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PE SA View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote PE SA Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 November 2018 at 12:35pm
Originally posted by GPR - Rochester GPR - Rochester wrote:

Originally posted by PE SA PE SA wrote:

Originally posted by GPR - Rochester GPR - Rochester wrote:



In my view the areas we are lacking are :-

1. Good back up to Rhys Patchell;
2. A carrying No 8 in the Mata mould;
3. Two locks one in the Jake mould, the other an upgrade on Tom Price;
4. A replacement for Kruger who is getting on a bit and would not be part of a new 3 year plan;
5. A back 3 flyer.

With the correct amount of funding & astute management anything is possible. 


cracking post GPR.

And to add to your 5 points above:

I would look to keep Price as he is still young and we dont produce a lot. Jake will be missing ALOT next season between world cup and 6N so we need to recruit IMO at least one lock plus keep Bullbring, Cummins and Price. Price IMO is a very good operator especially in rolling mauls. He seems to be the only one we have that has a knack of getting through to the ball carrier in defending a driving maul. So next season, we may as well look at our squad without the Welsh internationals as by the time they will be back playing for us, it will not be long before they will be off again for the 6N.

So the squad make up would be (assuming some of these stay):
15. Clayton / Tomi Lewis
14. Johnny McNicholl / Ryan Conbeer
13. Kieran Fonotia / Cory Baldwin
12. Paul Asquith / Steff Hughes - no idea if asquith is heading off, no idea if Hughes is staying, another centre may need to come in. Perhaps both Owen Williams and Sam are coming in. One as a 10 one as a 12.
11. Ioan Nicholas - agree we need a flyer. Someone like Brayden Ennor - young, quick, try scorer, just drafted into Crusaders squad. Or even an experienced flyer, maybe an all black that may have missed out on the World Cup squad.
10. Dan Jones - Already speculated to be in for Sam Davies/Owen Williams
9. Sam Hidalgo Clyne / Kieran Hardy
8. Uzair Cassiem
7. Josh Macleod / Wil Boyde
6. Aaron Shingler - Look to bring in a backrower who is very good at turning the ball over to support cubby.
5. Dai Bullbring - at least 2 locks to come in. One in the mould of Sam Lousi - ex rugby league, good hands, pace, aggression, carrier.
4. Steve Cummins / Tom Price
3. Werner Kruger - We need to keep Kruger as well as finding another. Samson wont be around much next season.
2. Marc Jones / Dafydd Hughes / Taylor Davies - Hookers are fine.
1. Phil Price / Dylan Evans - ideally we can get a loosehead in who will be around all season.

So looking at that, we may end up with after heavy recruiting:
15. Clayton / Tomi Lewis
14. Johnny McNicholl / Ryan Conbeer
13. Kieran Fonotia / Cory Baldwin
12. New Signing / Paul Asquith / Steff Hughes
11. New Signing / Ioan Nicholas
10. Dan Jones /New Signing
9. Sam Hidalgo Clyne / Kieran Hardy
8. Uzair Cassiem / New Signing
7. Josh Macleod / Wil Boyde
6. Aaron Shingler / New Signing
5. New Signing / Dai Bullbring
4. Steve Cummins / Tom Price / New Signing
3. New Signing / Werner Kruger
2. Marc Jones / Dafydd Hughes / Taylor Davies - Hookers are fine.
1. New signing / Phil Price / Dylan Evans

Whether our increased budget will allow for such things is another thing completely, but if we are talking of having European Champions as a goal, then we need to start touting players of real quality.

Every coach likes to sign players they have worked with in the past. If the head man will be Penney, between Canterbury, Munster and Baby Blacks, there is no shortage in quality from 1-15. He already likes to play a style similar to what we play... so he will know exactly who's about to fit into that style.


I believe that if the funding sought comes through then we may well have seen the last of Bulbring & Price & one of O'Brien/Dan. If Kruger signs a one year extension that would be fine but reading between the lines of Pivac's statement he is looking at shopping in Waitrose not Lidl. That is not meant to be in any way disrespectful to these players who have served us well. Clearly two of the four locks who played for South Africa against England would be some levels up on Bulbring & Price - these are the sort of signings that are going to make the top European sides sit up and think.

At the moment Jake & Cummins are our first choice rows, add in two top Internationals plus Rawlins & we have some serious firepower. Back that up with a top carrier at 8 & our pack is now ready to compete. With regard to the 10 situation I think Owen Williams could be a good addition and I would imagine he would jump at the chance as he can't be happy with his current situation. 
Fair points regarding the locks. As for Kruger, he really has been a bit of an unsung hero. I'd like to keep him as well as get in another quality tighthead as we have no quality in this position without Samson and Kruger.
As for Owen, I do wonder if we will be in for Sam and Owen - one as a 10 and one as a 12. Not sure how much game time at 10 Owen has had since leaving, I know he initially had a fair crack at Leicester but then they started playing him 12.
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reesytheexile View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote reesytheexile Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 November 2018 at 12:47pm
Originally posted by Eastern outpost Eastern outpost wrote:

Originally posted by Gate12 Gate12 wrote:

Originally posted by reesytheexile reesytheexile wrote:

How do the WRU justify the financial favouritism to the Ospreys and Blues ?🤔 We would be livid


Favouritism is a bit of a odd way to look at it. It sounds like success and structure (both on and off the pitch) is being recognised and rewarded.

I'd look at it more as how would the wru be able to justify giving them the same.
The options are to fund a business that makes good use of your money and one that shows few signs of so doing.

That is a no brainier.


I am very happy if we get more of the cake but would just love to know the criteria which surely must be disclosed by the WRU as governing body to the Regions in the interest of fairness so they all know the requirements,but guess the justification will all be confidential amongst the 4 Regions.

Money was once based on the outmoded Dual Contracts being offered which were not popular. Perhaps I am just nosey 😉

Edited by reesytheexile - 05 November 2018 at 12:49pm
"I'd rather have been a judge than a miner.Being a miner,as soon as you are too old and tired and sick and stupid to do the job properly,you have to go.The very opposite applies with judges!"P.Cook
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Wil Chips Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 November 2018 at 1:25pm
There’s a consideration here....

Increased funding via the governing body right?

Why would they do that to see regions spend it on NWQ talent?

The Irish system is strictly applied on this, to the point where they move Irish talent around to fill slots and get better coverage.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote BlackwoodScarlet Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 November 2018 at 1:39pm
I dont understand why people want to offload Bulbring hes been one of our better forwards, also he will be WQ next season, Price is another who needs developing, in Wales we dont seem to develop many 6ft8 locks, then add in 1 quality nwq bruising lock for next year
If it bleeds we can can kill it
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote GPR - Rochester Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 November 2018 at 3:26pm
Originally posted by Wil Chips Wil Chips wrote:

There’s a consideration here....

Increased funding via the governing body right?

Why would they do that to see regions spend it on NWQ talent?

The Irish system is strictly applied on this, to the point where they move Irish talent around to fill slots and get better coverage.

That is a very fair point. I wonder how the Dragons & Ospreys would view, Brown, Hill & Beard say moving to the Scarlets or indeed how we would feel if we were told to allow McLoud or Boyde to move for more regular games. Clearly there is only so much Welsh talent available & outside of Faletau I see no No 8 who would get into Leinster's 3rd choice 15.

It does appear that some sensible grown up talking is taking place which is a real breath of fresh air from the old days. The reality of who we would be allowed to sign will be very interesting.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote PE SA Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 November 2018 at 9:35am
Originally posted by GPR - Rochester GPR - Rochester wrote:

Originally posted by Wil Chips Wil Chips wrote:

There’s a consideration here....

Increased funding via the governing body right?

Why would they do that to see regions spend it on NWQ talent?

The Irish system is strictly applied on this, to the point where they move Irish talent around to fill slots and get better coverage.

That is a very fair point. I wonder how the Dragons & Ospreys would view, Brown, Hill & Beard say moving to the Scarlets or indeed how we would feel if we were told to allow McLoud or Boyde to move for more regular games. Clearly there is only so much Welsh talent available & outside of Faletau I see no No 8 who would get into Leinster's 3rd choice 15.

It does appear that some sensible grown up talking is taking place which is a real breath of fresh air from the old days. The reality of who we would be allowed to sign will be very interesting.

looking like Hal Amos may be touting a move from the Dragons...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ffidel Bennett Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 November 2018 at 10:52am
After a helping hand from earlier posts I'd go for-

15. Clayton / Tomi Lewis
14. Johnny McNicholl / Ryan Conbeer
13. Kieran Fonotia / Cory Baldwin
12. Paul Asquith / Steff Hughes  
11. Ioan Nicholas /Tom Prydie / Hallam Amos?
10. Owen Williams? / O'Brien /Dan Jones 
9 Sam Hidalgo Clyne / Kieran Hardy
8. Uzair Cassiem/ heavyweight ball carrier signing
7. Josh Macleod / Wil Boyde/ Dan Davis
6. Rawlins/ Ed Kennedy    assume   Shingler, Cubby and Blade will be on international duty.
5. Dai Bullbring - one  lock to come in. One in the mould of Sam Lousi - ex rugby league, good hands, pace, aggression, carrier.
4. Steve Cummins / Tom Price
3. Werner Kruger/ Gardiner/Sebastien
2. Dafydd Hughes / Taylor Davies
1. Phil Price / Dylan Evans / Rhys Fawcett. 

Overall the above wouldn't require too many signings and maybe only two NWQ in the back 5 of the pack.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote PE SA Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 November 2018 at 11:59am
Originally posted by Ffidel Bennett Ffidel Bennett wrote:

After a helping hand from earlier posts I'd go for-

15. Clayton / Tomi Lewis
14. Johnny McNicholl / Ryan Conbeer
13. Kieran Fonotia / Cory Baldwin
12. Paul Asquith / Steff Hughes  
11. Ioan Nicholas /Tom Prydie / Hallam Amos?
10. Owen Williams? / O'Brien /Dan Jones 
9 Sam Hidalgo Clyne / Kieran Hardy
8. Uzair Cassiem/ heavyweight ball carrier signing
7. Josh Macleod / Wil Boyde/ Dan Davis
6. Rawlins/ Ed Kennedy    assume   Shingler, Cubby and Blade will be on international duty.
5. Dai Bullbring - one  lock to come in. One in the mould of Sam Lousi - ex rugby league, good hands, pace, aggression, carrier.
4. Steve Cummins / Tom Price
3. Werner Kruger/ Gardiner/Sebastien
2. Dafydd Hughes / Taylor Davies
1. Phil Price / Dylan Evans / Rhys Fawcett. 

Overall the above wouldn't require too many signings and maybe only two NWQ in the back 5 of the pack.

i think to seriously mount a challenge for the european cup - as well as keep challenging for the league, I would argue the props dont exactly scream champions.
We have 2 real quality looseheads who wont be with us much, so we need firt team quality there and same goes for tight head. theres no real back up there for Kruger IMO. I forgot kennedy, davis and prydie from my initial list!! Asquith and Hughes could well be off. Asquith as he is a squad player taking up a NWQ slot, Steff Hughes, hardly kicked on in his development. could be room to bring in someone there.

I dont think there will be many signings. but i think there will be a jump in status.

Worth noting also Liam Williams is out of contract - not yet taken up his option of a third year.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote aber-fan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 November 2018 at 1:57pm
Originally posted by PE SA PE SA wrote:

Originally posted by GPR - Rochester GPR - Rochester wrote:

Originally posted by Wil Chips Wil Chips wrote:

There’s a consideration here....

Increased funding via the governing body right?

Why would they do that to see regions spend it on NWQ talent?

The Irish system is strictly applied on this, to the point where they move Irish talent around to fill slots and get better coverage.

That is a very fair point. I wonder how the Dragons & Ospreys would view, Brown, Hill & Beard say moving to the Scarlets or indeed how we would feel if we were told to allow McLoud or Boyde to move for more regular games. Clearly there is only so much Welsh talent available & outside of Faletau I see no No 8 who would get into Leinster's 3rd choice 15.

It does appear that some sensible grown up talking is taking place which is a real breath of fresh air from the old days. The reality of who we would be allowed to sign will be very interesting.

looking like Hal Amos may be touting a move from the Dragons...

Amos is an excellent player, who has had no luck with injuries recently... if a move to the Scarlets could happen, I'd be happy with that.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote SospanMawr Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 November 2018 at 3:13pm
As much as a I like Amos, I’d really prefer us to bring in someone less likely to be with Wales. Next year we already will have Steff, Leigh, Prydie possibly with Wales, as well as McNicholl (if he stays).
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote townboy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 November 2018 at 5:48pm
All regions to get more funding next year,as it looks like central contracts are coming to an end,so it looks like we would now have to pay all our main stars their wages next season and not the split we get now from the wru,this i think would take up a huge increase in our budget so i don't see many signings coming in if this is true..Also heard that the wru want to stop players moving across the regions for more money and are bringing in a pyramid system for players wages..this meaning that a 3 choice player (eg prop,hooker) could get a pay cut if they were on good money under his current contract...Has anyone else heard of this?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote scarletnut Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 November 2018 at 7:08pm
Originally posted by townboy townboy wrote:

All regions to get more funding next year,as it looks like central contracts are coming to an end,so it looks like we would now have to pay all our main stars their wages next season and not the split we get now from the wru,this i think would take up a huge increase in our budget so i don't see many signings coming in if this is true..Also heard that the wru want to stop players moving across the regions for more money and are bringing in a pyramid system for players wages..this meaning that a 3 choice player (eg prop,hooker) could get a pay cut if they were on good money under his current contract...Has anyone else heard of this?
There will be new signings coming in. The budget increasing isn't all down to the WRU
I still wake up late at night and think of what might have been when tim stimpson hit that jammy penalty1
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote PE SA Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 November 2018 at 9:12am
Originally posted by scarletnut scarletnut wrote:

Originally posted by townboy townboy wrote:

All regions to get more funding next year,as it looks like central contracts are coming to an end,so it looks like we would now have to pay all our main stars their wages next season and not the split we get now from the wru,this i think would take up a huge increase in our budget so i don't see many signings coming in if this is true..Also heard that the wru want to stop players moving across the regions for more money and are bringing in a pyramid system for players wages..this meaning that a 3 choice player (eg prop,hooker) could get a pay cut if they were on good money under his current contract...Has anyone else heard of this?
There will be new signings coming in. The budget increasing isn't all down to the WRU

and thats the part I applaud here all round.
WRU increasing their funding - this in effect will cancel out the NDCs...but as noted, its a collective. sponsorship is up, we have had the biggest kit deal ever (say what you like about the brand but they have given us a big deal), plus the benefactors and more.
We are heading in the right direction to realisitcally dream big.
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