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Eastern outpost View Drop Down
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Points: 20689 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Eastern outpost Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 August 2022 at 5:35pm
Originally posted by KID A KID A wrote:

Originally posted by RR1972 RR1972 wrote:

What we need to do is give the whole urc and european money directly to the regions . They can pay what ever salarys they see fit to the players. At present we have a mis mash of part central part regional funding for players. It’s a mess


What URC and European money? The WRU already pass on the competition money to the 4 pro clubs. It's about £12m I think.
The money from the sale of shares and revenue (that used to go to the clubs) in URC etc to CVC.

Correct me if I am wrong, however, I think none of that capital received was passed onto the 4 pro clubs in return for them having given up a share of future competition revenue.

A selling something to B but the money is kept by C is somewhat unusual.


Edited by Eastern outpost - 12 August 2022 at 5:37pm
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Points: 14170 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote scarletnut Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 August 2022 at 4:53pm
Originally posted by RR1972 RR1972 wrote:

Originally posted by scarletnut scarletnut wrote:

Originally posted by RR1972 RR1972 wrote:

I agree we need to split the oro and grass roots games  have said so time after time. I’m juat saying the ectra funding for the pro game needs to be takem from eksewhere not grass roots rugby which is key for welsh rugby in the long run
Yeah but it’s not funding. That’s the point that needs hammering home. It’s payment for the services of their players. It’s like you renting 10 cars and only paying half the selling price. That money belongs to the pro teams
 not sure that’s the correct analogy as 80 per cent of the 38 test players salaries  are met by the union? What we need to do is give the whole urc and european money directly to the regions . They can pay what ever salarys they see fit to the players. At present we have a mis mash of part central part regional funding for players. It’s a mess
Mate you’ve misunderstood again. That money with regards the NS 38 belongs to the pro sides. It’s their money, it legally belongs to them. The 80-20 split is the agreed method of payment. If it wasn’t split that way they’d still get that money. 
I still wake up late at night and think of what might have been when tim stimpson hit that jammy penalty1
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Points: 27513 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote KID A Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 August 2022 at 4:46pm
Originally posted by RR1972 RR1972 wrote:

What we need to do is give the whole urc and european money directly to the regions . They can pay what ever salarys they see fit to the players. At present we have a mis mash of part central part regional funding for players. It’s a mess


What URC and European money? The WRU already pass on the competition money to the 4 pro clubs. It's about £12m I think.
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Originally posted by scarletnut scarletnut wrote:

Originally posted by RR1972 RR1972 wrote:

I agree we need to split the oro and grass roots games  have said so time after time. I’m juat saying the ectra funding for the pro game needs to be takem from eksewhere not grass roots rugby which is key for welsh rugby in the long run
Yeah but it’s not funding. That’s the point that needs hammering home. It’s payment for the services of their players. It’s like you renting 10 cars and only paying half the selling price. That money belongs to the pro teams
 not sure that’s the correct analogy as 80 per cent of the 38 test players salaries  are met by the union? What we need to do is give the whole urc and european money directly to the regions . They can pay what ever salarys they see fit to the players. At present we have a mis mash of part central part regional funding for players. It’s a mess

Edited by RR1972 - 12 August 2022 at 2:14pm
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Points: 14170 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote scarletnut Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 August 2022 at 9:16am
Originally posted by RR1972 RR1972 wrote:

I agree we need to split the oro and grass roots games  have said so time after time. I’m juat saying the ectra funding for the pro game needs to be takem from eksewhere not grass roots rugby which is key for welsh rugby in the long run
Yeah but it’s not funding. That’s the point that needs hammering home. It’s payment for the services of their players. It’s like you renting 10 cars and only paying half the selling price. That money belongs to the pro teams
I still wake up late at night and think of what might have been when tim stimpson hit that jammy penalty1
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I agree we need to split the oro and grass roots games  have said so time after time. I’m juat saying the ectra funding for the pro game needs to be takem from eksewhere not grass roots rugby which is key for welsh rugby in the long run
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Originally posted by RR1972 RR1972 wrote:

Blanc knows more abour business about running budget sheets etc course she  does so let her get inviolved with the pro game i agree , however The local commite man maybe an ex player , an ex coach  guy who has helped keep a club stay alive for many a year, do we just throw people like that on rhe scrap  heap? The way people on here deride grass roots rugby is puzzling, i want the scarlets to succed, i want wales to succedd i want pontyberem to succed. Rest assured there are people involved in grass roots rugby  who love the game and who will still be involved it long after blanc and co have moved on to their next project (see moffet, roger lewis etc). The wru us there to look after all it’s clubs not just the pro ones
But currently the local committee man has a say in how the pro game is run. That’s the problem 
I still wake up late at night and think of what might have been when tim stimpson hit that jammy penalty1
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As i said we should split the pro and grass roots game.  I think everyone here agrees on that
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Originally posted by RR1972 RR1972 wrote:

Blanc knows more abour business about running budget sheets etc course she  does so let her get inviolved with the pro game i agree , however The local commite man maybe an ex player , an ex coach  guy who has helped keep a club stay alive for many a year, do we just throw people like that on rhe scrap  heap? The way people on here deride grass roots rugby is puzzling, i want the scarlets to succed, i want wales to succedd i want pontyberem to succed. Rest assured there are people involved in grass roots rugby  who love the game and who will still be involved it long after blanc and co have moved on to their next project (see moffet, roger lewis etc). The wru us there to look after all it’s clubs not just the pro ones

Nobody’s deriding grassroots rugby and you are right about some grassroots stallwarts being around a long time after some people who are employed to certain positions.
What some people on here are referring to is the fact that team wales is reliant on the regions (professional game) providing players to them, but the funding and everything needed for those regions to be successful is dependent upon the support of the grassroots game.   And they are not always in a position to know what’s best for the professional game, or are too preoccupied with their own position/survival to make the best decision for the game to develop/flourish.
I’ve played for my home town club, my family have held different positions within that club (over a forty year period), and I will continue to support my home town club, but would I trust them to make decisions that influence the professional game in Wales, I’m not too sure!.
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Points: 17487 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote RR1972 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 August 2022 at 11:55pm
Originally posted by scarletnut scarletnut wrote:

Originally posted by RR1972 RR1972 wrote:

Our schools rugby system is dreadful though, less schools play, less kids play, there are less fixtures, less qualified coaches and s and c coaching is non existant.  Those schools you point out are generally fee paying , the kids there are boarders and they have top coaches there . Wales schools have none of that and the wru need to invest in them and age group
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The grass roots has £11.5m ringfenced to it. It’s the pro game that needs investment 
i agree with you but not at the exopense of the grass roots game
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Blanc knows more abour business about running budget sheets etc course she  does so let her get inviolved with the pro game i agree , however The local commite man maybe an ex player , an ex coach  guy who has helped keep a club stay alive for many a year, do we just throw people like that on rhe scrap  heap? The way people on here deride grass roots rugby is puzzling, i want the scarlets to succed, i want wales to succedd i want pontyberem to succed. Rest assured there are people involved in grass roots rugby  who love the game and who will still be involved it long after blanc and co have moved on to their next project (see moffet, roger lewis etc). The wru us there to look after all it’s clubs not just the pro ones

Edited by RR1972 - 11 August 2022 at 11:47pm
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The whole governance of the game in Wales is wrong and not working.  Grassroots rugby isn’t holding the game back but the fact that any changes to the game at a professional level has to be ratified (voted on) by grassroots clubs (who know very little about how to professional sport works) is holding professional rugby back.
This stems from the governance of the union (WRU), it’s archaic in it’s nature.  At the top level, we’ve managed to alienate very professional people (who have left the organisation) and voted off people who have held or applied for senior roles (who have the  business acumen to do the jobs) only to appoint people from grassroots rugby (who have no business acumen whatsoever), just look at the most recent appointment to the position of Chairman of the WRU - you had Ieuan Evans and Nigel Davies, both men have held senior roles in business and had played in both the amateur and professional eras and were coming into the game with some ideas of how to change the game in Wales, what do the grassroots clubs vote for - a school head teacher with a connection to his grassroots club (only in Wales would this happen).
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Originally posted by RR1972 RR1972 wrote:

Our schools rugby system is dreadful though, less schools play, less kids play, there are less fixtures, less qualified coaches and s and c coaching is non existant.  Those schools you point out are generally fee paying , the kids there are boarders and they have top coaches there . Wales schools have none of that and the wru need to invest in them and age group
Club rugby
The grass roots has £11.5m ringfenced to it. It’s the pro game that needs investment 
I still wake up late at night and think of what might have been when tim stimpson hit that jammy penalty1
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Our schools rugby system is dreadful though, less schools play, less kids play, there are less fixtures, less qualified coaches and s and c coaching is non existant.  Those schools you point out are generally fee paying , the kids there are boarders and they have top coaches there . Wales schools have none of that and the wru need to invest in them and age group
Club rugby
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Originally posted by RR1972 RR1972 wrote:

A strong test team needs a strong pro gane a strong pro game needs a strong grass roots game.  The more kids we have playing age group and schools rugby the more chance we have of getting better players for the regions and then for wales. Long term we need to look at getting better coaching better facilities better s and c for the youngsters for the  future for welsh rugby. Short tern givving the regions more money to make us more competive will help. But long term more funding for age and schools rugby is key
The PRB is subservient to the main WRU board which has a community club majority. You have absolute world class administrators like Amanda Blanc not being able to push her ideas through because you have unqualified halfwits who don’t have the best interests of Welsh rugby at heart blocking every idea she has. The representative from a local club thinking he knows more than the CEO of Aviva is the equivalent of me lecturing a surgeon on how to amputate a limb. Total separation between the community and pro game is needed if the game in this country is to thrive. Also if you look at the most successful test nations like SA, NZ, England etc it’s the schools system which sustains it.
I still wake up late at night and think of what might have been when tim stimpson hit that jammy penalty1
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Points: 17487 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote RR1972 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 August 2022 at 11:18pm
A strong test team needs a strong pro game a strong pro game needs a strong grass roots game.  The more kids we have playing age group and schools rugby the more chance we have of getting better players for the regions and then for wales. Long term we need to look at getting better coaching better facilities better s and c for the youngsters for the  future for welsh rugby. Short tern givving the regions more money to make us more competive will help. But long term more funding for age and schools rugby is key. I don’t want money for grass roots to be spent on playwrs for the first team to win trophys for these clubs, it’s to run age group and youth sides  As i said i’m happy to see the pro game run seperately but let’s not forget the fact plenty of pro welsh rugby clubs babkrupted themselves paying money they didn’t have in the past

Edited by RR1972 - 11 August 2022 at 11:23pm
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