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The Brexit bonus...

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roy munster View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote roy munster Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 September 2019 at 4:40pm
So UK puts in £9.8 billion more than it gets out but out of this £9.8billion loss Wales gets £200 million but the rest of UK spends £10 billion so that makes it a good deal? Really? 
ROYMOND MUNTER MBE (FOR SERVICES TO THE COMBOVER)
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote SospanMawr Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 September 2019 at 6:31pm
Originally posted by GPR - Rochester GPR - Rochester wrote:

Originally posted by SospanMawr SospanMawr wrote:

Germany exported £75.1bn to us in 2016. They have a larger GDP than us.
France exported £37.6bn to us in 2016. They have a similar GDP to us.

In the same year we exported £235.8bn to the EU.

Germany imported £49.1bn from us in 2016.
France imported £33.8bn from us.

In the same year we imported £318bn from the EU.

The idea that these countries will “feel the pain” more than us is a bit delusional. We’re cutting ties with our largest trade partner for no particularly good reason, except for blue passports and “getting our sovereignty back”.

Your figures corroborate my statement about Germany & France. From where I sit any country which exports more than it imports from another country will feel the pain if there is a sudden change in trading conditions. I am not really going to comment on your last frivolous comment as life is too short to keep repeating the reasons I chose to leave.
Well done for completely avoiding my point.

You don’t see dropping or having to renegotiate a deal which sees us sell £230bn+ and buy £318bn in an easy, no fuss and low tariff model as a negative? How?

You don’t see dropping or having to renegotiate a deal which sees us bring in vital medicine, fresh food and high tech machinery in an easy no fuss low tariff model as a negative?

How many small businesses will fold? How many medium businesses will be bought up by Americans etc on the cheap? How many large businesses will leave?

How many people die due to a lack of medicine? How many people go without fresh food in the winter, or see prices rise? 


Edited by SospanMawr - 11 September 2019 at 6:35pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Mike Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 September 2019 at 7:13am
The Government’s “reasonable worst case” planning assumptions about the impact of no deal brexit. Now do people understand why so many politicians are trying to block this ludicrous outcome?

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote GPR - Rochester Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 September 2019 at 8:20am
Originally posted by SospanMawr SospanMawr wrote:

Originally posted by GPR - Rochester GPR - Rochester wrote:

Originally posted by SospanMawr SospanMawr wrote:

Germany exported £75.1bn to us in 2016. They have a larger GDP than us.
France exported £37.6bn to us in 2016. They have a similar GDP to us.

In the same year we exported £235.8bn to the EU.

Germany imported £49.1bn from us in 2016.
France imported £33.8bn from us.

In the same year we imported £318bn from the EU.

The idea that these countries will “feel the pain” more than us is a bit delusional. We’re cutting ties with our largest trade partner for no particularly good reason, except for blue passports and “getting our sovereignty back”.

Your figures corroborate my statement about Germany & France. From where I sit any country which exports more than it imports from another country will feel the pain if there is a sudden change in trading conditions. I am not really going to comment on your last frivolous comment as life is too short to keep repeating the reasons I chose to leave.
Well done for completely avoiding my point.

You don’t see dropping or having to renegotiate a deal which sees us sell £230bn+ and buy £318bn in an easy, no fuss and low tariff model as a negative? How?

You don’t see dropping or having to renegotiate a deal which sees us bring in vital medicine, fresh food and high tech machinery in an easy no fuss low tariff model as a negative?

How many small businesses will fold? How many medium businesses will be bought up by Americans etc on the cheap? How many large businesses will leave?

How many people die due to a lack of medicine? How many people go without fresh food in the winter, or see prices rise? 

Easy, no fuss model - how much business have you been involved in selling to & buying from Europe?To describe it as no fuss & easy is nonsense. Of course there will be bumps in the road if the no deal scenario transpires but that is why we have a Government who if they do their jobs can firstly minimise the impacts at the border & compensate individual groups with particular problems. 

Some of your comments are really classic project fear material and posing the question of how many people would die is totally irresponsible & without any sensible foundation. Additionally not even yellow hammer predicts people going without fresh food - it says there could be shortages and there could be price increases in the short term. I have absolutely no problem if I cannot buy some bananas or imported vegetables for 3-6 months. I will, like any sensible person, make do with what is seasonally available in the UK. Not only will that benefit my local economy but also reduce my carbon footprint.

Project fear espoused by no backbone remainers will no doubt approve your hysterical mutterings but from where I sit you have lost the plot!!!!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote SospanMawr Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 September 2019 at 10:49am
Ah yes, avoided my key points yet again, focus on a small part of what I brought up (fresh fruit) and finish by insulting me.

Sensible grown up response that is. You seem to take a lot of influence from Messrs Rees-Mogg, Johnson and Farage.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote roy munster Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 September 2019 at 12:38pm
The mere fact the EU will not compromise and are happy to see UK leave with no deal, shows the EU leaders dont care and would allow tariffs to be put on the UK which will have massive ramifications on businesses right across the EU too. The fact the EU doesn't seem to care about the tariffs shows where their priority lies, themselves. Their primary concern is not the prosperity of its people or of these thousands of businesses to be hit for billions of unnecessary tariffs. But instead it is to maintain and grow their power base. Heaven help anyone who democratically decides not to finance their endless gravy train 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote SospanMawr Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 September 2019 at 12:54pm
Originally posted by roy munster roy munster wrote:

The mere fact the EU will not compromise and are happy to see UK leave with no deal, shows the EU leaders dont care and would allow tariffs to be put on the UK which will have massive ramifications on businesses right across the EU too. The fact the EU doesn't seem to care about the tariffs shows where their priority lies, themselves. Their primary concern is not the prosperity of its people or of these thousands of businesses to be hit for billions of unnecessary tariffs. But instead it is to maintain and grow their power base. Heaven help anyone who democratically decides not to finance their endless gravy train 
Why would they care? We’re the ones who’re leaving, who are wasting their time with repeatedly offering them deals they have said they’re not going to accept, and by insulting their leadership at nearly every turn?

If a player decides to leave the Scarlets, is it the Scarlets responsibility to find his next club? No.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote roy munster Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 September 2019 at 1:14pm
Originally posted by SospanMawr SospanMawr wrote:

Originally posted by roy munster roy munster wrote:

The mere fact the EU will not compromise and are happy to see UK leave with no deal, shows the EU leaders dont care and would allow tariffs to be put on the UK which will have massive ramifications on businesses right across the EU too. The fact the EU doesn't seem to care about the tariffs shows where their priority lies, themselves. Their primary concern is not the prosperity of its people or of these thousands of businesses to be hit for billions of unnecessary tariffs. But instead it is to maintain and grow their power base. Heaven help anyone who democratically decides not to finance their endless gravy train 
Why would they care? We’re the ones who’re leaving, who are wasting their time with repeatedly offering them deals they have said they’re not going to accept, and by insulting their leadership at nearly every turn?

If a player decides to leave the Scarlets, is it the Scarlets responsibility to find his next club? No.

Why would they care about EU businesses hit with huge tariffs costing companies billions across europe?
Are you serious? 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mike Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 September 2019 at 1:24pm
Originally posted by roy munster roy munster wrote:

The mere fact the EU will not compromise and are happy to see UK leave with no deal, shows the EU leaders dont care and would allow tariffs to be put on the UK which will have massive ramifications on businesses right across the EU too. The fact the EU doesn't seem to care about the tariffs shows where their priority lies, themselves. Their primary concern is not the prosperity of its people or of these thousands of businesses to be hit for billions of unnecessary tariffs. But instead it is to maintain and grow their power base. Heaven help anyone who democratically decides not to finance their endless gravy train 
 
They offered a range of deals. We agreed one with them, but it couldn't get through Parliament.
 
We say drop the backstop, even though it was our idea. They say ok, but replace it with what? We don't know.
 
It's teh EU's fault!!!111!
 
Can't you see what a shambolic mess we are? We haven't got a clue what we're doing. We're winging it day by day.


Edited by Mike - 12 September 2019 at 1:25pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote SospanMawr Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 September 2019 at 2:21pm
Originally posted by roy munster roy munster wrote:

Originally posted by SospanMawr SospanMawr wrote:

Originally posted by roy munster roy munster wrote:

The mere fact the EU will not compromise and are happy to see UK leave with no deal, shows the EU leaders dont care and would allow tariffs to be put on the UK which will have massive ramifications on businesses right across the EU too. The fact the EU doesn't seem to care about the tariffs shows where their priority lies, themselves. Their primary concern is not the prosperity of its people or of these thousands of businesses to be hit for billions of unnecessary tariffs. But instead it is to maintain and grow their power base. Heaven help anyone who democratically decides not to finance their endless gravy train 
Why would they care? We’re the ones who’re leaving, who are wasting their time with repeatedly offering them deals they have said they’re not going to accept, and by insulting their leadership at nearly every turn?

If a player decides to leave the Scarlets, is it the Scarlets responsibility to find his next club? No.

Why would they care about EU businesses hit with huge tariffs costing companies billions across europe?
Are you serious? 
They know they are strong in numbers. We were too until we voted to leave. 

We are the ones being unreasonable. We are the ones wasting their time, again and again. We are the ones insulting their leadership etc. 

They have all the power. They’re not going to give us a great deal just because we ask nicely. This is business. They know that yes, Brexit is bad for the EU. But they know it’s worse for us, and in all likelihood we need them more than they need us.

This is global business and politics. You take advantage when your opposing negotiators are in a weak position and we can’t get in much of a weaker position. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote roy munster Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 September 2019 at 3:11pm
Originally posted by Mike Mike wrote:

Originally posted by roy munster roy munster wrote:

The mere fact the EU will not compromise and are happy to see UK leave with no deal, shows the EU leaders dont care and would allow tariffs to be put on the UK which will have massive ramifications on businesses right across the EU too. The fact the EU doesn't seem to care about the tariffs shows where their priority lies, themselves. Their primary concern is not the prosperity of its people or of these thousands of businesses to be hit for billions of unnecessary tariffs. But instead it is to maintain and grow their power base. Heaven help anyone who democratically decides not to finance their endless gravy train 
 
They offered a range of deals. We agreed one with them, but it couldn't get through Parliament.
 
We say drop the backstop, even though it was our idea. They say ok, but replace it with what? We don't know.
 
It's teh EU's fault!!!111!
 
Can't you see what a shambolic mess we are? We haven't got a clue what we're doing. We're winging it day by day.

The eu want to put a border across ireland its up to them to offer solutions.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote roy munster Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 September 2019 at 3:14pm
Originally posted by SospanMawr SospanMawr wrote:

Originally posted by roy munster roy munster wrote:

Originally posted by SospanMawr SospanMawr wrote:

Originally posted by roy munster roy munster wrote:

The mere fact the EU will not compromise and are happy to see UK leave with no deal, shows the EU leaders dont care and would allow tariffs to be put on the UK which will have massive ramifications on businesses right across the EU too. The fact the EU doesn't seem to care about the tariffs shows where their priority lies, themselves. Their primary concern is not the prosperity of its people or of these thousands of businesses to be hit for billions of unnecessary tariffs. But instead it is to maintain and grow their power base. Heaven help anyone who democratically decides not to finance their endless gravy train 
Why would they care? We’re the ones who’re leaving, who are wasting their time with repeatedly offering them deals they have said they’re not going to accept, and by insulting their leadership at nearly every turn?

If a player decides to leave the Scarlets, is it the Scarlets responsibility to find his next club? No.

Why would they care about EU businesses hit with huge tariffs costing companies billions across europe?
Are you serious? 
They know they are strong in numbers. We were too until we voted to leave. 

We are the ones being unreasonable. We are the ones wasting their time, again and again. We are the ones insulting their leadership etc. 

They have all the power. They’re not going to give us a great deal just because we ask nicely. This is business. They know that yes, Brexit is bad for the EU. But they know it’s worse for us, and in all likelihood we need them more than they need us.

This is global business and politics. You take advantage when your opposing negotiators are in a weak position and we can’t get in much of a weaker position. 

None of what youve just said remotely addresses my post. The EU hitting us with tariffs will have massive repercussions for thousands of businesses within the eu costing eu businesses billions. Yet the EU dont seem to care about that? That is totally irresponsible and selfish of those eurocrats who are prepared to destroy not just the Uk economy but EU economies too just to try and grab more money for themselves and punish any nation who dares to leave and claim back their own sovereignty
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote SospanMawr Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 September 2019 at 3:33pm
What nonsense. The EU are perfectly entitled to put tariffs on us if we are no longer part of their free market.

The fact that you think it’ll destroy the UK economy is exactly what remainers have been warning about all along. Believe it or not, it’ll be Brexit’s fault, not the EU’s.

We have no right to free trade. We are part of a free market now, and we are trying to leave. Any repercussions are on us, not the EU.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote ap sior Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 September 2019 at 3:56pm
Ultimately if a person decides to leave a building of their own free will, and then freezes outside in the cold weather, the fault lies with the person who left, not with those still left in the room.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mike Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 September 2019 at 5:37pm
Originally posted by roy munster roy munster wrote:

Originally posted by SospanMawr SospanMawr wrote:

Originally posted by roy munster roy munster wrote:

Originally posted by SospanMawr SospanMawr wrote:

Originally posted by roy munster roy munster wrote:

The mere fact the EU will not compromise and are happy to see UK leave with no deal, shows the EU leaders dont care and would allow tariffs to be put on the UK which will have massive ramifications on businesses right across the EU too. The fact the EU doesn't seem to care about the tariffs shows where their priority lies, themselves. Their primary concern is not the prosperity of its people or of these thousands of businesses to be hit for billions of unnecessary tariffs. But instead it is to maintain and grow their power base. Heaven help anyone who democratically decides not to finance their endless gravy train 
Why would they care? We’re the ones who’re leaving, who are wasting their time with repeatedly offering them deals they have said they’re not going to accept, and by insulting their leadership at nearly every turn?

If a player decides to leave the Scarlets, is it the Scarlets responsibility to find his next club? No.

Why would they care about EU businesses hit with huge tariffs costing companies billions across europe?
Are you serious? 
They know they are strong in numbers. We were too until we voted to leave. 

We are the ones being unreasonable. We are the ones wasting their time, again and again. We are the ones insulting their leadership etc. 

They have all the power. They’re not going to give us a great deal just because we ask nicely. This is business. They know that yes, Brexit is bad for the EU. But they know it’s worse for us, and in all likelihood we need them more than they need us.

This is global business and politics. You take advantage when your opposing negotiators are in a weak position and we can’t get in much of a weaker position. 

None of what youve just said remotely addresses my post. The EU hitting us with tariffs will have massive repercussions for thousands of businesses within the eu costing eu businesses billions. Yet the EU dont seem to care about that? That is totally irresponsible and selfish of those eurocrats who are prepared to destroy not just the Uk economy but EU economies too just to try and grab more money for themselves and punish any nation who dares to leave and claim back their own sovereignty

So you want us to have the benefits of the single market but none of the obligations the other 27 countries have?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote henry_winkler Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 September 2019 at 6:27pm
 I like that they have a minister to preserve the European way of life, yet they've artificially changed the landscape of so many countries and communities. Moved factories like Ford and Hoover to eastern Europe and replaced them with meat packing plants that only really provide jobs for eastern Europeans. 

I think it will have to go to another referendum before we are done. 

But leaving with no deal on Oct 29th doesn't mean there'll never be a deal, it may be the thing that gets all parties sat around the table and negotiating fairly for once then we may see a deal struck within a few months.

I've had enough now though, I'd vote remain in a new referendum because they've worn me down but the Tories should face charges for the mess they've made and all the honours they've just had should be revoked.
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