Scarlet Fever Llanelli Rugby Sport Wales Tickets Homepage
Forum Home Forum Home > RUGBY > SCARLETS GENERAL
  New Posts New Posts
  FAQ FAQ  Forum Search   Register Register  Login Login


Scarlets-Ospreys Plan - Some facts

 Post Reply Post Reply Page  123 24>
Author
Message
NobbySosban View Drop Down
Veteran
Veteran
Avatar

Joined: 30 June 2010
Location: Sir Berk
Status: Offline
Points: 5288
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (5) Thanks(5)   Quote NobbySosban Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Scarlets-Ospreys Plan - Some facts
    Posted: 05 March 2019 at 7:52am
Too much hysteria on the subject.

Edited by NobbySosban - 05 March 2019 at 5:46pm
Back to Top
Sponsored Links


Back to Top
Mike View Drop Down
Moderator Group
Moderator Group


Joined: 16 August 2004
Location: Cardiff
Status: Offline
Points: 21882
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (8) Thanks(8)   Quote Mike Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 March 2019 at 8:01am
If we had assurance that this will be a continuation of the Scarlets brand, that would be fine. Until we do, the last thing we should offer is patience and understanding. The strength of feeling has to be felt by our board right now. They should not be allowed to effectively kill off the Scarlets, and frankly shame on them if they are even considering it just to “help out” the Ospreys who have mismanaged themselves into the ground.

This is suicidal nonsense. The team has to Scarlet branded. Small tweaks, some evolved identity could possibly be swallowed but if we’re not chanting Scarlets then it’s finished.

Edited by Mike - 05 March 2019 at 8:01am
Back to Top
Cwmgwuan View Drop Down
Newbie
Newbie
Avatar

Joined: 04 March 2019
Location: Carmarthen
Status: Offline
Points: 63
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Cwmgwuan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 March 2019 at 8:02am
Thank you for clearing this up. Its a stressful time for Welsh rugby and i hope common sense prevails
Back to Top
salmidach View Drop Down
Veteran
Veteran
Avatar

Joined: 15 August 2004
Location: I Love Llanelli
Status: Offline
Points: 12505
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote salmidach Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 March 2019 at 8:04am
Originally posted by Mike Mike wrote:

If we had assurance that this will be a continuation of the Scarlets brand, that would be fine. Until we do, the last thing we should offer is patience and understanding. The strength of feeling has to be felt by our board right now. They should not be allowed to effectively kill off the Scarlets, and frankly shame on them if they are even considering it just to “help out” the Ospreys who have mismanaged themselves into the ground.

This is suicidal nonsense. The team has to Scarlet branded. Small tweaks, some evolved identity could possibly be swallowed but if we’re not chanting Scarlets then it’s finished.


Completely correct and loving your passion Mike.
They say a little knowledge is a dangerous thing, but it's not one half so bad as a lot of ignorance - Terry Pratchett
Back to Top
multinational View Drop Down
Veteran
Veteran
Avatar

Joined: 14 August 2006
Location: Here
Status: Offline
Points: 10372
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (5) Thanks(5)   Quote multinational Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 March 2019 at 8:09am
So the underlying facts are:
 
If we do nothing, the ospreys go to the wall regardless.
The Blues have already said they won't compromise their position - so that is not an option.
 
So essentially the Ospreys have no bargaining chips at all.
 
If we compromise any part of our identity for this deal we are absolutely mental - and I can tell you now it will drive thousands of Scarlet fans away from the game.
History, despite its wrenching pain, cannot be unlived, but if faced with courage, need not be lived again.
Back to Top
Bryn@man View Drop Down
Veteran
Veteran
Avatar

Joined: 16 March 2006
Location: Y Gwter Fawr
Status: Offline
Points: 4473
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (4) Thanks(4)   Quote Bryn@man Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 March 2019 at 8:11am
Struggling to see how a 'merger' is any better than letting nature take its course with the Ospreys. Diluting or losing our identity is simply unacceptable.
Back to Top
gnasher1975 View Drop Down
Veteran
Veteran
Avatar

Joined: 20 March 2005
Status: Offline
Points: 1642
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote gnasher1975 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 March 2019 at 8:11am
Originally posted by multinational multinational wrote:

So the underlying facts are:
 
If we do nothing, the ospreys go to the wall regardless.
The Blues have already said they won't compromise their position - so that is not an option.
 
So essentially the Ospreys have no bargaining chips at all.
 
If we compromise any part of our identity for this deal we are absolutely mental - and I can tell you now it will drive thousands of Scarlet fans away from the game.

I can't see us doing that Nigel short and co are no mugs and as you say the ospreys have no bargaining chips.
Back to Top
Mugwuffin View Drop Down
Veteran
Veteran
Avatar

Joined: 24 July 2010
Location: Llanelli
Status: Offline
Points: 5640
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (2) Thanks(2)   Quote Mugwuffin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 March 2019 at 8:18am
I think facts are in short supply at this stage, but what you posted is probably pretty accurate, IMO.

What I can’t understand is why we’d be willing to “merge”. The rumours are that the Ospreys benefactors are willing to put money into this new hybrid entity. If they’re bringing money to the table they will want influence and concessions from us. The question is, why would they put money into this proposed new team but not use it to keep what they’ve already built going?

Any concessions we make for them in terms of branding will be extremely tough to stomach for most Scarlets fans. No concessions we make will ever be enough for most Ospreys fans. This has all the makings of a disaster. Two fan bases will be alienated, crowds will likely be smaller than either team pulls in currently, money will be wasted in trying (in vain) to placate the two sets of fans, and in a few short years the WRU will be scratching its head wondering why the West and South-West of Wales doesn’t produce as many talented players as it did when there were two teams covering those areas instead of one.

We need to be very noisy in opposition to this. Perhaps a joint petition with Ospreys fans against this merger, with a threat to boycott any hybrid team, is the way to go. If we make it clear this decision will be bad for business they will surely have to listen.
Back to Top
Kentexile View Drop Down
Newbie
Newbie
Avatar

Joined: 24 August 2013
Location: Kent
Status: Offline
Points: 72
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Kentexile Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 March 2019 at 8:20am
A N Wales region will need funding. Going down that route reminds me of the number of failed attempts to establish professional rugby league in S Wales based on population and general interest which have been insufficient to sustain the experiment beyond a couple of seasons. Whilst there aren’t many professional sports teams of any description in N Wales the real competition is with the English football teams just across the border. Whilst the Ospreys are in financial difficulties they are a recognised brand in the rugby heartland who have generated decent attendance when successful (same as any team really ) and if there is funding to do something in N Wales then it may be better to preserve the Ospreys rather than investing in a potential white elephant and possibly causing Irreparable damage to the Scarlets brand and alienating rugby supporters in Wales second largest city
Back to Top
Wil Chips View Drop Down
Rambler
Rambler
Avatar

Joined: 23 August 2009
Location: Africa
Status: Offline
Points: 41976
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (2) Thanks(2)   Quote Wil Chips Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 March 2019 at 8:29am
Originally posted by multinational multinational wrote:


So the underlying facts are:
 
If we do nothing, the ospreys go to the wall regardless.
The Blues have already said they won't compromise their position - so that is not an option.
 
So essentially the Ospreys have no bargaining chips at all.
 
If we compromise any part of our identity for this deal we are absolutely mental - and I can tell you now it will drive thousands of Scarlet fans away from the game.



The O’s have contracted players as a chip.

They liquidate themselves and all contracts are null and void and it’s open season for all to pile in for those signatures.

That won’t end well for the WRU or Wales.
Back to Top
multinational View Drop Down
Veteran
Veteran
Avatar

Joined: 14 August 2006
Location: Here
Status: Offline
Points: 10372
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote multinational Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 March 2019 at 8:34am
Originally posted by Wil Chips Wil Chips wrote:

Originally posted by multinational multinational wrote:


So the underlying facts are:
 
If we do nothing, the ospreys go to the wall regardless.
The Blues have already said they won't compromise their position - so that is not an option.
 
So essentially the Ospreys have no bargaining chips at all.
 
If we compromise any part of our identity for this deal we are absolutely mental - and I can tell you now it will drive thousands of Scarlet fans away from the game.



The O’s have contracted players as a chip.

They liquidate themselves and all contracts are null and void and it’s open season for all to pile in for those signatures.

That won’t end well for the WRU or Wales.
 
So we negotiate based on signing a few of their players?
 
No thanks. As great as they are, I'd rather stick with what we have and trust our benefactors and pathway to develop via another route
History, despite its wrenching pain, cannot be unlived, but if faced with courage, need not be lived again.
Back to Top
Rob o'r Bont View Drop Down
Veteran
Veteran
Avatar
Dr. Optimist

Joined: 03 May 2008
Location: Bont
Status: Offline
Points: 11858
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Rob o'r Bont Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 March 2019 at 8:46am
Thanks for the info Nobby.  Also Mike, great post.

I'm pretty confident that our board will steer us through what is set to be a watershed moment in Welsh rugby, and they will do so with the full understanding of what it means to be Scarlet. 
That's the Scarlets, its in their DNA.
Back to Top
Haruki View Drop Down
Newbie
Newbie


Joined: 20 March 2015
Location: Wrexham
Status: Offline
Points: 35
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Haruki Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 March 2019 at 8:49am
I am a North Wales Scarlets fan so mixed emotions on the whole scenario. I have long thought the North deserves full region status and that the interest is there based on RGC's Premiership attendances and sold out U20 games. It will also be good for welsh Rugby to have a better standard of player production in the North.
ON the flip side as a Scarlets fan a full blown Merger with O's is unpalatable. If the O's are the ones broke and in trouble then if we just swallow them up and take their best players and their feeder clubs etc under the Scarlets brand, play majority of games at Parc y Scarlets and chuck a token couple of games to Swansea then that would be acceptable but no a full merger to form a new club with a new name and branding etc
Back to Top
thommo View Drop Down
Veteran
Veteran


Joined: 26 March 2005
Status: Offline
Points: 1192
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote thommo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 March 2019 at 8:50am
This is a case of damage limitation for the WRU, in a perverse way we could hugely benefit, but only if we keep our identity and stadium. If we are rebranded the western scarlets i for one could live with that. If we have significant financial reward for the merger then that may enable us to compete with the likes of saracens and leinster.
Wonder what moar makes of all the permetstions.
Back to Top
Rob o'r Bont View Drop Down
Veteran
Veteran
Avatar
Dr. Optimist

Joined: 03 May 2008
Location: Bont
Status: Offline
Points: 11858
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Rob o'r Bont Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 March 2019 at 8:50am
Originally posted by multinational multinational wrote:

Originally posted by Wil Chips Wil Chips wrote:

Originally posted by multinational multinational wrote:


So the underlying facts are:
 
If we do nothing, the ospreys go to the wall regardless.
The Blues have already said they won't compromise their position - so that is not an option.
 
So essentially the Ospreys have no bargaining chips at all.
 
If we compromise any part of our identity for this deal we are absolutely mental - and I can tell you now it will drive thousands of Scarlet fans away from the game.



The O’s have contracted players as a chip.

They liquidate themselves and all contracts are null and void and it’s open season for all to pile in for those signatures.

That won’t end well for the WRU or Wales.
 
So we negotiate based on signing a few of their players?
 
No thanks. As great as they are, I'd rather stick with what we have and trust our benefactors and pathway to develop via another route
It's not just a few of their players, the bargaining chip is the region itself, all it's people, current and future players.  The geographical region has a track record of developing exceptional players who have gone on to be Wales and British Lions stars.  If the Scarlets take over this player pathway then we will be unbeatable in my opinion........

........But not at the expense of our own brand, which would be suicidal.


Edited by Rob o'r Bont - 05 March 2019 at 8:53am
That's the Scarlets, its in their DNA.
Back to Top
Rich (Bris) View Drop Down
Veteran
Veteran


Joined: 23 August 2007
Status: Offline
Points: 1412
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Rich (Bris) Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 March 2019 at 9:00am
Ospreys fans won't come to watch a merged team at PYS anyway, so why (if this the plan) destroy 2 identities and mess up what Scarlets have created over all the years???
Back to Top
 Post Reply Post Reply Page  123 24>
  Share Topic   

Forum Jump Forum Permissions View Drop Down

Forum Software by Web Wiz Forums® version 12.01
Copyright ©2001-2018 Web Wiz Ltd.

This page was generated in 0.063 seconds.