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Rhys Webb

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Ffidel Bennett View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ffidel Bennett Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 January 2019 at 1:12pm
So a Webb Frexit on the cards? Let's hope he brings some onions back with him as we shall all be starving here with the empty shelves and not knowing where the next pint of Stella is coming from.
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Dai38 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Dai38 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 January 2019 at 1:44pm
Loyalty means nothing then, if all the better players leave Wales, then our regions will be no more than feeder clubs of the rich.

We must have all the players playing in Wales, we have fewer players than most, the last thing I want (and the WRU) is for the better players to be playing outside Wales.

We do not have the sugar daddys that England & Ireland have, we do not have the money that they have as well. We are punching above our weight, both as a country and regions.

We should abide by the rule, and never pick those players who have less than 60 caps.

I do feel very strong about this, and by the way the same would apply to any Scarlet who left. 

Lets put the future of the game first, not individuals regardless of how good they are.
Be careful when you pick up the stick.........IT MAY BE THE WRONG END!!!!!!!!!!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote GPR - Rochester Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 January 2019 at 1:59pm
Originally posted by Dai38 Dai38 wrote:

Loyalty means nothing then, if all the better players leave Wales, then our regions will be no more than feeder clubs of the rich.

We must have all the players playing in Wales, we have fewer players than most, the last thing I want (and the WRU) is for the better players to be playing outside Wales.

We do not have the sugar daddys that England & Ireland have, we do not have the money that they have as well. We are punching above our weight, both as a country and regions.

We should abide by the rule, and never pick those players who have less than 60 caps.

I do feel very strong about this, and by the way the same would apply to any Scarlet who left. 

Lets put the future of the game first, not individuals regardless of how good they are.

Dai I understand your view but for instance do you really think that Wales would have come up with this scheme if someone like Faletau was short of his 60 caps? 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote tannerbankboy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 January 2019 at 8:18pm
Originally posted by Ffidel Bennett Ffidel Bennett wrote:

So a Webb Frexit on the cards? Let's hope he brings some onions back with him as we shall all be starving here with the empty shelves and not knowing where the next pint of Stella is coming from.
 

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Dai38 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 January 2019 at 8:43pm
GPR, all WRU have fone and followed other countries Australia and South Africa who have similar regulations, so the number of caps is not that important, as it would have been in the region of 50-80, or around x years in Wales honestly Webb did meet either classification.
At the time it was reported how they arrived at 60 caps and I was happy at the time and still am, tough on Webb, Priestland now, and others will come into it.
It will be worse if we go down to 2 regions, then and only then will it change, in my opinion.
Be careful when you pick up the stick.........IT MAY BE THE WRONG END!!!!!!!!!!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Wil Chips Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 January 2019 at 11:46pm
I believe that the new salary bands will actively encourage the departure of top or emerging talent.

Other countries are increasing their wage structures and will be able to cherry pick our talent more so than ever. We are going for austerity on the back of affordability.
Sad times really, and a little lacking in vision.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Dai38 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 January 2019 at 11:50pm
Well World Cup 2019 may be our last real chance of winning for some time then Will.

I agree with your last paragraph


Edited by Dai38 - 29 January 2019 at 11:52pm
Be careful when you pick up the stick.........IT MAY BE THE WRONG END!!!!!!!!!!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Wil Chips Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 January 2019 at 2:31am
It will be an interesting time, not initially, but when existing contracts expire....the bit I’m intrigued by is the likes of Wayne saying most of our players are within the new bands. Most means very little to me if the ones not covered by ‘most’ are our elite players.

But more pertinent is that when those contracts are up. The earnings threshold for the likes of let’s say Cubby, Boyde, Macleod, Elias, Steff Evs, Dan Davis and others will be governed by their international credentials at the time...that can be impacted by so many things...injury, form, coaches selection policy etc...

It’s that sort of muddled thinking that got the likes of James King, Lydiate, Bradley Davies, Dan Baker, Rhys Webb, Dan Biggar, Baldwin, Rhodri Jones and others an NDC.

Set a baseline earning by all means, but setting a ceiling is asking for trouble.



Edited by Wil Chips - 30 January 2019 at 2:46am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Wil Chips Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 January 2019 at 2:33am
In summary, and I shouldn’t muck up the thread so I’ll leave it after this.

Applying earning ceilings in any business has one guaranteed, and several variable, outcomes.

The guarantee is that individuals will look outside for alternates if they believe they can attain better.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ladram Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 January 2019 at 7:51am
Originally posted by Wil Chips Wil Chips wrote:

In summary, and I shouldn’t muck up the thread so I’ll leave it after this.

Applying earning ceilings in any business has one guaranteed, and several variable, outcomes.

The guarantee is that individuals will look outside for alternates if they believe they can attain better.
so much for project reset enabling a region to win H CUP it seems reading your posts wil it will have the opposite effect and have us even weaker in Europe.
30th june 1986- 30th june 2011.25 years roofing,i wouldn't call that dodgy.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote GPR - Rochester Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 January 2019 at 9:32am
Originally posted by ladram ladram wrote:

Originally posted by Wil Chips Wil Chips wrote:

In summary, and I shouldn’t muck up the thread so I’ll leave it after this.

Applying earning ceilings in any business has one guaranteed, and several variable, outcomes.

The guarantee is that individuals will look outside for alternates if they believe they can attain better.
so much for project reset enabling a region to win H CUP it seems reading your posts wil it will have the opposite effect and have us even weaker in Europe.

Wil I couldn't agree more. Nigel you are right - we were sold Project Reset as a brave attempt to reward regions with the ambition & playing/coaching resources to aim high. What have we got - a bloody mess it appears. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote PE SA Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 January 2019 at 9:42am
Originally posted by tannerbankboy tannerbankboy wrote:

Originally posted by Ffidel Bennett Ffidel Bennett wrote:

So a Webb Frexit on the cards? Let's hope he brings some onions back with him as we shall all be starving here with the empty shelves and not knowing where the next pint of Stella is coming from.
 

Belgium


Actually Stella is now made in two places - Newport and Northampton. The water in Stella is actually from the river severn...think of that next time you drink it! Dead
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote GPR - Rochester Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 January 2019 at 9:45am
Originally posted by Dai38 Dai38 wrote:

GPR, all WRU have fone and followed other countries Australia and South Africa who have similar regulations, so the number of caps is not that important, as it would have been in the region of 50-80, or around x years in Wales honestly Webb did meet either classification.
At the time it was reported how they arrived at 60 caps and I was happy at the time and still am, tough on Webb, Priestland now, and others will come into it.
It will be worse if we go down to 2 regions, then and only then will it change, in my opinion.

Dai you say x years in Wales. Well Rhys played regional rugby for 10 years - how much do you beleive is enough? If we had to follow other countries why didn't we follow Ireland. They are pretty strict but do not cut their noses off to spite their faces. Exceptions are/will be made -- that is all I am asking for. The coaches must be allowed to select their best 23 regardless. As for keeping players at the regions then other factors other than money surely come into it. There is no way AWJ has stayed in Welsh rugby for purely financial reasons. 

Gatland, at the moment, is faced with the ridiculous situation that if Cawdor gets a long term injury he will have to select a rookie in Tomas Williams. Now this lad is a good prospect but in a possible quarter final of the World Cup - absolute nonsense in my opinion. 

As for picking Webb upsetting the other 9's in the squad - I would tell them to get over it. Are you a better player is all that should matter at the very top end of the game. The Irish system works because the exceptions would only relate to a few key players. For instance in the Welsh squad at the moment it would only probably apply to 3 players - AWJ, Faletau & Foxy.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Dai38 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 January 2019 at 10:06am
GPR I respect your views and we differ, the last thing I'll say is that Gatland was heavily involved in the decision, and some say instrumental in the decision.
He had the opportunity to change the criteria, but didn't, and on past decisions involving the team, he gets his way.
Let's all start now  and support the 15 on the park.
Be careful when you pick up the stick.........IT MAY BE THE WRONG END!!!!!!!!!!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote GPR - Rochester Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 January 2019 at 10:21am
Originally posted by Dai38 Dai38 wrote:

GPR I respect your views and we differ, the last thing I'll say is that Gatland was heavily involved in the decision, and some say instrumental in the decision.
He had the opportunity to change the criteria, but didn't, and on past decisions involving the team, he gets his way.
Let's all start now  and support the 15 on the park.

Couldn't agree more. Ymlaen!!!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote NobbySosban Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 January 2019 at 10:52am
WRU have clearly stated that, to play for Wales, you must play in Wales. There are clear, understandable exceptions (60+ caps, uncapped players, those who have pre-existing commitments), but Rhys Webb was the first and, so far, only senior casualty of this policy. To perform a u-turn now (other than in exceptional circumstances) would undermine that whole policy. Perhaps it's enough to persuade Webb to return to Wales - if his family hasn't settled in France, perhaps that might be a double blessing, but I agree that it's an invidious decision for him to have to make.

Project Reset was never going to magic up a load more money in Welsh rugby. It can, however, start to channel what money there is to the right areas, in a joined-up way, to start making a difference, and to look for efficiencies to save & reallocate money to help resource the regions against an ever-rising tide of European budgets.

The biggest card the WRU has to play is the Wales shirt - each player will have a premium which may tempt him out of Wales, particularly after a World Cup year, but the strategy is set to keep our stars and top prospects in the country. Imposing wage bands is a slightly clunky and artificial way of getting a grip on player budgets - market forces will always exert pressure eventually - but everyone is signing up to it for the common good.

Not for the good of some players' wages, of course, so I understand their concerns, but the plan has to be tried in the medium term, to stop the regions bidding against each other and use Wales caps as a primary incentive.

The hope and plan then is that new revenues can be generated which will improve the situation for all in Wales. Player wage inflation is a massive factor, so this may end up in Welsh rugby running to stand still, but something has to be tried and, at the very least, we're all trying to pull together.
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