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The Brexit bonus...

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Mike View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Mike Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 November 2018 at 4:41pm
Regardless of the extent to which Brexit has influenced Schaeffler, the UK withdrawing from the European Single Market and Customs Union will put UK-based business with pan-European operations and supply chains at a permanent disadvantage in the future. That is beyond doubt. Moving parts, exporting and importing will not be as straightforward as it will be within the EU27.
The consequence of that will be reduced investment in the UK.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote SospanMawr Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 November 2018 at 5:27pm
Originally posted by Mike Mike wrote:


Regardless of the extent to which Brexit has influenced Schaeffler, the UK withdrawing from the European Single Market and Customs Union will put UK-based business with pan-European operations and supply chains at a permanent disadvantage in the future. That is beyond doubt. Moving parts, exporting and importing will not be as straightforward as it will be within the EU27.
The consequence of that will be reduced investment in the UK.
Well said Mike. Unbelievable that we as a country, actually voted to reduce our business and influence with the rest of the world.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote salmidach Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 November 2018 at 5:51pm
Originally posted by SospanMawr SospanMawr wrote:

Originally posted by Mike Mike wrote:


Regardless of the extent to which Brexit has influenced Schaeffler, the UK withdrawing from the European Single Market and Customs Union will put UK-based business with pan-European operations and supply chains at a permanent disadvantage in the future. That is beyond doubt. Moving parts, exporting and importing will not be as straightforward as it will be within the EU27.
The consequence of that will be reduced investment in the UK.
Well said Mike. Unbelievable that we as a country, actually voted to reduce our business and influence with the rest of the world.

Rest of the EU?
They say a little knowledge is a dangerous thing, but it's not one half so bad as a lot of ignorance - Terry Pratchett
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (2) Thanks(2)   Quote Mike Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 November 2018 at 6:01pm
Originally posted by SospanMawr SospanMawr wrote:

Originally posted by Mike Mike wrote:


Regardless of the extent to which Brexit has influenced Schaeffler, the UK withdrawing from the European Single Market and Customs Union will put UK-based business with pan-European operations and supply chains at a permanent disadvantage in the future. That is beyond doubt. Moving parts, exporting and importing will not be as straightforward as it will be within the EU27.
The consequence of that will be reduced investment in the UK.
Well said Mike. Unbelievable that we as a country, actually voted to reduce our business and influence with the rest of the world.


Hopefully we’ll get a chance to reverse this idiocy before it’s too late. It will be bad for the UK and terrible for Wales.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote SospanMawr Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 November 2018 at 7:12pm
Originally posted by salmidach salmidach wrote:

Originally posted by SospanMawr SospanMawr wrote:

Originally posted by Mike Mike wrote:


Regardless of the extent to which Brexit has influenced Schaeffler, the UK withdrawing from the European Single Market and Customs Union will put UK-based business with pan-European operations and supply chains at a permanent disadvantage in the future. That is beyond doubt. Moving parts, exporting and importing will not be as straightforward as it will be within the EU27.
The consequence of that will be reduced investment in the UK.
Well said Mike. Unbelievable that we as a country, actually voted to reduce our business and influence with the rest of the world.


Rest of the EU?
The EU are a large chunk of the business operating world, no? So why cut ourselves off from them by leaving the single market?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote totallybiasedscarlet Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 November 2018 at 7:44pm
Originally posted by Mike Mike wrote:

Originally posted by SospanMawr SospanMawr wrote:

Originally posted by Mike Mike wrote:


Regardless of the extent to which Brexit has influenced Schaeffler, the UK withdrawing from the European Single Market and Customs Union will put UK-based business with pan-European operations and supply chains at a permanent disadvantage in the future. That is beyond doubt. Moving parts, exporting and importing will not be as straightforward as it will be within the EU27.
The consequence of that will be reduced investment in the UK.
Well said Mike. Unbelievable that we as a country, actually voted to reduce our business and influence with the rest of the world.


Hopefully we’ll get a chance to reverse this idiocy before it’s too late. It will be bad for the UK and terrible for Wales.


Good grief yes! Have you seen the prospects for Welsh hill farmers and the economy that depends on them? Dark days ahead for those (many Welsh speaking) communities.
"If it's on, we back our skills and our confidence ... We've got some great players, play a good brand and we enjoy doing it." Ken Owens
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote M.M. Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 November 2018 at 8:21pm
Can anyone please explain to me how Llanelli and West Wales will benefit from leaving the EU.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Mike Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 November 2018 at 8:23pm
Let’s sum it up.

We are one of the few UK regions with a trade surplus with the EU, so we are more reliant on Single Market membership than most areas because we still have something of a manufacturing base.

We are very reliant on inward investment ie international companies with pan-Euro operations setting up here because our record of nurturing indigenous businesses is not good.

We are a net beneficiary of EU structural funds. All the talk of this being our money returned is a misnomer. Welsh tax contributions to the UK contribution do not cover what we are getting back in funding.

Most of the country outside Cardiff (which voted over 60% remain) is around 95% UK born, so there can be no Farage-esque nonsense about ways of life being destroyed and pressure on public services. The immigrants we do have are overwhelmingly working, paying tax and supporting public services like the NHS.

Brexit is essentially a Tory policy that will result in a smaller state, so public sector employment and pay rises will be squeezed for, well, the foreseeable.

UK government will do trade deals with the USA and China. The Americans will decimate our agricultural industry and the Chinese will force our manufacturing into even more extreme competition, and that clearly includes steel.

So, all in all, what the hell were we thinking.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote totallybiasedscarlet Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 November 2018 at 8:28pm
Originally posted by M.M. M.M. wrote:

Can anyone please explain to me how Llanelli and West Wales will benefit from leaving the EU.


Ah, well see as rich blokes who are already well connected and wealthy get even richer some of the wealth will trickle down our way ... allegedly.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote totallybiasedscarlet Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 November 2018 at 8:37pm
Originally posted by Mike Mike wrote:

Let’s sum it up.

We are one of the few UK regions with a trade surplus with the EU, so we are more reliant on Single Market membership than most areas because we still have something of a manufacturing base.

We are very reliant on inward investment ie international companies with pan-Euro operations setting up here because our record of nurturing indigenous businesses is not good.

We are a net beneficiary of EU structural funds. All the talk of this being our money returned is a misnomer. Welsh tax contributions to the UK contribution do not cover what we are getting back in funding.

Most of the country outside Cardiff (which voted over 60% remain) is around 95% UK born, so there can be no Farage-esque nonsense about ways of life being destroyed and pressure on public services. The immigrants we do have are overwhelmingly working, paying tax and supporting public services like the NHS.

Brexit is essentially a Tory policy that will result in a smaller state, so public sector employment and pay rises will be squeezed for, well, the foreseeable.

UK government will do trade deals with the USA and China. The Americans will decimate our agricultural industry and the Chinese will force our manufacturing into even more extreme competition, and that clearly includes steel.

So, all in all, what the hell were we thinking.


Agree with everything you've said bar one thing. It appears that some 600k folk have left Wales over the last 20 years. It also appears that a similar number have moved the other way. At the same time the mean age of a Wales resident has been inching upwards. It's clear that younger people are leaving for economic opportunity and many older are coming here, probably because of the lower cost of living and housing. That is a shocking level of churn. When you match that with figures like 40% of house sales in some areas going as second homes it really makes me fearful for the future of our communities, particularly the last remaining Welsh speaking areas. Add the loss of the CAP and we are faced with massive demographic change. Will Wales as we know it still exist in another 20 years time?

It's not just Brexit, Wales has been shockingly poorly governed for eons now.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ladram Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 November 2018 at 8:39pm
Originally posted by totallybiasedscarlet totallybiasedscarlet wrote:

Originally posted by Mike Mike wrote:

Originally posted by SospanMawr SospanMawr wrote:

Originally posted by Mike Mike wrote:


Regardless of the extent to which Brexit has influenced Schaeffler, the UK withdrawing from the European Single Market and Customs Union will put UK-based business with pan-European operations and supply chains at a permanent disadvantage in the future. That is beyond doubt. Moving parts, exporting and importing will not be as straightforward as it will be within the EU27.
The consequence of that will be reduced investment in the UK.
Well said Mike. Unbelievable that we as a country, actually voted to reduce our business and influence with the rest of the world.


Hopefully we’ll get a chance to reverse this idiocy before it’s too late. It will be bad for the UK and terrible for Wales.


Good grief yes! Have you seen the prospects for Welsh hill farmers and the economy that depends on them? Dark days ahead for those (many Welsh speaking) communities.
and that has what to do with Brexit?
30th june 1986- 30th june 2011.25 years roofing,i wouldn't call that dodgy.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mike Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 November 2018 at 8:45pm
Yes but that’s overwhelmingly a UK issue, isn’t it. Young Welsh people moving to England for economic opportunities, being replaced by retirees from the other direction. Mainly caused by UK policy creating huge regional inequalities. And Brexit hands the people responsible a mandate and opportunity to ramp this up even more.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote totallybiasedscarlet Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 November 2018 at 8:45pm
Originally posted by ladram ladram wrote:

Originally posted by totallybiasedscarlet totallybiasedscarlet wrote:

Originally posted by Mike Mike wrote:

Originally posted by SospanMawr SospanMawr wrote:

Originally posted by Mike Mike wrote:


Regardless of the extent to which Brexit has influenced Schaeffler, the UK withdrawing from the European Single Market and Customs Union will put UK-based business with pan-European operations and supply chains at a permanent disadvantage in the future. That is beyond doubt. Moving parts, exporting and importing will not be as straightforward as it will be within the EU27.
The consequence of that will be reduced investment in the UK.
Well said Mike. Unbelievable that we as a country, actually voted to reduce our business and influence with the rest of the world.


Hopefully we’ll get a chance to reverse this idiocy before it’s too late. It will be bad for the UK and terrible for Wales.


Good grief yes! Have you seen the prospects for Welsh hill farmers and the economy that depends on them? Dark days ahead for those (many Welsh speaking) communities.
and that has what to do with Brexit?


The replacement of the EU CAP. It affects areas in Y Fro Gymraeg because they are overwhelmingly rural areas dependant on the agricultural economy.


Edited by totallybiasedscarlet - 08 November 2018 at 9:33pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote totallybiasedscarlet Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 November 2018 at 8:51pm
Originally posted by Mike Mike wrote:

Yes but that’s overwhelmingly a UK issue, isn’t it. Young Welsh people moving to England for economic opportunities, being replaced by retirees from the other direction. Mainly caused by UK policy creating huge regional inequalities. And Brexit hands the people responsible a mandate and opportunity to ramp this up even more.


Agree - Brexit will exacerbate this in many areas as the economy inevitably reconfigures. That's what hacks me off about this mainly right-driven vanity project. They don't care what the fall out is for communities. I think it will hit Wales disproportionately. It reminds me of the immediate post-industrial aftermath in S.Wales. There was a headlong ideological rush by the Thatcher government to shut down or otherwise reduce the UK's industrial sector and to hell with the social consequences. A similar thing happening again imho.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote GPR - Rochester Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 November 2018 at 9:40am
Originally posted by aber-fan aber-fan wrote:

Originally posted by GPR - Rochester GPR - Rochester wrote:

Originally posted by aber-fan aber-fan wrote:

Ffidel - it wasn't the 'media' - this is a direct quote from the BBC report:

"The firm said: "The uncertainty surrounding Brexit was one factor amongst others in the analysis of the UK market."

So - not the only consideration,  but it didn't help, did it?

I have been baffled for some time at the alliance over Brexit between purported left wingers such as yourself, and the Daily Mail, Telegraph, Express and Sun on the other. Somehow, I didn't expect you and others of like views to get into bed with that lot!

It has to be remembered that Brexit hasn't happened yet - IMHO, things will get very much worse if and when it does. I do worry about the future of Airbus in N Wales, for example... it's already quite a logistical issue to ship the wings over to France. If on top of that there are red tape issues relating to customs and tariffs, etc, don't you think it likely that they'll just say: "Sod this for a lark - let's just make the wings in the EU'?

I have to say I have been a little surprised at the tone of your recent posts bearing in mind I usually find your views well thought out and carefully presented. The two examples of companies closing/moving are absolutely nothing to do with Brexit. More to do with falling demand - in a global economy these are the harsh realities of trading. Obviously it is a very sad day for the people affected but harsh economic decisions are happening all over Europe every day. 

As for your comment regarding racism I will, as a Brexit supporter, choose to ignore it and explain it as you having a bad day!!!!!

Well, I was having a bad day as it happens - but I do get VERY angry at the thought that the Brexit con was brought about by the lies of Farage, Boris and the rest. 

You may or may not choose to believe what the company in Llanelli said - namely that uncertainty surrounding Brexit was one of the factors leading to closure. I did make an assumption about the other closure in Scotland - my mistake.

The fact is that as it hasn't happened yet, there is bound to be speculation from supporters and opponents about the economic costs (I doubt that there will be benefits, but you may disagree). One thing is certain - before Brexit, my pounds on trips to France were buying €1.30 - €1.40 and more before the vote... being frequently above that level in 2015 - since the vote, the exchange rate has crashed - the best rate in 2018 was a bit above €1.15, and is currently just under that level. Now, I know that harold Wilson spoke about 'the pound in your pocket' when attempting to justify a devaluation of the £, but it dose have these consequences:

1. For those of us who travel frequently to the eurozone, everything costs around 15% more than it did a short while ago.
2. For those who import goods from the eurozone - and we import A LOT of food from there - the cost has increased by a similar amount.
3. Imports from the USA will also have increased in a comparable way.

TBH, I have not seen a single bit of proof that we in the UK will benefit economically from Brexit - the only 'benefit' (if such it is) will be to make it harder for people to come into the UK to work as dentists, nurses doctors - and, OK, plumbers and labourers. Are you really surprised that I believe that many people voted Brexit out of xenophobia? It seems self-evident to me - and the evidence is there to back that up:


I actually know personally a lovely German lady who decided to return 'home' after Brexit... someone who lived and worked here for more than 20 years. 

These are very sad, and dangerous times we live in.

You fail to explain why this lady decided to return to Germany. Surely you are not suggesting that it was a direct result of the Brexit vote? Currencies fluctuate for a variety of reasons - I can recall the Euro being 1.05 long before the Brexit vote along with the dollar being almost equal to the £ again long before the Brexit vote. I have to have a wry smile when I hear ardent remainers quote Farage & Boris. What about the total bull...t which came out of the remain champions like Osborne.

A lot of nonsense has been talked about by both sides so let us try and get off our soap boxes and deal with the reality - a democratic vote took place; the Government are doing the correct thing and negotiating a leave deal. When that deal is done we can all have our opinions on the success of that deal but please do not insult my intelligence and tell me that I voted leave because of exaggerations peddled by politicians. My reasons were more firmly rooted in basic common sense :-

1. Control of our own borders - not racist by the way just common sense;
2. Control of our judiciary;
3. Removal of being run by an unelected, unaudited, twin centred - Brussels/Strasbourg bunch of overpaid bureaucrats hell bent on a centralised Europe intent on removing National identities with one currency meant to work for 27 countries ranging from Germany to Greece. It doesn't work and will never work just ask the public sector workers in Greece.

There are very few worse things in life than a sore loser - so you remainers please get over it - the sun will still come up after Brexit and this nation of ours is still capable of overcoming the few bumps along the way to a better, less restricted future - and yes that does mean that there won't be food shortages or shortages of insulin - more bullsh.t peddled by remainers!!!!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mike Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 November 2018 at 9:54am
That’s mostly paranoid nonsense I’m afraid.

Anyway, no good will come of this debate. Hopefully there will be a second referendum so whatever type of Brexit we end up with (there are loads, and often contrary versions) can be given the final democratic legitimacy it requires (in my opinion), or rejected.
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