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Wales Team to face Argentina

Printed From: Scarlet Fever Llanelli Rugby Sport Wales Tickets
Category: RUGBY
Forum Name: GENERAL RUGBY
Forum Description: Other rugby chat
URL: http://www.scarletfever.org/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=44614
Printed Date: 19 September 2018 at 6:29am
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Topic: Wales Team to face Argentina
Posted By: Fscarlet
Subject: Wales Team to face Argentina
Date Posted: 06 June 2018 at 4:04pm
1.W.Jones
2.E.Dee
3.D.Lewis
4.A.Beard
5.C.Hill (c)
6.S.Davies
8.R.Moriarty
7.J.Davies

9.G.Davies
10.R.Patchell
11.G.North
12.H.Parkes
13.S.Williams
14.J.Adams
15.H.Amos

Replacements
R.Elias, R.Evans, T.Francis, J.Turnbull, A.Wainwright, A.Davies, G.Anscombe, O.Watkin



Replies:
Posted By: Fscarlet
Date Posted: 06 June 2018 at 4:08pm
Must say, after the South Africa match, as proud & pleased as I am to see Cubby, Wyn & all the other Scarlet players involved, I will be watching from behind the sofa!!


Posted By: SospanMawr
Date Posted: 06 June 2018 at 4:20pm
Like the backline but that pack is going to be murdered if the Argies are anywhere near full strength.


Posted By: scarletnut
Date Posted: 06 June 2018 at 4:36pm
Originally posted by SospanMawr SospanMawr wrote:

Like the backline but that pack is going to be murdered if the Argies are anywhere near full strength.
No sense in Seb at 6 either

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I still wake up late at night and think of what might have been when tim stimpson hit that jammy penalty1


Posted By: GPR - Rochester
Date Posted: 06 June 2018 at 4:46pm
Well I can only say that Gatland has been true to his word - he's giving everyone a game. Would imagine that he will select his best available team for the next game. This pack will have to really step up on last Saturday.


Posted By: greypower1
Date Posted: 06 June 2018 at 6:48pm
Is Ellis Jenkins injured?

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Keep the faith


Posted By: scarletnut
Date Posted: 06 June 2018 at 7:15pm
Originally posted by greypower1 greypower1 wrote:

Is Ellis Jenkins injured?
No

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I still wake up late at night and think of what might have been when tim stimpson hit that jammy penalty1


Posted By: aber-fan
Date Posted: 06 June 2018 at 7:29pm
It's a bit of an experimental team, which I suppose is fair enough - presumably, this tour was planned with the idea of checking out the test credentials of some up and coming players.

The backs look as strong as possible from the tour party; against Argentina, I'd have preferred to start with the best scrummaging front row possible (Wyn or Rob - not much in it, Ryan and Francis), so let's hope there aren't too many scrums in the first 50 min. I'm delighted Cubby is getting a start - well deserved. Beard has yet to convince at this level - we'll see. I think Argentina must start as favourites, but let's hope the Welsh team show better basic skills than last week.


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I share no-one's ideas. I have my own.
(Ivan Turgenev)


Posted By: Mogwen
Date Posted: 06 June 2018 at 8:10pm
In all honesty, beard has yet to impress at any level apart from the u20’s. He’s a big lump of a bloke, but doesn’t use it effectively. Hopefully I’m wrong on this tour. I would have preferred to see Jenkins at 6 and Seb Davies at 5.

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The only true wisdom is in knowing you know nothing.


Posted By: SospanMawr
Date Posted: 06 June 2018 at 9:47pm
Originally posted by Mogwen Mogwen wrote:

In all honesty, beard has yet to impress at any level apart from the u20’s. He’s a big lump of a bloke, but doesn’t use it effectively. Hopefully I’m wrong on this tour. I would have preferred to see Jenkins at 6 and Seb Davies at 5.
Completely agree. Thornton and Beard both hyped up as young Osprey prospects and neither look to be able to develop to anything more than decent squad players. Beard is too cumbersome and Thornton is too slight. Combine them and you'd have a good player.


Posted By: Sosban bach
Date Posted: 06 June 2018 at 11:43pm
Or even Turnbull at 6?


Posted By: GPR - Rochester
Date Posted: 07 June 2018 at 9:05am
In many ways the selection of the front 5 is a little mystifying. Argentina have belatedly reverted to their forward orientated power game and they are a handful in that area. I think the continued selection of Seb at 6 is because Gatland is going to take only 4 out and out 2nd rows to the World Cup. He wants/needs one of his 5 back row selections to be able cover 2nd row in an emergency. If this is true it is probably bad news for Aaron/Cubby and good news for Seb/Turnbull. 


Posted By: Fscarlet
Date Posted: 07 June 2018 at 9:15am
Originally posted by GPR - Rochester GPR - Rochester wrote:

In many ways the selection of the front 5 is a little mystifying. Argentina have belatedly reverted to their forward orientated power game and they are a handful in that area. I think the continued selection of Seb at 6 is because Gatland is going to take only 4 out and out 2nd rows to the World Cup. He wants/needs one of his 5 back row selections to be able cover 2nd row in an emergency. If this is true it is probably bad news for Aaron/Cubby and good news for Seb/Turnbull. 


I think that Aaron has proved his worth to the Welsh squad this season & I would go as far as to say he is one of the first names on the team sheet for both Wales & us.


Posted By: GPR - Rochester
Date Posted: 07 June 2018 at 9:31am
Originally posted by Fscarlet Fscarlet wrote:

Originally posted by GPR - Rochester GPR - Rochester wrote:

In many ways the selection of the front 5 is a little mystifying. Argentina have belatedly reverted to their forward orientated power game and they are a handful in that area. I think the continued selection of Seb at 6 is because Gatland is going to take only 4 out and out 2nd rows to the World Cup. He wants/needs one of his 5 back row selections to be able cover 2nd row in an emergency. If this is true it is probably bad news for Aaron/Cubby and good news for Seb/Turnbull. 


I think that Aaron has proved his worth to the Welsh squad this season & I would go as far as to say he is one of the first names on the team sheet for both Wales & us.

I am a huge Aaron fan but the selectors I don't think share my or indeed your feelings. Even if he was to select 5 out and out back rowers I think Aaron will be hard pushed - Warburton, Faletau, Moriarty & Tipuric are probably certainties if fit. That leaves Navidi, Aaron, Jenkins, Cubby, Ollie Griffiths & Thomas Young to battle it out. If he does indeed want a 6 to cover 2nd row then Seb Davies and Turnbull get added to that list. 


Posted By: NobbySosban
Date Posted: 07 June 2018 at 9:35am
In other Test news, Sam Hydalgo-Clyne starts at 9 for Scotland against Canada Clap, but there's no place for Tadgh Beirne in the 23 for Ireland's 1st Test v the Wallabies.Shocked

James Ryan and Iain Henderson start at lock, with Connacht's Quinn Roux on the bench - maybe Schmidt recognises that Tadgh doesn't need a game this weekend until he's more rested and assimilated into the Irish set-up, or perhaps they don't want to cap him until he's officially a Munster player.Confused They like to show off the provenance of their players in their team listing:

15. Rob Kearney (UCD/Leinster) 83 caps
14. Keith Earls (Young Munster/Munster) 67 caps
13. Robbie Henshaw (Buccaneers/Leinster) 33 caps
12. Bundee Aki (Galwegians/Connacht) 7 caps
11. Jacob Stockdale (Ballynahinch/Ulster) 9 caps
10. Joey Carbery (Clontarf/Leinster) 10 caps
9. Conor Murray (Garryowen/Munster) 64 caps

1. Jack McGrath (St Mary's College/Leinster) 47 caps
2. Rob Herring (Ballynahinch/Ulster) 3 caps
3. John Ryan (Cork Constitution/Munster) 13 caps
4. James Ryan (UCD/Leinster) 8 caps 
5. Iain Henderson (Ballynahinch/Ulster) 38 caps
6. Peter O'Mahony (Cork Constitution/Munster) 47 caps capt
7. Jordi Murphy (Lansdowne/Leinster) 20 caps
8. CJ Stander (Shannon/Munster) 23 caps

Replacements
16. Sean Cronin (St Mary's College/Leinster) 61 caps
17. Cian Healy (Clontarf/Leinster) 78 caps
18. Tadhg Furlong (Clontarf/Leinster) 23 caps
19. Quinn Roux (Galwegians/Connacht) 5 caps
20. Jack Conan (Old Belvedere/Leinster) 7 caps
21. Kieran Marmion (Corinthians/Connacht) 21 caps
22. Johnny Sexton (St Mary's College/Leinster) 73 caps
23. Jordan Larmour (St Mary's College/Leinster) 3 caps

tbc. Tadgh Beirne (Leinster Reject/Scarlets Champion) 0 caps




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Twitterer @ebenezer68


Posted By: Mundoscarlet
Date Posted: 07 June 2018 at 9:38am
Aaron is far and away the best 6 and possibly the only 6 of all those names mentioned in my opinion


Posted By: Mundoscarlet
Date Posted: 07 June 2018 at 9:40am
Tadhg let's hope this isn't a huge mistake already , and thy are resting no him,like the Leinster boys. If not, can he rip the contract up now???


Posted By: GPR - Rochester
Date Posted: 07 June 2018 at 10:12am
Originally posted by Mundoscarlet Mundoscarlet wrote:

Aaron is far and away the best 6 and possibly the only 6 of all those names mentioned in my opinion

Thats not totally correct. Moriarty's favoured position is 6 & Warburton has played at 6 for both Wales and the Lions. Its all down to what the coaches see as our gameplan DNA. They talk of playing a fast attacking offloading game featuring forward/backs offloading to support yet they continue to pick players in key roles that defy this stated aim - the biggest being Biggar at 10 so who knows. Until you have your way of playing then it becomes difficult to pick your best squad. 


Posted By: GPR - Rochester
Date Posted: 07 June 2018 at 10:16am
Originally posted by Mundoscarlet Mundoscarlet wrote:

Tadhg let's hope this isn't a huge mistake already , and thy are resting no him,like the Leinster boys. If not, can he rip the contract up now???

I am surprised that Tahdg isn't on the bench. I never thought he would be catapulted straight into the test team ahead of Henderson & Ryan. He has got work to do to convince Schmidt that he is his type of player. Lets be honest Schmidt must have been aware of Tadhg in his Leinster days as a coach so he was part of the set up that let him go. Henderson is a Lion and Ryan will be a Lion next time so he has stern competition. 


Posted By: T_RICHARDS_94
Date Posted: 07 June 2018 at 10:27am
It wouldn't bother me one bit if we lost this game, as long as they come out uninjured at the end that's all that matters.
 
 


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Please take 5 minutes to read my blog https://tapngo.wordpress.com/" rel="nofollow - - Tap and Go


Posted By: Rich (Bris)
Date Posted: 07 June 2018 at 10:46am
As Samson is injured and Rob may well need a rest, could the front 5 of the scrum be any stronger based on who is on tour? I'm not totally convinced by Thomas Francis and from what I've seen of Argentina and the Jaguares over the past two seasons their scrumaging is average. But they are very mobile and strong at rucking. I expect us to be able to win our own ball from scrums, even though we won't cause theirs much trouble.


Posted By: Fscarlet
Date Posted: 07 June 2018 at 10:58am
Originally posted by GPR - Rochester GPR - Rochester wrote:

Originally posted by Mundoscarlet Mundoscarlet wrote:

Tadhg let's hope this isn't a huge mistake already , and thy are resting no him,like the Leinster boys. If not, can he rip the contract up now???

I am surprised that Tahdg isn't on the bench. I never thought he would be catapulted straight into the test team ahead of Henderson & Ryan. He has got work to do to convince Schmidt that he is his type of player. Lets be honest Schmidt must have been aware of Tadhg in his Leinster days as a coach so he was part of the set up that let him go. Henderson is a Lion and Ryan will be a Lion next time so he has stern competition. 


FWIW there were not many, if any actually, that thought that Tadhg would be in the match day squad from the various rugby forums I have read today.


Posted By: Wil Chips
Date Posted: 07 June 2018 at 11:30am
Good to see young guys getting a go...pretty sure next week will be the first choice pack and new guys in the backs where possible.


Posted By: supertaf
Date Posted: 07 June 2018 at 12:14pm
Originally posted by Mogwen Mogwen wrote:

In all honesty, beard has yet to impress at any level apart from the u20’s. He’s a big lump of a bloke, but doesn’t use it effectively. Hopefully I’m wrong on this tour. I would have preferred to see Jenkins at 6 and Seb Davies at 5.
Correct, I'm not sure what the fuss is about Beard but then we also see Wainwright in the squad?????


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Scarlets - Suppliers of fine rugby since 1872


Posted By: supertaf
Date Posted: 07 June 2018 at 12:17pm
Originally posted by Fscarlet Fscarlet wrote:

Originally posted by GPR - Rochester GPR - Rochester wrote:

Originally posted by Mundoscarlet Mundoscarlet wrote:

Tadhg let's hope this isn't a huge mistake already , and thy are resting no him,like the Leinster boys. If not, can he rip the contract up now???

I am surprised that Tahdg isn't on the bench. I never thought he would be catapulted straight into the test team ahead of Henderson & Ryan. He has got work to do to convince Schmidt that he is his type of player. Lets be honest Schmidt must have been aware of Tadhg in his Leinster days as a coach so he was part of the set up that let him go. Henderson is a Lion and Ryan will be a Lion next time so he has stern competition. 


FWIW there were not many, if any actually, that thought that Tadhg would be in the match day squad from the various rugby forums I have read today.
It took us a while to select him to be fair but what a player he was from there on. He has nothing more to prove that he is bang up there with Irelands best so, given that he is now available not to pick him seems as though they think he does still has something to prove. IMHO He's much better all round than Henderson.


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Scarlets - Suppliers of fine rugby since 1872


Posted By: Fscarlet
Date Posted: 07 June 2018 at 1:06pm
Andrew Brace is the Welsh (ok Irish but he was born in Cardiff) referee for this match.


Posted By: GPR - Rochester
Date Posted: 07 June 2018 at 1:15pm
Originally posted by supertaf supertaf wrote:

Originally posted by Fscarlet Fscarlet wrote:

Originally posted by GPR - Rochester GPR - Rochester wrote:

Originally posted by Mundoscarlet Mundoscarlet wrote:

Tadhg let's hope this isn't a huge mistake already , and thy are resting no him,like the Leinster boys. If not, can he rip the contract up now???

I am surprised that Tahdg isn't on the bench. I never thought he would be catapulted straight into the test team ahead of Henderson & Ryan. He has got work to do to convince Schmidt that he is his type of player. Lets be honest Schmidt must have been aware of Tadhg in his Leinster days as a coach so he was part of the set up that let him go. Henderson is a Lion and Ryan will be a Lion next time so he has stern competition. 


FWIW there were not many, if any actually, that thought that Tadhg would be in the match day squad from the various rugby forums I have read today.
It took us a while to select him to be fair but what a player he was from there on. He has nothing more to prove that he is bang up there with Irelands best so, given that he is now available not to pick him seems as though they think he does still has something to prove. IMHO He's much better all round than Henderson.

Thats one hell of a claim for someone who as yet to play at International level!!!! We all need to remember the huge step up it is to play in test matches against tier one teams. As I said Henderson is a Lion and he was pushing very hard for a starting spot against AWJ & Itoje. Much as I admire Tadhg I wouldn't burden him with that expectation just yet. 


Posted By: SospanMawr
Date Posted: 07 June 2018 at 3:14pm
Scmidt only starting two players who started the pro14 final (Kearney, Ryan).
Gatland has had six players who started involved in the last two weeks (Steff, Cubby, Cawdor, Patch, Parkes, Scott)


Posted By: aber-fan
Date Posted: 07 June 2018 at 3:25pm
Originally posted by Rich (Bris) Rich (Bris) wrote:

As Samson is injured and Rob may well need a rest, could the front 5 of the scrum be any stronger based on who is on tour? I'm not totally convinced by Thomas Francis and from what I've seen of Argentina and the Jaguares over the past two seasons their scrumaging is average. But they are very mobile and strong at rucking. I expect us to be able to win our own ball from scrums, even though we won't cause theirs much trouble.

I'd have thought that Tomos Francis is definitely a step up on Dillon Lewis, and Brad Davies is surely better than Beard ATM - but that's just my opinion.


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I share no-one's ideas. I have my own.
(Ivan Turgenev)


Posted By: Sosban bach
Date Posted: 07 June 2018 at 3:50pm
Francis is shocking and a liability come scrum time.


Posted By: Rich (Bris)
Date Posted: 07 June 2018 at 3:52pm
Yeah You could be right aber-fan but I think there is not much in it if they are. I think the two starting may have the edge in open play, though I've not seen a great deal of them to be fair.


Posted By: Mundoscarlet
Date Posted: 07 June 2018 at 6:05pm
If anyone is watching the under 20s , if anyone thinks gerai t Lewis is a future coach of any Wales side good luck. Aus and nz destroyed Japan and we look a shambles


Posted By: aber-fan
Date Posted: 07 June 2018 at 7:44pm
Originally posted by Mundoscarlet Mundoscarlet wrote:

If anyone is watching the under 20s , if anyone thinks gerai t Lewis is a future coach of any Wales side good luck. Aus and nz destroyed Japan and we look a shambles

True. A disappointing performance.

Didn't see it all by any means... the only bright spots from our PoV is that both Wales tries were set up by good passes by 'our' boys - one from Nicholas, the other from Baldwin.


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I share no-one's ideas. I have my own.
(Ivan Turgenev)


Posted By: ap sior
Date Posted: 07 June 2018 at 7:53pm
Not up to speed so missed the game, what was the result, and who were we playing ?


Posted By: Cofi
Date Posted: 07 June 2018 at 8:40pm
Originally posted by ap sior ap sior wrote:

Not up to speed so missed the game, what was the result, and who were we playing ?


Wales 18 - 17 Japan
Silly mistakes,missed oportunities and a general feeling of why are we not thrashing them just like tha All Blacks did!


Posted By: Legendinmybathroom
Date Posted: 07 June 2018 at 9:05pm
Pretty poor game from what I saw, quite a few try scoring opportunities wasted by both teams, probably a game that the welsh could have done without, after already playing 2 Very physically demanding games against Aus and NZ. The game against NZ was brutal, with some very nasty cheap shots by the NZ players. I think this welsh team would probably have done better if the Japan game was sandwiched between the AUS and NZ games and not after them, although I presume it’s the same for Japan.


Posted By: Ffidel Bennett
Date Posted: 07 June 2018 at 10:01pm
A very scrappy match with frequent recurrent errors. For once Wales were physically much bigger than their opponents some of whom looked barely 12. However this Wales U20 side could not dominate and at times were outplayed.
 The Japanese players, in general, had good hands and could catch the ball while accelerating at the Welsh line, remarkably powering their way over the gain line, sometimes with the help of one or two fellow players -Wales rarely had the same pace, or picked a predictable line and usually knocked on. On top of that we managed to kick most possession away once more. 
We have a few talented individuals but with such a poor game-plan and coaching it's not surprising that, had the Japanese not missed easy conversions they would have won.


Posted By: Rich (Bris)
Date Posted: 07 June 2018 at 10:28pm
The coach doesn't play. So don't think this result necessarily Reflects badly on the coaches - maybe the squad is not good enough and even Wayne, Steve and co could not get much more out of them. Very good for the future of rugby to see Japan, Georgian & Italy doing so well tonight. Saw half of first half of France and they were fabulous - the 'real' France from out 1970s dreams! Hopefully that will translate to their senior team soon.


Posted By: ap sior
Date Posted: 08 June 2018 at 8:33am
Originally posted by Rich (Bris) Rich (Bris) wrote:

The coach doesn't play. So don't think this result necessarily Reflects badly on the coaches - maybe the squad is not good enough and even Wayne, Steve and co could not get much more out of them. Very good for the future of rugby to see Japan, Georgian & Italy doing so well tonight. Saw half of first half of France and they were fabulous - the 'real' France from out 1970s dreams! Hopefully that will translate to their senior team soon.

Would be good, but are their youngsters going to be drowned out by foreigners ?


Posted By: GPR - Rochester
Date Posted: 08 June 2018 at 8:44am
Originally posted by ap sior ap sior wrote:

Originally posted by Rich (Bris) Rich (Bris) wrote:

The coach doesn't play. So don't think this result necessarily Reflects badly on the coaches - maybe the squad is not good enough and even Wayne, Steve and co could not get much more out of them. Very good for the future of rugby to see Japan, Georgian & Italy doing so well tonight. Saw half of first half of France and they were fabulous - the 'real' France from out 1970s dreams! Hopefully that will translate to their senior team soon.

Would be good, but are their youngsters going to be drowned out by foreigners ?

Therein lies the problem for France. Too many young players fall by the wayside by not being given Top 14 games. A mirror image of the Premiership football debacle where less than 30% of players are eligible to play for England. 


Posted By: Fscarlet
Date Posted: 08 June 2018 at 8:49am

Argentina: E Boffelli; B Delguy, M Orlando, J De La Fuente, R Moyano; N Sanchez, G Bertranou; S Garcia Botta, A Creevy (capt), N Tetaz Chaparro, G Petti, T Lavanini, P Matera, J Ortega Desio, M Kremer.

Reps: J Montoya, J Diaz, S Medrano, M Alemanno, T Lezana, M Landajo, S Gonzalez Iglesias, S Cancelliere.



Posted By: Fscarlet
Date Posted: 08 June 2018 at 8:11pm
Just as a smal side note, Ken Owens is out in Argentina... read into that what you will.


Posted By: Wil Chips
Date Posted: 08 June 2018 at 8:22pm
Basically the Jaguares side.


Posted By: Rich (Bris)
Date Posted: 08 June 2018 at 10:09pm
Originally posted by Wil Chips Wil Chips wrote:

Basically the Jaguares side.


Yep at the moment and for the last few years only players playing in Argentina can be picked for the national side, so as far as I know the whole squad are all Jaguares players (as I can't imagine any players from their domestic league making it)


Posted By: Dafen Boy
Date Posted: 09 June 2018 at 8:38pm
Originally posted by Wil Chips Wil Chips wrote:

Basically the Jaguares side.

In form and used to playing with each other, whereas..


Posted By: Dafen Boy
Date Posted: 09 June 2018 at 8:39pm
Originally posted by Fscarlet Fscarlet wrote:

Just as a smal side note, Ken Owens is out in Argentina... read into that what you will.

As is Foxy and others..?  Maybe the Welsh speaker for C4?


Posted By: Dafen Boy
Date Posted: 09 June 2018 at 8:50pm
Nice Scarlet try


Posted By: surfing-mtber
Date Posted: 09 June 2018 at 9:06pm
Cubby turn over saves a try. Brilliant.

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Joshua24:15


Posted By: Dafen Boy
Date Posted: 09 June 2018 at 9:07pm
great turnover by Cubby


Posted By: Dafen Boy
Date Posted: 09 June 2018 at 9:15pm
Forwards going well


Posted By: Dafen Boy
Date Posted: 09 June 2018 at 9:32pm
3-17 Half time


Posted By: Dafen Boy
Date Posted: 09 June 2018 at 9:33pm
All Scarlets showing well..


Posted By: Dafen Boy
Date Posted: 09 June 2018 at 9:58pm
3-20 after 55


Posted By: Dafen Boy
Date Posted: 09 June 2018 at 10:27pm
10-23, final

Cubby and Parkes outstanding.


Posted By: surfing-mtber
Date Posted: 09 June 2018 at 10:28pm
Cubby and Moriaty worked very well together. Hadleigh had another very solid game. Scrum held up very well. Good result.

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Joshua24:15


Posted By: ap sior
Date Posted: 09 June 2018 at 10:34pm
Not seen much of Beard up until now, but fair play I thought he played very well.


Posted By: Dafen Boy
Date Posted: 09 June 2018 at 10:36pm
Originally posted by ap sior ap sior wrote:

Not seen much of Beard up until now, but fair play I thought he played very well.

Yes, pity Moriarty isn't coming here..


Posted By: Ffidel Bennett
Date Posted: 09 June 2018 at 11:03pm
  Beard surprisingly good, and no-one had a bad game. Patch, Cubby, Cawdor, Parkes, Scott, Evans all excellent in what was Wales most convincing victory for some time.  


Posted By: ap sior
Date Posted: 10 June 2018 at 6:32am
Another player I've not seen much of and who played very well was Dillon Lewis. Solid in the scrum, and his carrying and tackling was of a very high standard.


Posted By: roy munster
Date Posted: 10 June 2018 at 6:56am
lewis was the highlight for me....The weakest areas of welsh rugby have been tight head , 8 and lock imo
His emergence is a huge fillip , the return of moriarty is crucial and the rise of seb davies, cory hill and maybe beard are huge plusses. The return of jake ball adds nicely to the mix. Elsewhere cubby had a stormer, dee went well as did rob, cawdor made crucial breaks after some silly errors, patch was class, parkes was everywhere, amos out the back door pass showed what a quality player he is. Now theres a man who should be in scarlet 


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ROYMOND MUNTER MBE (FOR SERVICES TO THE COMBOVER)


Posted By: GPR - Rochester
Date Posted: 10 June 2018 at 8:19am
Well done to the Welsh team. They were predicted to be seriously bullied up front but stood their ground to a man and defended the gainline as if their lives depended on it. Cubby had his best game since the 6 nations. A big mention to Dillon Lewis and Adam Beard - they have both stepped up and shown that they have serious abilities. 

Hopefully Rhys has shown what most of us on here have known all season - he is the best 10 in Wales & is quite clearly a better all round player than Anscombe. For next weekend I would love to see Ellis at 6 with Cubby at 7.


Posted By: Rob o'r Bont
Date Posted: 10 June 2018 at 8:36am
Argentina were pressing quite hard on our line at times in the first half and Cubby's turnovers were crucial to relieving the pressure from potential try scoring opportunities. Our defence was good but without those turnovers it could have been a very different scoreline at half time.

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That's the Scarlets, its in their DNA.


Posted By: Wil Chips
Date Posted: 10 June 2018 at 10:07am
Top notch defense, couple of class finishes, and a lack of a plan b from Argentina when the rolling maul and perceived edge up front failed to materialize.

Applause to the Wales coaches for seeing what most haven't seen in a some young talent placed in a team that only probably featured 4 or 5 first choice players within it and only 2 of those in the pack.

I suspect Argentina will execute a very different game plan next weekend.


Posted By: scarletabroad
Date Posted: 10 June 2018 at 11:28am
Well done team Wales surprise result good turn out by all to be fair


Posted By: GPR - Rochester
Date Posted: 10 June 2018 at 12:11pm
Originally posted by Wil Chips Wil Chips wrote:

Top notch defense, couple of class finishes, and a lack of a plan b from Argentina when the rolling maul and perceived edge up front failed to materialize.

Applause to the Wales coaches for seeing what most haven't seen in a some young talent placed in a team that only probably featured 4 or 5 first choice players within it and only 2 of those in the pack.

I suspect Argentina will execute a very different game plan next weekend.

Quite right Wil. I am one of Gatland's fiercest critics but he clearly felt both Beard & Lewis were capable and he has been proven correct. The back 3 impressed as a unit and certainly gives every incentive for players like Liam to find their very best form next season. 

Suddenly the tight head headache is looking a little more manageable. 


Posted By: aber-fan
Date Posted: 10 June 2018 at 3:16pm
Originally posted by GPR - Rochester GPR - Rochester wrote:

Well done to the Welsh team. They were predicted to be seriously bullied up front but stood their ground to a man and defended the gainline as if their lives depended on it. Cubby had his best game since the 6 nations. A big mention to Dillon Lewis and Adam Beard - they have both stepped up and shown that they have serious abilities. 

Hopefully Rhys has shown what most of us on here have known all season - he is the best 10 in Wales & is quite clearly a better all round player than Anscombe. For next weekend I would love to see Ellis at 6 with Cubby at 7.

Once again, we agree - pre-match, I expressed doubts about Lewis (lack of experience) and Beard (not shown much at senior level) - but both really stood up and surprised me - respect!

Rhys is now clearly better than Anscombe (always was, according to some of us)... faster, stronger, a better line and goal kicker, and now also a better controller - perhaps the only aspect where Anscombe had a slight edge in the past.

I also feel that playing both Ellis Jenkins and Cubby is the way to go next week - Seb Davies was one of the few Wales players to be pretty anonymous yesterday - fair play, he's young and was out of position. He'll come again.

As for the game - the Wales game plan worked like a dream, and was executed nearly perfectly by the players - we totally bullied Argentina at the breakdown, invariably tacking them behind the gain line, slowing their ball, or pinching it (turnovers and inconclusive mauls). Their rolling maul was nullified, and we looked far more dangerous in possession. Scrum and lineout both went well overall, with a couple of errors here and there. 

As for individuals - once again, Amos looked class and a dangerous runner - he just needs to improve his judgement of when to offload, and when it's too risky... Josh Adams played really well, being combative in all he did... Scott did OK - a bit quiet - missed one tackle allowing the Pumas to make serious inroads - he'll want to step it up next week ... Hadleigh was superb, catching KOs, running it back, organising - one of our best players on the day... George looks to have his appetite back, and followed Cawdor well for his try - I just wish that when he chases kicks, he would actually smash the receiver, and not just wave his arms about... Patch was another to star - taking good decisions, tackling well, good distribution nearly always, posed a running threat... Cawdor set up George's try superbly and generally played well  apart from an early kick direct to touch. 

In the forwards, Rob was lively as usual, as was Dee... Hill is proving to be a very tidy player... Moriarty had one of his best games for Wales, and Cubby was outstanding... if we want to be super critical, he was a bit slow when the Pumas got their try - he looked knackered by then - but a couple of other guys also failed to stop the charge, so he wasn't alone there. Brilliant, up until then. 

As for the subs, Ryan did well again and the rest looked solid enough.

I'd be inclined to keep almost the same 15/23 for next week, except for Tomos Williams to bench in place of Aled, Ellis Jenkins to 6 instead of Seb Davies, maybe Brad Davies instead of Cory Hill - a 'fresh legs' sub, not a form thing - so Hill on the bench, along with Turnbull or Seb in case Wales want or need to revert to a bigger 6. 




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I share no-one's ideas. I have my own.
(Ivan Turgenev)


Posted By: Eastern outpost
Date Posted: 10 June 2018 at 3:51pm
I was slightly surprised to see the players struggling for breath earlier in the game than I’d expect.

Looked up the altitude and saw that SAN Juan is a bit over 2,000 ft above sea level.

-------------
Any offence taken on board is only a literate/cy consequence. Every attempt at humour is just that. No personal insult intended. Standards lowered for trolls.


Posted By: roy munster
Date Posted: 10 June 2018 at 6:01pm
It was a great balance yesterday. Whilst we're trying new players , we didnt just throw in a totally inexpeirenced team, we had a lot of form players and some experience from cawdor, north, scott, rob etc 
Up to 4th in world rankings, england down to 5thLOL


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ROYMOND MUNTER MBE (FOR SERVICES TO THE COMBOVER)


Posted By: 157cb
Date Posted: 10 June 2018 at 8:33pm

Excellent performance by a very inexperienced Welsh team missing more than a dozen frontline players .


Posted By: SospanMawr
Date Posted: 10 June 2018 at 9:50pm
Patchell needs a good run at 10 with the best players up front, inside and outside to see if he’s a viable option for the World Cup.
Our squad depth isn’t near Ireland, England or New Zealand but it’s improving, come World Cup our squad will likely be (assuming all are fit)
1) Rob / Wyn / Nicky Smith
2) Ken / Dee / Elias
3) Samson / Dillon / Francis
4) Ball / Beard
5) Alun Wyn / Seb Davies
6) Shingler / Moriarty
7) Warburton / Ellis Jenkins / Cubby
8) Faletau

9) Gar Davies / Tomos Williams / Rhodri Williams (?)
10) Patchell / Biggar
11) Steff / Josh Adams
12) Parkes / Watkin
13) Foxy / Scott
14) George / Amos
15) Halfpenny / Liam


Posted By: Rob o'r Bont
Date Posted: 10 June 2018 at 10:05pm
You can add Navidi at 7 to that list.

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That's the Scarlets, its in their DNA.


Posted By: mammamammon
Date Posted: 10 June 2018 at 10:44pm
Excellent result. Patchell outstanding, Davies superb, Parkes class, Hill outstanding, Dee pushing to be first choice

-------------
mammamammon

www.hopemalawiuk.com


Posted By: SospanMawr
Date Posted: 10 June 2018 at 10:45pm
Originally posted by Rob o'r Bont Rob o'r Bont wrote:

You can add Navidi at 7 to that list.
True. Taine Basham is my outsider to make the RWC squad.


Posted By: supertaf
Date Posted: 11 June 2018 at 10:18am
Originally posted by SospanMawr SospanMawr wrote:

Patchell needs a good run at 10 with the best players up front, inside and outside to see if he’s a viable option for the World Cup.
Our squad depth isn’t near Ireland, England or New Zealand but it’s improving, come World Cup our squad will likely be (assuming all are fit)
1) Rob / Wyn / Nicky Smith
2) Ken / Dee / Elias
3) Samson / Dillon / Francis
4) Ball / Beard
5) Alun Wyn / Seb Davies
6) Shingler / Moriarty
7) Warburton / Ellis Jenkins / Cubby
8) Faletau

9) Gar Davies / Tomos Williams / Rhodri Williams (?)
10) Patchell / Biggar
11) Steff / Josh Adams
12) Parkes / Watkin
13) Foxy / Scott
14) George / Amos
15) Halfpenny / Liam
 
You have left the golden child out?!?


-------------
Scarlets - Suppliers of fine rugby since 1872


Posted By: GPR - Rochester
Date Posted: 11 June 2018 at 10:48am
The selection gets pretty difficult because you are only allowed 31 players I think. The above list is 34 without ever presents like Cory Hill, Navidi & Tipuric!!!!Selection is all down to current form etc. Gatland is on record as saying he is going to take 9 front rowers, 4 2nd row & 5 back row. The players named above will of course provide most of those but Hill, Navidi, Tipuric, Bradley Davies, Leon Brown & Ollie Griffiths will be knocking on the door. 


Posted By: aber-fan
Date Posted: 11 June 2018 at 1:40pm
Originally posted by GPR - Rochester GPR - Rochester wrote:

The selection gets pretty difficult because you are only allowed 31 players I think. The above list is 34 without ever presents like Cory Hill, Navidi & Tipuric!!!!Selection is all down to current form etc. Gatland is on record as saying he is going to take 9 front rowers, 4 2nd row & 5 back row. The players named above will of course provide most of those but Hill, Navidi, Tipuric, Bradley Davies, Leon Brown & Ollie Griffiths will be knocking on the door. 

You're right - I wonder why only 31? It seems to me that teams invariably have to send for reinforcements, when the inevitable injuries occur. Not very practical.

As has been widely discussed in the media, our back row is the main area of competition - we seem absurdly blessed with talent in that area. Gats has said himself that some very good players will likely miss out. He also said that if there was a world cup for 7s (meaning players whose position is 7, not seven-a-side), Wales would win it - fair comment, I think. 

Of those mentioned previously, I think Cory Hill is sure to go on present form. Seb Davies is promising, but will have to step up significantly to take his place. Beard took a big step forward on Saturday, as did Dillon Lewis. The squad is looking potentially stronger than before the tour.

Oh - and surely, Patchell is now the leading choice at 10?


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I share no-one's ideas. I have my own.
(Ivan Turgenev)


Posted By: GPR - Rochester
Date Posted: 11 June 2018 at 2:25pm
Originally posted by aber-fan aber-fan wrote:

Originally posted by GPR - Rochester GPR - Rochester wrote:

The selection gets pretty difficult because you are only allowed 31 players I think. The above list is 34 without ever presents like Cory Hill, Navidi & Tipuric!!!!Selection is all down to current form etc. Gatland is on record as saying he is going to take 9 front rowers, 4 2nd row & 5 back row. The players named above will of course provide most of those but Hill, Navidi, Tipuric, Bradley Davies, Leon Brown & Ollie Griffiths will be knocking on the door. 

You're right - I wonder why only 31? It seems to me that teams invariably have to send for reinforcements, when the inevitable injuries occur. Not very practical.

As has been widely discussed in the media, our back row is the main area of competition - we seem absurdly blessed with talent in that area. Gats has said himself that some very good players will likely miss out. He also said that if there was a world cup for 7s (meaning players whose position is 7, not seven-a-side), Wales would win it - fair comment, I think. 

Of those mentioned previously, I think Cory Hill is sure to go on present form. Seb Davies is promising, but will have to step up significantly to take his place. Beard took a big step forward on Saturday, as did Dillon Lewis. The squad is looking potentially stronger than before the tour.

Oh - and surely, Patchell is now the leading choice at 10?

What is stopping my confidence from rising too much is the habit that Gatland has of saying one thing & making selections which counter that. He has two huge calls to make - at 7 & 10. If he really does want to play a fast handling & offloading game then he must select players in those positions who complement that strategy. 

At 7 I think he will revert to a fit again Warburton - wrong decision in my opinion. Warburton, Navidi or Ellis Jenkins would not have been in the position that Cubby was in to score that try. Tipuric would have been but he wouldn't have had 3 priceless turnovers. Warburton should be considered as an out and out 6 who is very destructive. He can also be useful in the lineout & would complement Cubby at the breakdown. 

At 10 it is surely clear to everyone that Patchell is the man to get this backline firing. Frankly I don't rate Anscombe & would probably give young Evans a shot in  the Autumn. Biggar should only go as a last resort 3rd choice. 


Posted By: scarletnut
Date Posted: 11 June 2018 at 2:35pm
Originally posted by GPR - Rochester GPR - Rochester wrote:

Originally posted by aber-fan aber-fan wrote:

Originally posted by GPR - Rochester GPR - Rochester wrote:

The selection gets pretty difficult because you are only allowed 31 players I think. The above list is 34 without ever presents like Cory Hill, Navidi & Tipuric!!!!Selection is all down to current form etc. Gatland is on record as saying he is going to take 9 front rowers, 4 2nd row & 5 back row. The players named above will of course provide most of those but Hill, Navidi, Tipuric, Bradley Davies, Leon Brown & Ollie Griffiths will be knocking on the door. 

You're right - I wonder why only 31? It seems to me that teams invariably have to send for reinforcements, when the inevitable injuries occur. Not very practical.

As has been widely discussed in the media, our back row is the main area of competition - we seem absurdly blessed with talent in that area. Gats has said himself that some very good players will likely miss out. He also said that if there was a world cup for 7s (meaning players whose position is 7, not seven-a-side), Wales would win it - fair comment, I think. 

Of those mentioned previously, I think Cory Hill is sure to go on present form. Seb Davies is promising, but will have to step up significantly to take his place. Beard took a big step forward on Saturday, as did Dillon Lewis. The squad is looking potentially stronger than before the tour.

Oh - and surely, Patchell is now the leading choice at 10?

What is stopping my confidence from rising too much is the habit that Gatland has of saying one thing & making selections which counter that. He has two huge calls to make - at 7 & 10. If he really does want to play a fast handling & offloading game then he must select players in those positions who complement that strategy. 

At 7 I think he will revert to a fit again Warburton - wrong decision in my opinion. Warburton, Navidi or Ellis Jenkins would not have been in the position that Cubby was in to score that try. Tipuric would have been but he wouldn't have had 3 priceless turnovers. Warburton should be considered as an out and out 6 who is very destructive. He can also be useful in the lineout & would complement Cubby at the breakdown. 

At 10 it is surely clear to everyone that Patchell is the man to get this backline firing. Frankly I don't rate Anscombe & would probably give young Evans a shot in  the Autumn. Biggar should only go as a last resort 3rd choice. 
Wales should use Warburton in the same manner Australia use Pocock. But I think Sam is one of these players who you have to make an exception for. One of three genuine world class players we have in Wales IMO

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I still wake up late at night and think of what might have been when tim stimpson hit that jammy penalty1


Posted By: GPR - Rochester
Date Posted: 11 June 2018 at 2:52pm
Originally posted by scarletnut scarletnut wrote:

Originally posted by GPR - Rochester GPR - Rochester wrote:

Originally posted by aber-fan aber-fan wrote:

Originally posted by GPR - Rochester GPR - Rochester wrote:

The selection gets pretty difficult because you are only allowed 31 players I think. The above list is 34 without ever presents like Cory Hill, Navidi & Tipuric!!!!Selection is all down to current form etc. Gatland is on record as saying he is going to take 9 front rowers, 4 2nd row & 5 back row. The players named above will of course provide most of those but Hill, Navidi, Tipuric, Bradley Davies, Leon Brown & Ollie Griffiths will be knocking on the door. 

You're right - I wonder why only 31? It seems to me that teams invariably have to send for reinforcements, when the inevitable injuries occur. Not very practical.

As has been widely discussed in the media, our back row is the main area of competition - we seem absurdly blessed with talent in that area. Gats has said himself that some very good players will likely miss out. He also said that if there was a world cup for 7s (meaning players whose position is 7, not seven-a-side), Wales would win it - fair comment, I think. 

Of those mentioned previously, I think Cory Hill is sure to go on present form. Seb Davies is promising, but will have to step up significantly to take his place. Beard took a big step forward on Saturday, as did Dillon Lewis. The squad is looking potentially stronger than before the tour.

Oh - and surely, Patchell is now the leading choice at 10?

What is stopping my confidence from rising too much is the habit that Gatland has of saying one thing & making selections which counter that. He has two huge calls to make - at 7 & 10. If he really does want to play a fast handling & offloading game then he must select players in those positions who complement that strategy. 

At 7 I think he will revert to a fit again Warburton - wrong decision in my opinion. Warburton, Navidi or Ellis Jenkins would not have been in the position that Cubby was in to score that try. Tipuric would have been but he wouldn't have had 3 priceless turnovers. Warburton should be considered as an out and out 6 who is very destructive. He can also be useful in the lineout & would complement Cubby at the breakdown. 

At 10 it is surely clear to everyone that Patchell is the man to get this backline firing. Frankly I don't rate Anscombe & would probably give young Evans a shot in  the Autumn. Biggar should only go as a last resort 3rd choice. 
Wales should use Warburton in the same manner Australia use Pocock. But I think Sam is one of these players who you have to make an exception for. One of three genuine world class players we have in Wales IMO

Sam is a fine player but i don't rate him that highly. You are right tho about Pocock. he is a real nuisance and carries well close to rucks allowing Hooper to cause mayhem in the wider channels. Sam & Cubby could play that combination. They certainly were too much for the Irish to handle at the breakdown last weekend. 


Posted By: NobbySosban
Date Posted: 11 June 2018 at 3:11pm
Wouldn't surprise me to see Patch at 15 for the 2nd Test in Santa Fe, with Anscombe given another run at 10, maybe switching roles on 55-60 mins.

If he's true to his word, he'll rotate a few for the final game to give everyone a chance to start. With a minimum of 2 wins out of 3, the tour will be seen as a success, so he'll see this as an opportunity to experiment further. Expect Aled, Ryan, Aaron Wainwright, Tomas Francis (if Samson not fit) and maybe Josh Turnbull to start, with Seb Davies in his real position in the second row perhaps?

With RWC19 in mind, Gats & Co should really be thinking about versatility in their tournament squad, as well as depth. Again, it's what Pivac has been doing with the wider Scarlets squad. and would seem to make sense for a competition where squad changes are limited during the tournament. It would also mean that a gameplan can be tweaked during a match, not that Cementhead has much previous form on changing tack. Ermm

That might ultimately count against a player like Cubby as an out-and-out open-side, although his cameos on the wing might stand him in good stead! Wink




-------------
Twitterer @ebenezer68


Posted By: aber-fan
Date Posted: 11 June 2018 at 3:13pm
I agree with GPR that Warburton should be considered as a 6... we need a ball player at 7 if the more expansive version we saw on Saturday is to continue. For the same reason, GPR is also right that Patchell is - or ought to be - Wales's first choice at 10 between now and the RWC. We'll never score many tries with Biggar at 10, and Anscombe has never quite looked the part.

The commentators said about Patch on Saturday that he'd stepped up a lot from the 6N, thanks to the experience he'd gained... he can only get better if Wales go on picking him.


-------------
I share no-one's ideas. I have my own.
(Ivan Turgenev)


Posted By: Rich (Bris)
Date Posted: 11 June 2018 at 3:23pm
I think it's easy to underestimate Sam Warburton but when he's playing internationals he is often emmense physically. He was the player we missed most against Ireland in the Six Nations


Posted By: Fscarlet
Date Posted: 11 June 2018 at 3:57pm
It'll be interesting to see what Gatland does now as he has stated that all players will have the opportunity to shine this tour, so will he make changes or stick largely with the same XV with one or 2 changes?

For me I would possibly bring in Williams at 9 & bring Jenkins in for Seb Davies.


Posted By: Rich (Bris)
Date Posted: 11 June 2018 at 5:28pm
Originally posted by Fscarlet Fscarlet wrote:

It'll be interesting to see what Gatland does now as he has stated that all players will have the opportunity to shine this tour, so will he make changes or stick largely with the same XV with one or 2 changes?

For me I would possibly bring in Williams at 9 & bring Jenkins in for Seb Davies.


I think he has to (& will) stick with what he said he would do, even where that means making the team weaker (e.g. Anscombe at 10). He doesn't (at least in his mind and I can see why) get many chances to try players out so he has to grasp it.


Posted By: aber-fan
Date Posted: 12 June 2018 at 3:50pm
Originally posted by Rich (Bris) Rich (Bris) wrote:

Originally posted by Fscarlet Fscarlet wrote:

It'll be interesting to see what Gatland does now as he has stated that all players will have the opportunity to shine this tour, so will he make changes or stick largely with the same XV with one or 2 changes?

For me I would possibly bring in Williams at 9 & bring Jenkins in for Seb Davies.


I think he has to (& will) stick with what he said he would do, even where that means making the team weaker (e.g. Anscombe at 10). He doesn't (at least in his mind and I can see why) get many chances to try players out so he has to grasp it.

Williams played well v SA... if Gats is picking a team to win, he'll stick with Cawdor for his experience, plus the fact that he plays with Patch all the time... but Williams deserves a chance to show what he can do, so no complaints from me if he starts.

Anscombe is different - he's had many opportunities, and has rarely shown much (IMO) - Patch is the 10 who needs more time to develop. I wouldn't drop him. 

Jenkins for Seb makes sense - with Cubby and Jenkins, Argentina will find it even harder at the breakdown unless they come with a very different game plan.


-------------
I share no-one's ideas. I have my own.
(Ivan Turgenev)


Posted By: PE SA
Date Posted: 13 June 2018 at 10:59am
Originally posted by aber-fan aber-fan wrote:

Originally posted by GPR - Rochester GPR - Rochester wrote:

The selection gets pretty difficult because you are only allowed 31 players I think. The above list is 34 without ever presents like Cory Hill, Navidi & Tipuric!!!!Selection is all down to current form etc. Gatland is on record as saying he is going to take 9 front rowers, 4 2nd row & 5 back row. The players named above will of course provide most of those but Hill, Navidi, Tipuric, Bradley Davies, Leon Brown & Ollie Griffiths will be knocking on the door. 


You're right - I wonder why only 31? It seems to me that teams invariably have to send for reinforcements, when the inevitable injuries occur. Not very practical.

As has been widely discussed in the media, our back row is the main area of competition - we seem absurdly blessed with talent in that area. Gats has said himself that some very good players will likely miss out. He also said that if there was a world cup for 7s (meaning players whose position is 7, not seven-a-side), Wales would win it - fair comment, I think. 

Of those mentioned previously, I think Cory Hill is sure to go on present form. Seb Davies is promising, but will have to step up significantly to take his place. Beard took a big step forward on Saturday, as did Dillon Lewis. The squad is looking potentially stronger than before the tour.

Oh - and surely, Patchell is now the leading choice at 10?

Jury heavily out for me on Seb Davies. Certainly has age on his side but with stats of 0 tackles and 0 carries...what was the point of him on the pitch v Argentina? Wales did that to Argentina with 14 men.


Posted By: Fscarlet
Date Posted: 13 June 2018 at 11:12am
Am I right in assuming that if last weekends results are repeated, we will move above England in the rankings?


Posted By: Micro Duck
Date Posted: 13 June 2018 at 11:25am
From what I can see, Seb made 12 tackles not 0. But his other stats weren't great.

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Posted By: Sosban bach
Date Posted: 13 June 2018 at 12:12pm
He's also playing 6 which is proving he isnt


Posted By: aber-fan
Date Posted: 13 June 2018 at 1:21pm
Originally posted by Fscarlet Fscarlet wrote:

Am I right in assuming that if last weekends results are repeated, we will move above England in the rankings?

No idea how the sums work, but we're pretty close ... 85.13 to 85.19.


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I share no-one's ideas. I have my own.
(Ivan Turgenev)


Posted By: NobbySosban
Date Posted: 13 June 2018 at 1:32pm
4/6/18

POSITIONTEAMSPOINTS
1
  • (1)
  •  
  • NEW ZEALAND
93.99
    https://www.worldrugby.org/rankings/mru#" rel="nofollow -
    2
    • (2)
    •  
    • IRELAND
    89.11
      https://www.worldrugby.org/rankings/mru#" rel="nofollow -
      3
      • (3)
      •  
      • ENGLAND
      86.23
        https://www.worldrugby.org/rankings/mru#" rel="nofollow -
        4
        • (4)
        •  
        • AUSTRALIA
        85.49
          https://www.worldrugby.org/rankings/mru#" rel="nofollow -
          5
          • (7)
          •  
          • WALES
          84.45
            https://www.worldrugby.org/rankings/mru#" rel="nofollow -
            6
            • (5)
            •  
            • SCOTLAND
            83.83
              https://www.worldrugby.org/rankings/mru#" rel="nofollow -
              7
              • (6)
              •  
              • SOUTH AFRICA
              82.77
                https://www.worldrugby.org/rankings/mru#" rel="nofollow -
                8
                • (8)
                •  
                • FRANCE
                79.10
                  https://www.worldrugby.org/rankings/mru#" rel="nofollow -
                  9
                  • (9)
                  •  
                  • ARGENTINA
                  78.22
                    https://www.worldrugby.org/rankings/mru#" rel="nofollow -
                    10
                    • (10)
                    •  
                    • FIJI
                    77.93
                      https://www.worldrugby.org/rankings/mru#" rel="nofollow -
                      1
                      • (1)
                      •  
                      • NEW ZEALAND
                      93.99
                        https://www.worldrugby.org/rankings/mru#" rel="nofollow -
                        2
                        • (2)
                        •  
                        • IRELAND
                        88.05
                          https://www.worldrugby.org/rankings/mru#" rel="nofollow -
                          3
                          • (4)
                          •  
                          • AUSTRALIA
                          86.56
                            https://www.worldrugby.org/rankings/mru#" rel="nofollow -
                            4
                            • (3)
                            •  
                            • ENGLAND
                            85.19
                              https://www.worldrugby.org/rankings/mru#" rel="nofollow -
                              5
                              • (5)
                              •  
                              • WALES
                              85.13
                                https://www.worldrugby.org/rankings/mru#" rel="nofollow -
                                6
                                • (6)
                                •  
                                • SCOTLAND
                                83.83
                                  https://www.worldrugby.org/rankings/mru#" rel="nofollow -
                                  7
                                  • (7)
                                  •  
                                  • SOUTH AFRICA
                                  83.81
                                    https://www.worldrugby.org/rankings/mru#" rel="nofollow -
                                    8
                                    • (8)
                                    •  
                                    • FRANCE
                                    79.10
                                      https://www.worldrugby.org/rankings/mru#" rel="nofollow -
                                      9
                                      • (10)
                                      •  
                                      • FIJI
                                      77.93
                                        https://www.worldrugby.org/rankings/mru#" rel="nofollow -
                                        10
                                        • (9)
                                        •  
                                        • ARGENTINA
                                        77.54
                                          https://www.worldrugby.org/rankings/mru#" rel="nofollow -


                                          Posted By: RR1972
                                          Date Posted: 14 June 2018 at 9:45am
                                          I'd play Williams at 9, put Jenkins in at 6 and give Seb Davies a game in the second row.
                                          Also would be nice to see ryan get a start in the number 2 jersey
                                           


                                          Posted By: Fscarlet
                                          Date Posted: 14 June 2018 at 9:55am
                                          Right, from what I can see....

                                          If Wales win by 1-15 points we move onto 85.67
                                          If Wales win by 15+ points we move onto 85.94

                                          If SA win by 1-15 points they will move onto 84.65 & England drop to 84.35
                                          If SA win by 15+ points they will move onto 85.07 & England drop to 83.93




                                          Posted By: Fscarlet
                                          Date Posted: 14 June 2018 at 9:56am
                                          Originally posted by RR1972 RR1972 wrote:

                                          I'd play Williams at 9, put Jenkins in at 6 and give Seb Davies a game in the second row.
                                          Also would be nice to see ryan get a start in the number 2 jersey
                                           


                                          I agree with this, I'd like to see Ryan start & I would think he will given Gat's comments of giving everyone a chance.


                                          Posted By: GPR - Rochester
                                          Date Posted: 14 June 2018 at 10:23am
                                          Think we will see Ryan & Samson start if fit otherwise Francis to start. I would also like to see Seb given a chance in the row with Bradley and Beard on the bench. Ellis at 6 with Cubby at 7. Behind I would like to see Tomos given a start at 9 but I think we may see Aled given his chance to start. 

                                          Gatland is in an enviable position that the tour is already a success; hats off to him for giving players their chances and trusting his tour selections and following his tour goals namely to give all a chance. This attitude compares very favourably with Eddie Jones' behaviour. He picks Hill & Isiekwe as back up 2nd rows but plays Shields out of position for 45 minutes in the 1st test. He was saved from picking Shields to start at 2nd row by the return to fitness of Launchbury. What sort of message does this send to Hill & Isiekwe? 

                                          Eddie's ongoing demeanour and behaviour suggest a man who has lost the plot & I wouldn't be surprised if he didn't make it to Japan. 


                                          Posted By: Rich (Bris)
                                          Date Posted: 14 June 2018 at 10:35am
                                          Originally posted by Fscarlet Fscarlet wrote:

                                          Right, from what I can see....

                                          If Wales win by 1-15 points we move onto 85.67
                                          If Wales win by 15+ points we move onto 85.94

                                          If SA win by 1-15 points they will move onto 84.65 & England drop to 84.35
                                          If SA win by 15+ points they will move onto 85.07 & England drop to 83.93
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                                          Well I really can't see England winning. All the guff about needing to give away less penalties - they did so due to the pressure they were under + I doubt SA will give them such an easy head-start this week.

                                          My only fear if I was South African is that at 0-0 the side will play very conservatively like the Boks normally do. The big England lead forced them to attack in the great way they did. As soon as they got a good lead they became more cautious and allowed the momentum to shift back to England.


                                          Posted By: SospanMawr
                                          Date Posted: 14 June 2018 at 10:40am
                                          Hope that Elias gets a chance too. If he can become a bit more dynamic and more of a nuisance at the breakdown we might have our own Malcolm Marx.


                                          Posted By: SospanMawr
                                          Date Posted: 15 June 2018 at 9:29am
                                          http://cardiffbluesblog.com/2018/06/15/analysis-argentina-not-a-patch-on-wales/" rel="nofollow - http://cardiffbluesblog.com/2018/06/15/analysis-argentina-not-a-patch-on-wales/
                                           
                                          Good article here on Patchell's form last week, nice to read good analysis of the game instead of ex players trotting out clichés...


                                          Posted By: aber-fan
                                          Date Posted: 15 June 2018 at 1:42pm
                                          Originally posted by SospanMawr SospanMawr wrote:

                                          http://cardiffbluesblog.com/2018/06/15/analysis-argentina-not-a-patch-on-wales/" rel="nofollow - http://cardiffbluesblog.com/2018/06/15/analysis-argentina-not-a-patch-on-wales/
                                           
                                          Good article here on Patchell's form last week, nice to read good analysis of the game instead of ex players trotting out clichés...

                                          Yes, quite a detailed and well described analysis of Patch v Argentina. Let's hope we can do it again this week... wonder if they'll come with a different game plan?


                                          -------------
                                          I share no-one's ideas. I have my own.
                                          (Ivan Turgenev)



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