25 November 2006 at 8:53pm

http://www.petelea.co.uk/b3ta/cheesy-peas.jpg - http://www.petelea.co.uk/b3ta/cheesy-peas.jpg

 



Posted By: John
Date Posted: 25 November 2006 at 8:56pm

I've just got back and I'm well pissed off. Not so much with the lack of the Haka (although thats another of Rugby's traditions and mystiques gone ) but that the WRU couldnt be effed to tell us that it wasnt happening.

Its symptomatic of the way the WRU treat us the paying public. "Just take the £45 and treat them like ****" is the sign that hangs on the back of Pickering's door. 



Posted By: Guests
Date Posted: 25 November 2006 at 8:58pm
i love cheezy peaz, but now they've got cheezy sqeezy peaz, it's on a whole new level


Posted By: Haggis
Date Posted: 25 November 2006 at 9:03pm

I feel sorry for those people at the Millenium Stadium today, the millions at home watching on TV (a lot of whom need converting to our beautiful game), and for all Kiwis around the world.

The Haka is one of the great spectacles of world sport, let alone of rugby. Today is a very sad day, and whoever is responsible for that debacle should be hung out to dry.



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Haggis


Posted By: NickiF
Date Posted: 25 November 2006 at 9:35pm

 

Its a real shame they didnt do it as has already been said its a tradition that should continue. Whoever made the decision to pull it has been left looking like a t^*t.

 



Posted By: Speedy
Date Posted: 25 November 2006 at 9:54pm

i don`t understand why the wru didn`t just say to the all black, ok, do it after the anthems, then once they`d finished,WE GIVE THEM A RENDITION OF BREAD OF HEAVEN, WITH THE PLAYERS JOINING IN STARING STRAIGHT AT THEM!!!!!#

its our home game, they could have let nz think they would be last. they can`t kick off till both teams are ready. look what scotland did to england a few years ago!!!!



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Posted By: salmidach
Date Posted: 25 November 2006 at 10:16pm

The Haka is performed always before the kick off of the match it is meant to be a challenge to fellow warriors to come to the battlefield and stand like men and face your foe, toe to toe.....

FFS, "lets move on get over it.." what bull5h1t..... the haka is as traditional as the anthems and for some kn0b in a blazer to decide they didn't want it before K.O. incase it winds them up to a frenzy is absolutely disgusting.. I just hope Gareth Jenkins wasn't involved in this decision, if he was then he should hang his head in shame..

it just goes to show rap columbo and musical glove how little you know about rugby really.......



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They say a little knowledge is a dangerous thing, but it's not one half so bad as a lot of ignorance - Terry Pratchett


Posted By: Guests
Date Posted: 25 November 2006 at 10:35pm

you are indeed a sanctimonious i am not a maori or a new zealander.

i know enough about rugby, my friend



Posted By: Alun
Date Posted: 25 November 2006 at 11:17pm
Well I am disgraced there was no Haka!!! I was in the stadium... On the LCD dispalays before the game (Little score ones) It kept saying something about the Haka. Now the Haka is one of Rugby's greatest traditions and I was really excited and looking forward to see the Haka as this was my first time ever seeing The All Blacks play. Now, whoever it may be that was responsible for this decision should be put in front of a firing squad!

I might just try and claim money back because I was gutted and so were about 74,000 others in the stadium and Millions watching around the world!!
And then they have the cheeck to show a 10 second clip of them doing it in the changing rooms!!!

You watch, WRU will be up with the excuse of - "Oh, It was in respect to Keith Rowlands"!

You watch...

Discraced.


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Cartref newydd, Stadiwm newydd, Penod newydd, Yr un freuddwyd.

"Does na unman yn debyg i adra, ond mae adra'n debyg iawn i 'chdi."

All statements-My opinions


Posted By: westwalesdragon
Date Posted: 25 November 2006 at 11:44pm

Very very disappointing.

Why oh why do we insist on stupid mind games? They always backfire, especially v NZ. Cant we just go out and play them. Whatever mindgames were played, our boys looked scared to run at the men in black, we were never going to win with the mind frame they seemed to take into the match.



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WestWalesDragon



Posted By: salmidach
Date Posted: 26 November 2006 at 12:12am
Originally posted by rap columbo rap columbo wrote:

you are indeed a sanctimonious i am not a maori or a new zealander.

i know enough about rugby, my friend

then you would know how traditional the Haka is and how important it is to rugby union and what a disgrace the WRU have become to be boringly predictable in being absolute morons in stopping NZ from doing the Haka....

Sanctimonious I may be, but correct I AM... as you and Musical Glove are the only ones to disagree..........



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They say a little knowledge is a dangerous thing, but it's not one half so bad as a lot of ignorance - Terry Pratchett


Posted By: Speedy
Date Posted: 26 November 2006 at 9:40am

i thought the wru`s favourite phrase in these situations was "lets all move on, we need to all move on together!"

 



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Posted By: Speedy
Date Posted: 26 November 2006 at 9:43am

hey sal what did you think of the all blacks tactics at scrum time? i thought after engage, you had to hold your shove until the ball was in. or in nz`s case, their tug!

i have watched many a wales hammering. but that was pure frustration, because not only were we beaten by the better team. we had official frothing at the slit just being on the same turf as the ab`s.



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Posted By: Abbey
Date Posted: 26 November 2006 at 11:03am

This really is an ill-informed thread. Yes, I totally agree that anyone who was at the game would have been disappointed to not see the Haka - but to say that people only bought their tickets for it? Well, if that's all they wanted then good enough that they were disappointed.

Let's get some truth here. It was the NZRFU who sulked at not being allowed the last word. This is a professional sport and the Haka has no place in it just before kick off. Let the All Blacks come out 15 minutes before kick off and do it. They demanded that the Haka be the last act and that there would be nothing after it.

Just stop and think about the NZRFU's arrogant stance. What they are saying is:

"We are going to motivate and psyche up our players. You MUST stand and watch and you are not allowed to respond". 

And this in a professional sport? I'd love to see this thread if the English RFU had made a similar demand!!!

 



Posted By: John
Date Posted: 26 November 2006 at 11:15am
Originally posted by Abbey Abbey wrote:

This really is an ill-informed thread. Yes, I totally agree that anyone who was at the game would have been disappointed to not see the Haka - but to say that people only bought their tickets for it? Well, if that's all they wanted then good enough that they were disappointed.

Let's get some truth here. It was the NZRFU who sulked at not being allowed the last word. This is a professional sport and the Haka has no place in it just before kick off. Let the All Blacks come out 15 minutes before kick off and do it. They demanded that the Haka be the last act and that there would be nothing after it.

Just stop and think about the NZRFU's arrogant stance. What they are saying is:

"We are going to motivate and psyche up our players. You MUST stand and watch and you are not allowed to respond". 

And this in a professional sport? I'd love to see this thread if the English RFU had made a similar demand!!!

 

So dont tell anyone that its not happening.... Just put 10 seconds on the big screen of them doing it in the changing room. We pay good money to go to the match yet we're treated worse than anyone else. As I said originally, its not that it didnt happen that got to me, it was the lack of information.  

 



Posted By: salmidach
Date Posted: 26 November 2006 at 11:29am

Sorry Abbey you are so far off the mark it's shocking..

The haka has been peformed for eons, and at the same time as well, just before the K.O.

You claim the NZRFU sulked and threw their teddies out of the cot, but who the hell do the morons of the WRU think they are by demanding that the Haka be performed 15 minutes before the game starts,

so lets talk psychology here. Excuse me Mr NZ, we don't want you to perform the haka directly before K.O. because we believe it gives you an unanswerable edge, so we want you to do it 15 minutes before. Mr NZ says no goes back to it's players and tells them the WRU don't want them to perform their haka.. what's going to wind up the players more??????

sorry the actions of the WRU is disgraceful, not even the rfu would have gone that far and ask the NZ to perform the haka 15 minutes before K.O.

As i've already stated, the haka is a challenge to your enemy to take the field of battle and meet us toe to toe...... if i was a player i'd get wound up just as much as the AB's if the haka was performed in front of me.. it's not the case of unfair advantage, the WRU wanted the last word, they wanted our anthem to be the last thing played.....



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They say a little knowledge is a dangerous thing, but it's not one half so bad as a lot of ignorance - Terry Pratchett


Posted By: John
Date Posted: 26 November 2006 at 12:15pm
Just one thing that supportd the WRU stance. The first Haka at the 1905 match was before the National Anthems (probably just ours at the time), so there is a precedence but it is lost in the dim mists of time and the proper time for the Haka is just before KO.


Posted By: Scarletrover
Date Posted: 26 November 2006 at 12:17pm
Originally posted by salmidach salmidach wrote:

Sorry Abbey you are so far off the mark it's shocking..

The haka has been peformed for eons, and at the same time as well, just before the K.O.

You claim the NZRFU sulked and threw their teddies out of the cot, but who the hell do the morons of the WRU think they are by demanding that the Haka be performed 15 minutes before the game starts,

so lets talk psychology here. Excuse me Mr NZ, we don't want you to perform the haka directly before K.O. because we believe it gives you an unanswerable edge, so we want you to do it 15 minutes before. Mr NZ says no goes back to it's players and tells them the WRU don't want them to perform their haka.. what's going to wind up the players more??????

sorry the actions of the WRU is disgraceful, not even the rfu would have gone that far and ask the NZ to perform the haka 15 minutes before K.O.

As i've already stated, the haka is a challenge to your enemy to take the field of battle and meet us toe to toe...... if i was a player i'd get wound up just as much as the AB's if the haka was performed in front of me.. it's not the case of unfair advantage, the WRU wanted the last word, they wanted our anthem to be the last thing played.....

But they did'nt, they asked that it be done AFTER the NZ anthem, and before Hen Wlad fy Nhadau, not too unreasonable I think!

After all, Ireland sing BOTH their 'Anthems' together, and don't save 'Ireland's call' until the opposition have sung their anthem! 



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Posted By: SA14
Date Posted: 26 November 2006 at 12:47pm
Originally posted by salmidach salmidach wrote:

Sorry Abbey you are so far off the mark it's shocking..

The haka has been peformed for eons, and at the same time as well, just before the K.O.

You claim the NZRFU sulked and threw their teddies out of the cot, but who the hell do the morons of the WRU think they are by demanding that the Haka be performed 15 minutes before the game starts,

so lets talk psychology here. Excuse me Mr NZ, we don't want you to perform the haka directly before K.O. because we believe it gives you an unanswerable edge, so we want you to do it 15 minutes before. Mr NZ says no goes back to it's players and tells them the WRU don't want them to perform their haka.. what's going to wind up the players more??????

sorry the actions of the WRU is disgraceful, not even the rfu would have gone that far and ask the NZ to perform the haka 15 minutes before K.O.

As i've already stated, the haka is a challenge to your enemy to take the field of battle and meet us toe to toe...... if i was a player i'd get wound up just as much as the AB's if the haka was performed in front of me.. it's not the case of unfair advantage, the WRU wanted the last word, they wanted our anthem to be the last thing played.....

totally agree with this post. the haka to be done before kick off as it's always been done. how long does it take, two minutes? how long does it take to walk the bloody goat (or bull???) of the field?? (or still on it as happened in the past) anyway where was max boyce, our secret weapon?



Posted By: Matty
Date Posted: 26 November 2006 at 2:13pm
In the 1905 game , the All Blacks performed the haka and the Welsh crowd (who'd never seen anything similar before) promptly  replied by singing Hen Wlad Fy Nhadau. That's why we now sing national anthems before major sporting internationals - thats what I read recently.

I'm slightly confused as to what happened yesterday. It appeared that everyone on the pitch - Welsh players, ref, guy who set up the microphone ready fopr the haka - thought the haka would take place, as did the scoreboard which kept flashing the word 'haka'. But on the other hand there were TV crews who had filmed the haka in the changing rooms and both union issued statements very quickly. IT appears that a few people knew, but never bothered to tell anyone.

Talking to a kiwi after the match, he said that he'd been brought up to beleive that the haka was a challenge to the other team before the game and that a response was acceptable. Like when the south sea islanders perform their own war dance in response to the haka.

Its also interesting to note that the haka was not performed before every game until around the 1970s. Before that it was only performed on occasions - as a new zealand paper reported today.

All in all it looks like the whole thing was 6 of one and half a dozen of the other, but fear that the WRU are going to look worse out of it than the All Blacks. I mean who would you choose to beleive the All Blacks or the WRU?

Whatever happened it fired up the All Blacks, and although disappointed not to see the haka, I did witness some of the best rugby I have seen in my life. £45 to watch the game was worth it, despite the scoreline being against Wales.


Posted By: Abbey
Date Posted: 26 November 2006 at 3:57pm
Originally posted by salmidach salmidach wrote:

Sorry Abbey you are so far off the mark it's shocking..

The haka has been peformed for eons, and at the same time as well, just before the K.O.

You claim the NZRFU sulked and threw their teddies out of the cot, but who the hell do the morons of the WRU think they are by demanding that the Haka be performed 15 minutes before the game starts,

so lets talk psychology here. Excuse me Mr NZ, we don't want you to perform the haka directly before K.O. because we believe it gives you an unanswerable edge, so we want you to do it 15 minutes before. Mr NZ says no goes back to it's players and tells them the WRU don't want them to perform their haka.. what's going to wind up the players more??????

sorry the actions of the WRU is disgraceful, not even the rfu would have gone that far and ask the NZ to perform the haka 15 minutes before K.O.

As i've already stated, the haka is a challenge to your enemy to take the field of battle and meet us toe to toe...... if i was a player i'd get wound up just as much as the AB's if the haka was performed in front of me.. it's not the case of unfair advantage, the WRU wanted the last word, they wanted our anthem to be the last thing played.....

I don't give a stuff about tradition and I never said that the WRU asked for the Haka to be performed 15 minutes before - that was purely my suggestion.

Just take a short time to stop and think about the attitude of the NZRFU here to what I consider a fairly amicable request from the WRU. We were the host nation, so why should the NZRFU be allowed to dictate that the Haka not be answered? That is called arrogance.

It's not the Haka that I'm against (indeed, I agree that it is part of all NZ international games) - it is just the one sided demand that it be the very last part of the build up. It is akin to a child (or the wife!) having an argument and demanding they get the last word.

ScarletRover is totally right in pointing out that it only takes a minute or two and our anthem could have followed (or anything at all motivational). The NZRFU decreed that NOTHING follow. That, my friend, is arrogance. 



Posted By: yedarts
Date Posted: 26 November 2006 at 4:39pm
Originally posted by Abbey Abbey wrote:

This really is an ill-informed thread. Yes, I totally agree that anyone who was at the game would have been disappointed to not see the Haka - but to say that people only bought their tickets for it? Well, if that's all they wanted then good enough that they were disappointed.

Let's get some truth here. It was the NZRFU who sulked at not being allowed the last word. This is a professional sport and the Haka has no place in it just before kick off. Let the All Blacks come out 15 minutes before kick off and do it. They demanded that the Haka be the last act and that there would be nothing after it.

Just stop and think about the NZRFU's arrogant stance. What they are saying is:

"We are going to motivate and psyche up our players. You MUST stand and watch and you are not allowed to respond".

Agree.


Posted By: redeyes
Date Posted: 26 November 2006 at 5:07pm

it was nothing short of a monumental cock up by the wru. what the hell were they thinking?

For some clown to come up with that idea to stop the all blacks having some advantage is crazy.

The wru should hang their heads in shame.



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The stadium may change, but the dream will remain the same!




Posted By: Slider
Date Posted: 27 November 2006 at 10:39am
Originally posted by Abbey Abbey wrote:

I don't give a stuff about tradition and I never said that the WRU asked for the Haka to be performed 15 minutes before - that was purely my suggestion.

Just take a short time to stop and think about the attitude of the NZRFU here to what I consider a fairly amicable request from the WRU. We were the host nation, so why should the NZRFU be allowed to dictate that the Haka not be answered? That is called arrogance.

It's not the Haka that I'm against (indeed, I agree that it is part of all NZ international games) - it is just the one sided demand that it be the very last part of the build up. It is akin to a child (or the wife!) having an argument and demanding they get the last word.

ScarletRover is totally right in pointing out that it only takes a minute or two and our anthem could have followed (or anything at all motivational). The NZRFU decreed that NOTHING follow. That, my friend, is arrogance. 

Abbey, we've disagreed countless times on many issues.....but on this your are spot on. The WRU, for my money, are 100% in the clear on this. The AB's just need show us a little of this respect them keep banging on about. What they did was just throwing all their toy's out of the pram when they couldn't having things exactly as they wanted them. Pathetic.



Posted By: Slider
Date Posted: 27 November 2006 at 10:41am
Originally posted by redeyes redeyes wrote:

it was nothing short of a monumental cock up by the wru. what the hell were they thinking?

For some clown to come up with that idea to stop the all blacks having some advantage is crazy.

The wru should hang their heads in shame.

Rubbish. If the AB's were that offended by the WRU's request why did they chose to ignore the 6 weeks advance notice they received and make an issue of it on the day of the game?



Posted By: SA14
Date Posted: 27 November 2006 at 10:54am

why was it for this match the wru decided to change things? how many times have we played them in the past?

this is my favourite quote, "Coach Gareth Jenkins, who yesterday said he believes the haka gives the Kiwi players an edge, was consulted and supported the plan that his players should be able to respond to the Kiwi ritual by singing the anthem."

bet they would have been struggling if they didn't do it and if all () the players responded by their rousing response, we would have hammered them.

of course, if max boyce had been there singing, 'hymns and arias' in response, we would have walked it.



Posted By: westwalesdragon
Date Posted: 27 November 2006 at 11:18am

Exactly, if thats New Zealand without the this fantastic edge the Haka gives them god help us when they do it! GJ needs to get a grip if the Haka was at the top of his list in dealing with the AB's.

Maybe next time he can concentrate on what happens after the whistle blows to begin the game!



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WestWalesDragon



Posted By: Abbey
Date Posted: 27 November 2006 at 1:40pm
Originally posted by Quagmire Quagmire wrote:

why was it for this match the wru decided to change things? how many times have we played them in the past?

this is my favourite quote, "Coach Gareth Jenkins, who yesterday said he believes the haka gives the Kiwi players an edge, was consulted and supported the plan that his players should be able to respond to the Kiwi ritual by singing the anthem."

bet they would have been struggling if they didn't do it and if all () the players responded by their rousing response, we would have hammered them.

of course, if max boyce had been there singing, 'hymns and arias' in response, we would have walked it.

It wasn't a one-off. We changed it last year and the AB's demanded we show them respect and revert to the usual format this season. In other words, we have to agree to the NZRFU's terms or they sulk. As Slider says, respect goes both ways.

We apparently wrote to them on October 16th to tell them that the Welsh anthem would be after the Haka and they made no response until the morning of the game when they said they were offended. Offended because the host nation doesn't follow the demands of the mighty All Blacks?



Posted By: Slider
Date Posted: 27 November 2006 at 3:08pm

There's far too much of a culture of blaming the WRU in Wales as a whole. Anything goes wrong and we're all like sheep, all ranting and raving about how it's the WRU's fault instead of stopping and thinking the thing through for ourselves.

The WRU have made many mistakes in recent years.....but this is NOT THEIR FAULT!!!! If the AB's had acted like professionals and informed the WRU of their feelings ahead of the day then I'm sure something would have been worked out. As it was they said nothing.....then spat their dummy out. THEIR PROBLEM, THEIR FAULT!!



Posted By: Dai Baker
Date Posted: 27 November 2006 at 4:36pm

Honest to God this thread is amazing. The request was made by the WRU to New zealand in the middle of October for the order of the day to be New Zealand Anthem sung by Hayley Westenra followed by the Haka followed by the Welsh Anthem sung by Katherine Jenkins - for NZ to demand for thinbgs to be done as they wish is an arrogant and disrespectful to us as our request was to them.

What gives them the god given right to demand their own preference when they come to our country and stadium to play.

What would their response have been if we demanded to sing our anthem just before kick off if the game was in Auckland? I bet it would be a two word phrase with Off bveing the second word.

They sulked as well last year because after the Haka was performed that bloke with a beard came out from the crowd with his flag and sang Bread of Heaven (I think it was BoH but I could be wrong)

The majority on here are quick to lay into the WRU for this happening but we are talking a mater of 3 or 4 minutes difference hereand it was the NZRFU who threw their toys out of the pram because they weren't allowed to get away with whatever they want off the field as they are allowed (well Richie McCaw is allowed) to get away with whatever they want on the field!!! (Not a pop at them - they are brilliant in getting the ref on their side and they are applauded for it!)  



Posted By: Slider
Date Posted: 27 November 2006 at 4:45pm

Spot on.

....but expect the next 'Baaaaaaa' from the WRU bashers any second!!!!!!!



Posted By: DIXX
Date Posted: 27 November 2006 at 5:10pm

apparantly, we, as the host nation have the right to respond to the haka. BUT, we only have an anthem. its hardly a response imo. if the wru wanted to do something they should have done what the aussies did and gone on the tackle bags for 5mins after it.  last year it was done as it was a 100 years ago, but as GH said, that WAS a one off. Throughout the world for decades its been away anthem, home anthem, haka, kick off. with all the news on the haka in recent weeks with the disrespect it has from england, this appears far worse.

 the haka that was performed in the changing room was the most frightning ive ever seen. the haka is a tradition of the AB, its part of their anthem and should be respected. its the second half of their anthem for goodness sake. everyone wants to see it. rugby lost a special moment saturday. its fact, that  the haka is part of world rugby. its a special thing to them and we should respect it. have they ever asked anyone not to perform their anthems?! its disgraceful what happened.

thats the third time the AB's have played with no haka performed, but the other two was due to no maoris in the team. which was their decision to make.



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Parc y Scarlets - Where the Wild Roses Grow so Scarlet and Free


Posted By: Slider
Date Posted: 27 November 2006 at 5:18pm
There it goes............lol....................Baaaaaaaaaaaaa


Posted By: Dai Baker
Date Posted: 27 November 2006 at 5:42pm
Originally posted by DIXX DIXX wrote:

apparantly, we, as the host nation have the right to respond to the haka. BUT, we only have an anthem. its hardly a response imo. if the wru wanted to do something they should have done what the aussies did and gone on the tackle bags for 5mins after it.  last year it was done as it was a 100 years ago, but as GH said, that WAS a one off. Throughout the world for decades its been away anthem, home anthem, haka, kick off. with all the news on the haka in recent weeks with the disrespect it has from england, this appears far worse.

 the haka that was performed in the changing room was the most frightning ive ever seen. the haka is a tradition of the AB, its part of their anthem and should be respected. its the second half of their anthem for goodness sake. everyone wants to see it. rugby lost a special moment saturday. its fact, that  the haka is part of world rugby. its a special thing to them and we should respect it. have they ever asked anyone not to perform their anthems?! its disgraceful what happened.

thats the third time the AB's have played with no haka performed, but the other two was due to no maoris in the team. which was their decision to make.

You should consider becoming a psychic Slider - didnt take long for this response to arrive!!

Good god alive DIXX - the WRU did not refuse the permission to perform the haka - they asked them to perform it approximately 4 minutes before they wanted to!!

The WRU checked with the Maoris of New Zealand whether it was acceptable to respond to the challenge the Haka presents and were told that a response was perfectly acceptable and actively encouraged. 

It's amazing that it's the South Sea Islanders and non-Maoris of New Zealand that are complaining and throwing their toys out of the pram over the peforming of a MAORI ritual.

It's quite sad that the Haka has been turned by the world from a MAORI tradition to a RUGBY tradition.



Posted By: redeyes
Date Posted: 27 November 2006 at 6:13pm

Just for info the IRB seem to be siding with NZ and quite right as well.

One NZ journalist accuses wales of being the village idiots of world rugby only for the WRU to confirm it.



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The stadium may change, but the dream will remain the same!




Posted By: salmidach
Date Posted: 27 November 2006 at 7:02pm

100% correct.... redeyes

abbey you go on about the NZRFU throwing their teddies out of the cot, but what right have the WRU got to go against decades of tradition?

I remember going to watch us play NZ in 89 and even though the heavens had opened (although there wasn't any flooding in iscoed), the thing i was looking forward to the most was seeing NZ perform the Haka....



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They say a little knowledge is a dangerous thing, but it's not one half so bad as a lot of ignorance - Terry Pratchett


Posted By: ladram
Date Posted: 27 November 2006 at 7:42pm
the IRB have issued a statement that the haka will continue to be perfprmed after the anthems bearing in mind that it's not only NZ who do it ,fiji,tonga samoa also do a rendition,all in all the t****s who run the WRU need shooting,no sooner has the dust settled on ruddockgate and we get hakagate,as the nz reporter said on the news everyone is capable of shooting themselves in the foot but the wru blow their whole bloody leg off.


Posted By: DIXX
Date Posted: 27 November 2006 at 8:02pm
everyone has  ther own opinion on the matter. no point arguing with me on my opinion. i have enjoyed watching the haka being performed, i have always respected it, and am not the only one, why change what has been going on for decades? pointless. yes we can respond, but an anthem is not a response to a haka. tonga, fiji, etc., they have something in response. just my opinion, with many others across the world. no point shooting my opinion. christ its a public forum, everyone has there own opinion on the matter. mine is diferent to yours, who gives a shit?

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Parc y Scarlets - Where the Wild Roses Grow so Scarlet and Free


Posted By: Abbey
Date Posted: 27 November 2006 at 9:12pm
Originally posted by salmidach salmidach wrote:

100% correct.... redeyes

abbey you go on about the NZRFU throwing their teddies out of the cot, but what right have the WRU got to go against decades of tradition?

I remember going to watch us play NZ in 89 and even though the heavens had opened (although there wasn't any flooding in iscoed), the thing i was looking forward to the most was seeing NZ perform the Haka....

Sal, if I could blow a raspberry on-line, I would.

Tradition? You'll be demanding we stay at Stradey next. Look forward, not back.



Posted By: westwalesdragon
Date Posted: 27 November 2006 at 10:29pm

I definitely agree NZ are as much to blame for this 'out of proportion' row.

If its true the WRU wrote to them weeks ago they definitely could have got back to us sooner than the morning of the game. I have no problem myself as to whether the Haka is performed before or after anthems as it is a tremendous sight.

Unfortunately NZ have assumed they will get their way and I applaud the WRU for standing their ground.

What worries me the most is what happened on the pitch!



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WestWalesDragon



Posted By: tisiphone
Date Posted: 28 November 2006 at 12:21am
Originally posted by Abbey Abbey wrote:

This really is an ill-informed thread. Yes, I totally agree that anyone who was at the game would have been disappointed to not see the Haka - but to say that people only bought their tickets for it? Well, if that's all they wanted then good enough that they were disappointed.

Let's get some truth here. It was the NZRFU who sulked at not being allowed the last word. This is a professional sport and the Haka has no place in it just before kick off. Let the All Blacks come out 15 minutes before kick off and do it. They demanded that the Haka be the last act and that there would be nothing after it.

Just stop and think about the NZRFU's arrogant stance. What they are saying is:

"We are going to motivate and psyche up our players. You MUST stand and watch and you are not allowed to respond". 

And this in a professional sport? I'd love to see this thread if the English RFU had made a similar demand!!!

 



I absolutely agree Abbey. Oh and I love the fact that the ABs smuggled in a Sky cameraman using a players pass to film the haka in the changing room.
Precious, precious, precious.
 

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Swansea Osprey


Posted By: Slider
Date Posted: 28 November 2006 at 8:56am

Tradition should also dictate that we have the right to sing OUR National Anthem at whatever point we like prior to kick off at OUR home games, in OUR stadium.

Who the h*ll are NZ to tell us what we can and cannot do when playing at home!

 



Posted By: Ambassador
Date Posted: 28 November 2006 at 9:08am
For crying out loud it's only a haka. Why make such a song and dance out of it?

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Take a risk or two, make a few mistakes. As long as you're adventurous I wont mind.


Posted By: SA14
Date Posted: 28 November 2006 at 9:26am
ok, perhaps the wru aren't that bad.


Posted By: Sam Cheese
Date Posted: 28 November 2006 at 6:58pm

Why should any team necessarily accommodate the demands of the opposition’s pre-match preparation?

 

Knickers to them.



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You will know the vengeance of the Lord Humungus! I promise you... nobody... nobody... gets out of here alive!


Posted By: mammamammon
Date Posted: 28 November 2006 at 7:49pm

Originally posted by Ambassador Ambassador wrote:

For crying out loud it's only a haka. Why make such a song and dance out of it?



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mammamammon

www.hopemalawiuk.com


Posted By: alibongo
Date Posted: 28 November 2006 at 8:00pm

Originally posted by Ambassador Ambassador wrote:

For crying out loud it's only a haka. Why make such a song and dance out of it?

I like it....SONG AND DANCE!!!!!!!!!



Posted By: Alun
Date Posted: 28 November 2006 at 8:37pm
No, seriously, The WRU did not have ANY reason what so ever to interfere with one hundred and what years tradition!!

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Cartref newydd, Stadiwm newydd, Penod newydd, Yr un freuddwyd.

"Does na unman yn debyg i adra, ond mae adra'n debyg iawn i 'chdi."

All statements-My opinions


Posted By: tisiphone
Date Posted: 29 November 2006 at 12:29am
Originally posted by Alun Alun wrote:

No, seriously, The WRU did not have ANY reason what so ever to interfere with one hundred and what years tradition!!


The one hundred and what years tradition of the ABs getting their own way you mean?
 

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Swansea Osprey


Posted By: SA14
Date Posted: 29 November 2006 at 1:40am

answer this someone.

after all the numorous occasions we've played them before, why did the wru want it different on saturday?

answer?



Posted By: tisiphone
Date Posted: 29 November 2006 at 2:43am
Originally posted by Quagmire Quagmire wrote:

answer this someone.

after all the numorous occasions we've played them before, why did the wru want it different on saturday?

answer?



Because somebody pretty gutsy is now in charge?

Just a thought.
 

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Swansea Osprey


Posted By: DIXX
Date Posted: 29 November 2006 at 2:48am
Originally posted by Quagmire Quagmire wrote:

answer this someone.

after all the numorous occasions we've played them before, why did the wru want it different on saturday?

answer?

exactly! nobody has one. silly imo. they have threatened before not to do it ever again after the boos and disrespect from england, then we do this. i know people on here have an opinion of the "wru were right, all blacks wrong", but, honestly, what was the point?

word has it that eventhough it was asked by the wru few weeks back, they kept it from the players, and told them on match day! question was on radio wales, "surely graham henry isnt that cruel!"? saved him a pre match team talk though!!!



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Parc y Scarlets - Where the Wild Roses Grow so Scarlet and Free


Posted By: SA14
Date Posted: 29 November 2006 at 8:52am
Originally posted by tisiphone tisiphone wrote:

Originally posted by Quagmire Quagmire wrote:

answer this someone.

after all the numorous occasions we've played them before, why did the wru want it different on saturday?

answer?



Because somebody pretty gutsy is now in charge?

Just a thought.
 

with a soft spot for the best region as well.



Posted By: Abbey
Date Posted: 29 November 2006 at 9:05am
Originally posted by Quagmire Quagmire wrote:

answer this someone.

after all the numorous occasions we've played them before, why did the wru want it different on saturday?

answer?

OK, you want an answer?

Let's turn the question around and ask you to justify the AB position then.

Why, after all the numerous occasions we've played them before, why did the NZRFU want it different in the 1980s when traditionally the Haka was performed before the anthem? It was Wayne Shelford's team that changed things and demanded that the Haka not be answered. As many have pointed out, the Haka is a Maori challenge that should be answered. It is a recent occurence that it should be the last word, and an arrogant one at that.

We've had occasions when teams have turned their backs on the Haka, ignored it completely whilst doing tackling practise and the famous Irish walk towards the Haka ending up inches from the leader's nose. In all these examples, the NZRFU claimed that they were insulted. What they are saying is that you must meekly stand and watch and not respond. And we're wrong?

Build a bridge and get over it.



Posted By: SA14
Date Posted: 29 November 2006 at 10:31am
Originally posted by Abbey Abbey wrote:

Originally posted by Quagmire Quagmire wrote:

answer this someone.

after all the numorous occasions we've played them before, why did the wru want it different on saturday?

answer?

OK, you want an answer?

Let's turn the question around and ask you to justify the AB position then.

Why, after all the numerous occasions we've played them before, why did the NZRFU want it different in the 1980s when traditionally the Haka was performed before the anthem? It was Wayne Shelford's team that changed things and demanded that the Haka not be answered. As many have pointed out, the Haka is a Maori challenge that should be answered. It is a recent occurence that it should be the last word, and an arrogant one at that.

We've had occasions when teams have turned their backs on the Haka, ignored it completely whilst doing tackling practise and the famous Irish walk towards the Haka ending up inches from the leader's nose. In all these examples, the NZRFU claimed that they were insulted. What they are saying is that you must meekly stand and watch and not respond. And we're wrong?

Build a bridge and get over it.

wasn't aware of that



Posted By: westwalesdragon
Date Posted: 29 November 2006 at 10:46am

It's not as if we're going to beat them anytime soon whether they do the Haka or not, thats what worries me.

I thought it would be more respectful to them if we answered their traditional war dance with our National anthem. Seeing as that is something we are passionate about and traditionally sing it before going into 'battle' with them.



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WestWalesDragon




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