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ladram View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ladram Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 November 2020 at 8:32am
this isn't a new problem the welsh team has always been the extra region who we are fighting against for fair play all the time,a few years ago we were playing bath in a vital H CUP match a week after an extra autumn international which wouldn't happen with any union in the world,i bet none of the blazers in the union are giving up any of their freebies and significant wages,if we are taking a loan out to survive then i'm afraid the time hasw come for the regions to get together and make a stand,what that stand would be i don't know but this continual stripping the regions of their players and losing to the likes of zebre etc should not be happening if the product was run correctly,as a supporter i'm rapidly getting to the really couldn't give a **** what happens.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote GPR - Rochester Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 November 2020 at 9:32am
It certainly isn't a new problem and the likes of Steve Phillips suggesting that the NatWest loan, which I remind everyone is our debt, was only available because of the WRU is a little rich when you find out that 80% of the loan is guaranteed by the Government. 

The independent 3 Welsh regions need to make a stand. Repaying this loan is going to be a nightmare financially to already loss making entities effectively absolving the WRU of any responsibility whatsoever. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote gaffer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 November 2020 at 6:32pm
Welsh rugby is in dire straits. Governance is a shambles. Nobody seems to have a plan and there is now a civil war between the regions and the WRU, between the regions, the semi-pro clubs and the regions and the semi-pro clubs and the WRU. In short everyone is looking after their interests and couldn't care less if catastrophic damage is done elsewhere.

The days of voting in/appointing people on the basis that a) he, or she, is a good "bloke" (add in female equivalent), b) it's their turn c) there's a bung involved  d) it keeps xyz out, are long gone in the professional sports world if success is the aim.

For instance, Robert Butcher, the new chairman of the WRU may be a man of great integrity and intelligence but..."He played for, led and has been a Bargoed RFC committee member as well as having been a teacher in Merthyr Tydfil." [BBC Sport]
He's now chair of a £100million organisation. I mean, what experience does he bring to this role? It's a joke. Where is Welsh rugby heading?

Nothing good is going to happen unless it is sorted out right from the top.
What's going on?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote GPR - Rochester Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 November 2020 at 8:11am
Think Ugo Monye summed it quite well - sinking ship is about right. Gatland's leaving wish was that Welsh rugby would not go backwards after he left. Not even he would have predicted how quickly the wheels would come off. 

We have an acting CEO who has a financial background, a new chairman with a teaching background, our most senior marketing man is leaving yet to be replaced. The WRU are sitting on a major asset and are expecting independent regions to repay loans of around £5 million over the next few years from trading income that has almost totally disappeared. 

Senior backers of the independent regions are going to have to dig very deep to get their regions through this crisis. If, and I certainly hope, they do then it would be high time that their relationship with the Union was put on a totally different footing. Players need to be 100% contracted to their regions and the cost of release for the national team needs to factor in the realistic cost of keeping the regions afloat. Release of non used International squad players must be part of that new arrangement along the lines of the English model. 

In its hour of greatest need regional rugby has been effectively told - over to you lads. Forget about all this we are all in it together - that is only relevant when things are going well financially. The WRU are only capable of being in charge of grass roots level rugby and should be left to do that. The professional game from regions to International teams needs to be run by professionals who understand the hospitality/corporate sponsorship & media world. I regret that neither Steve Phillips or Mr Butcher strike me as that calibre. 

Welsh rugby will reach its lowest ebb in the next few months; if the regions can somehow survive without much assistance from the WRU then it just maybe the tipping point which can lead to the British & Irish league with independently owned regions supported by a professional board of media savvy personnel who will also negotiate with the Principality stadium over image rights for their contracted players, costs of staging Internationals etc etc. In short the regions need to be taking the lead as clearly without them professional rugby in Wales would have ceased to exist.

 For Steve Phillips to suggest that the WRU played their part by getting NatWest to loan £20m in the first place is laughable. The loan is 80% guaranteed by the Westminster government so I have every confidence that our own boards could and would have sourced the finance at equally attractive rates. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Airdaa Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 November 2020 at 1:16am
Don’t like to rub salt in raw wounds but the terrible Irish who so many on this site criticise so often appear to have got the right idea. I went with a fellow club committee man to a meeting of all the Irish Clubs held in Dublin. Twenty years ago when the thenIRFU president Noel Murphy laid it on the line.
1. The most important team in Ireland was the Internatuonal team because they were the unions major source of income which paid for Rugby. In Ireland .He went on to say that it was vital that we could attract fixtures from all the tier one nations
2 it was vital also that the Provincs stayed to the fore to attract top class games for our internationals.
Ireland could not afford to. Buy in overseas players wholesale but at the start may need to strengthen  squads initially but long term they must develop players through the Academy / Pyramid system.
Prize money from Leagues and Cup competition would also benefit Irish Rugby.
Not everything the Irfu  have done has been correct nor welcomed by the clubs but I reckon they were farsighted enough to get  at least 90 % correct. They also backtracked on most of their failures.
They are probably one of the most conservative Unions and not renowned for chucking their money about, certainly  not to the grass roots clubs.
They bought land in the early seventies at Tallaght  then on outskirts of Dublin as possible site to replace Landsowne Road  but the troops weren’t happy to leave the familiar surroundings of D4 even the Dublin Natives felt it was in the sticks,so it was sold approximately 12-18. Months ago for a profit in the region of €33M .
So the financial management is vital together with control of your constituent members ie the Provincial Branches but as they elect the constituents of the board it works both ways.
The Aviva was built with money from several sources, the RoI government, their previous tenants The FAI, and of course by selling Ten year tickets which meant by not building 70k seater it was largely debt free when it opened.
I can assure you that as the Irish rugby community is relatively small and compact that their feelings are often communicated directly and forcibly to the IRFU Committee members.




Edited by Airdaa - 19 November 2020 at 1:24am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Eastern outpost Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 November 2020 at 6:56am
Thanks Airdaa. That’s certainly leadership and action that would be most welcome from our Union.
In a world where you can be anything – Be Kind.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote GPR - Rochester Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 November 2020 at 7:50am
Originally posted by Airdaa Airdaa wrote:

Don’t like to rub salt in raw wounds but the terrible Irish who so many on this site criticise so often appear to have got the right idea. I went with a fellow club committee man to a meeting of all the Irish Clubs held in Dublin. Twenty years ago when the thenIRFU president Noel Murphy laid it on the line.
1. The most important team in Ireland was the Internatuonal team because they were the unions major source of income which paid for Rugby. In Ireland .He went on to say that it was vital that we could attract fixtures from all the tier one nations
2 it was vital also that the Provincs stayed to the fore to attract top class games for our internationals.
Ireland could not afford to. Buy in overseas players wholesale but at the start may need to strengthen  squads initially but long term they must develop players through the Academy / Pyramid system.
Prize money from Leagues and Cup competition would also benefit Irish Rugby.
Not everything the Irfu  have done has been correct nor welcomed by the clubs but I reckon they were farsighted enough to get  at least 90 % correct. They also backtracked on most of their failures.
They are probably one of the most conservative Unions and not renowned for chucking their money about, certainly  not to the grass roots clubs.
They bought land in the early seventies at Tallaght  then on outskirts of Dublin as possible site to replace Landsowne Road  but the troops weren’t happy to leave the familiar surroundings of D4 even the Dublin Natives felt it was in the sticks,so it was sold approximately 12-18. Months ago for a profit in the region of €33M .
So the financial management is vital together with control of your constituent members ie the Provincial Branches but as they elect the constituents of the board it works both ways.
The Aviva was built with money from several sources, the RoI government, their previous tenants The FAI, and of course by selling Ten year tickets which meant by not building 70k seater it was largely debt free when it opened.
I can assure you that as the Irish rugby community is relatively small and compact that their feelings are often communicated directly and forcibly to the IRFU Committee members.



Thanks very much. I always enjoy your input even if it is from the dark side. It has been pretty clear that the IRFU have been a well run Union which is financially prudent. I look no further than when comparing the salaries of the CEO. Brown I believe was on less than half of his WRU counterpart pre-covid. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ladram Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 November 2020 at 8:59am
The union obviously aren't clever enough to see that successful regions equal successful national team,there was never a better time for world rugby to change the calendar to enable a system that works for everyone,instead we are sending under strength teams out to be hammered it's not good for supporters or players,i doubt i'm alone in feeling that it's killing the game for regional fans.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote GPR - Rochester Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 November 2020 at 9:08am
Originally posted by ladram ladram wrote:

The union obviously aren't clever enough to see that successful regions equal successful national team,there was never a better time for world rugby to change the calendar to enable a system that works for everyone,instead we are sending under strength teams out to be hammered it's not good for supporters or players,i doubt i'm alone in feeling that it's killing the game for regional fans.

Spot on Nigel. I am quite fearful for our game on Sunday. While it was an improvement against Connacht I thought they were poor. If we come away from that game losing by less than 15-20 I will be quietly pleased and that is no way for me to be thinking really. Much has been made of our ongoing overseas recruitment and it is an area we need to change if things stay as they are. For instance Blade is a fine player but could be deemed to be a mistake when he walks into the Scottish squad on arrival. The situation with Tex is of course different but any future overseas recruit should at least have to serve his 5 years residency. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Fscarlet Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 November 2020 at 9:09am
Originally posted by GPR - Rochester GPR - Rochester wrote:

Originally posted by ladram ladram wrote:

The union obviously aren't clever enough to see that successful regions equal successful national team,there was never a better time for world rugby to change the calendar to enable a system that works for everyone,instead we are sending under strength teams out to be hammered it's not good for supporters or players,i doubt i'm alone in feeling that it's killing the game for regional fans.

Spot on Nigel. I am quite fearful for our game on Sunday. While it was an improvement against Connacht I thought they were poor. If we come away from that game losing by less than 15-20 I will be quietly pleased and that is no way for me to be thinking really. Much has been made of our ongoing overseas recruitment and it is an area we need to change if things stay as they are. For instance Blade is a fine player but could be deemed to be a mistake when he walks into the Scottish squad on arrival. The situation with Tex is of course different but any future overseas recruit should at least have to serve his 5 years residency. 

It comes to something when I think if we have a net points difference of less than -50 from the next two games we will have done well!! 

It is now 5 years isn't it? 
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