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20 mph speed limits from 18 September 2023

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    Posted: 17 September 2023 at 10:41am
How is the journey to y Parc affected by the new limits? Are the main routes unaffected and it’s the side streets?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote roy munster Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 September 2023 at 3:52pm
This is the kind of idea that in theory shoud help reduce accidents but in reaity it may make things worse

Around scarlets its 40mph to the lights at pemberton then turn right or left and its immediately down to 20 ..........Bryn bynea llwynhendy al 20mph I think dafen foel stradey areas not clearly marked its confusing

The welsh governments own report says it will damage the welsh economy by over £4.5 billion
I drove around town a lot last few days and it is chaos and confusion
unmarked speed limits some roads are 20 then 40 then 20 in the space of a few yards
theres already speed bumps and pot holes an wider pavements everywhere damaging cars. How is that making anyone safer? Surey the fact theyve abandoned road improvements and relief roads, pus the endless stop starting with speed bumps pot hotes and now the confusion over the 20mph zones create this congestion will increase pollution too?

The feedback Ive had from talking to 100s of people is theyre all 100% against 20mph roads everywhere except all schools and hospitals. Everyone is scared and confused 1000s of decent drivers will lose their licenses and jobs. everyone thinks it is a cash cow for poiticians police and councils to squeeze more money out of working people. 

Its been implemented terribly.........I hope it actualy does save lives as the politicians claim but is there evidence of that? Tragically it may even cost more lives as confused drivers wil slam on their brakes and get rear ended. The least they MUST do is make it all much much clearer.

Amazon and other companies have aready said theyl increase charges to west wales
time for deliveries of medica supplies, food, emergencies such as taking people to hospital as ambuances are unavailable m late for school, congestion more pollution, late for appointments work way less productivity

Lets hope the police are as vigilant in catching and imprisoning car thieves and those with no licenses as I know from painful experience when I had a car stolen few yrs ago the police did absolutely nothing despite a ton of evidence including camera footage inside the car, finger prints, tracker reports, umpteen eye witnesses etc etc 
 


Edited by roy munster - 17 September 2023 at 6:52pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ladram Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 September 2023 at 4:02pm
Everything in Wales is broken under labour in Wales and it's getting worse and i detest the Tories  the whole country is broken

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote roy munster Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 September 2023 at 6:51pm
Originally posted by ladram ladram wrote:

Everything in Wales is broken under labour in Wales and it's getting worse and i detest the Tories  the whole country is broken


hard to disagree with that
both parties are shameful 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Winston Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 September 2023 at 7:22pm
Wasn’t a good journey from Ross to PYS with the usual Newport snarl up on the M4. But the M4 closed for roadworks on the way back so detoured Merthyr and Abergavenny.   Absolute nightmare.  Can you believe the main artery road closed during the daytime. Don’t they work overnight in Wales 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote reesytheexile Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 September 2023 at 9:20pm
It’s hard to keep to 20 mph isn’t it but I guess that if it ends up saving lives - perhaps even a family member or friend- I will be happy. We just need to give it a go.It’s being reviewed in a year isn’t it? Also councils can apply for changes and exceptions if changes are needed and hope they do this when sensible to do so. It’s not the end of the world tbf. 

Edited by reesytheexile - 18 September 2023 at 11:50am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote aber-fan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 September 2023 at 8:37am
Some points about this new 20mph limit in town centres - which I favour:

1. It is not a blanket 20mph - councils can vary it and have a higher limit in places they think it makes sense. I daresay it will take time for those variations to be implemented in a tidy way, but the problem is not insurmountable.

2. Will it save lives? Yes - I have seen A&E surgeons say so - and especially of children who are more likely to be killed as pedestrians, since they are shorter and their vital organs are more likely to get hit by cars.

3. Will it cut pollution? Yes.

4. To the personal example regarding safety - there is a long, steep hill leading into Aberystwyth from the north - Penglais hill. Just before the town starts, there is a 40mph limit which is already a bit generous IMO, since just after a bend you get a crossroads at the top of the hill with commuters joining from the minor road on the right, and more form the left... plus, many parents are turning right across the road to deliver their kids to Penglais school in the morning. 

Further down, another major junction with the university campus on the left - but with commuting students and staff coming up the hill and turning right across the road.

At around the point where 40mph becomes 30mph, another double junction on the left - the second is more important as it is for the national Library of Wales, and staff must turn right across the traffic to get to work if coming out from town.

Just after the 30 mph limit starts - the hospital car park on the left, so cars from town must again turn right across the flow; there is an exit from the car park another 20m further on, and another road into my part of town another 20m after that! Doing a right turn here is really stressful, as many drivers DO NOT stick to even 30mph but are doing much more... and some/many idiots who have a bit of a gap in front, instead of allowing a turn to be made actually accelerate to close any gaps! After all that pointless speed, the traffic slows to a crawl as the jam backs up from Coopers corner... so nothing gained. 

This is why driving too fast in town is so annoying - not only is it dangerous, but it doesn't gain any significant amount of time.

As for the centre - you'd be lucky to do 20mph there most of the day. It's not possible.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Fscarlet Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 September 2023 at 8:41am
Hopped in the car this morning & there were many people driving at 30 then realising they should be doing 20! 

Will take some getting used to as lots of people drive round Milford at more than 30.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote roy munster Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 September 2023 at 2:36pm
Originally posted by aber-fan aber-fan wrote:

Some points about this new 20mph limit in town centres - which I favour:

1. It is not a blanket 20mph - councils can vary it and have a higher limit in places they think it makes sense. I daresay it will take time for those variations to be implemented in a tidy way, but the problem is not insurmountable.

2. Will it save lives? Yes - I have seen A&E surgeons say so - and especially of children who are more likely to be killed as pedestrians, since they are shorter and their vital organs are more likely to get hit by cars.

3. Will it cut pollution? Yes.

4. To the personal example regarding safety - there is a long, steep hill leading into Aberystwyth from the north - Penglais hill. Just before the town starts, there is a 40mph limit which is already a bit generous IMO, since just after a bend you get a crossroads at the top of the hill with commuters joining from the minor road on the right, and more form the left... plus, many parents are turning right across the road to deliver their kids to Penglais school in the morning. 

Further down, another major junction with the university campus on the left - but with commuting students and staff coming up the hill and turning right across the road.

At around the point where 40mph becomes 30mph, another double junction on the left - the second is more important as it is for the national Library of Wales, and staff must turn right across the traffic to get to work if coming out from town.

Just after the 30 mph limit starts - the hospital car park on the left, so cars from town must again turn right across the flow; there is an exit from the car park another 20m further on, and another road into my part of town another 20m after that! Doing a right turn here is really stressful, as many drivers DO NOT stick to even 30mph but are doing much more... and some/many idiots who have a bit of a gap in front, instead of allowing a turn to be made actually accelerate to close any gaps! After all that pointless speed, the traffic slows to a crawl as the jam backs up from Coopers corner... so nothing gained. 

This is why driving too fast in town is so annoying - not only is it dangerous, but it doesn't gain any significant amount of time.

As for the centre - you'd be lucky to do 20mph there most of the day. It's not possible.

Speed bumps pot holes 20 mph congestion m scrapping road improvements and relief roads and endless changes of speed often on the time strip of road will combined increase polution. Not just exhaust fumes but tyre polution from the endless stop start

Surey most intelligent countries target the dangerous roads and thats where they put 20 mph zones

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote RR1972 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 September 2023 at 6:57pm
Originally posted by aber-fan aber-fan wrote:

Some points about this new 20mph limit in town centres - which I favour:

1. It is not a blanket 20mph - councils can vary it and have a higher limit in places they think it makes sense. I daresay it will take time for those variations to be implemented in a tidy way, but the problem is not insurmountable.

2. Will it save lives? Yes - I have seen A&E surgeons say so - and especially of children who are more likely to be killed as pedestrians, since they are shorter and their vital organs are more likely to get hit by cars.

3. Will it cut pollution? Yes.

4. To the personal example regarding safety - there is a long, steep hill leading into Aberystwyth from the north - Penglais hill. Just before the town starts, there is a 40mph limit which is already a bit generous IMO, since just after a bend you get a crossroads at the top of the hill with commuters joining from the minor road on the right, and more form the left... plus, many parents are turning right across the road to deliver their kids to Penglais school in the morning. 

Further down, another major junction with the university campus on the left - but with commuting students and staff coming up the hill and turning right across the road.

At around the point where 40mph becomes 30mph, another double junction on the left - the second is more important as it is for the national Library of Wales, and staff must turn right across the traffic to get to work if coming out from town.

Just after the 30 mph limit starts - the hospital car park on the left, so cars from town must again turn right across the flow; there is an exit from the car park another 20m further on, and another road into my part of town another 20m after that! Doing a right turn here is really stressful, as many drivers DO NOT stick to even 30mph but are doing much more... and some/many idiots who have a bit of a gap in front, instead of allowing a turn to be made actually accelerate to close any gaps! After all that pointless speed, the traffic slows to a crawl as the jam backs up from Coopers corner... so nothing gained. 

This is why driving too fast in town is so annoying - not only is it dangerous, but it doesn't gain any significant amount of time.

As for the centre - you'd be lucky to do 20mph there most of the day. It's not possible.
how will loads of vehcles being stuck in endless traffic jams cut pollution? It’s a load of hot air (pardon the pun)

Edited by RR1972 - 18 September 2023 at 7:07pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote RR1972 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 September 2023 at 7:05pm
The 20 mph hr around schools is fine but otherwuse ir’s just daft. Same as this race to go to all electric cars. Wales contrubutes leds than 0.5 per cent of global green house gasses, if we all stopped driving in wales it would make no difference what so ever to global warning and drakeford and co shold be honest pn this and say so. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote SA14 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 September 2023 at 9:16pm
Originally posted by RR1972 RR1972 wrote:

Originally posted by aber-fan aber-fan wrote:

Some points about this new 20mph limit in town centres - which I favour:

1. It is not a blanket 20mph - councils can vary it and have a higher limit in places they think it makes sense. I daresay it will take time for those variations to be implemented in a tidy way, but the problem is not insurmountable.

2. Will it save lives? Yes - I have seen A&E surgeons say so - and especially of children who are more likely to be killed as pedestrians, since they are shorter and their vital organs are more likely to get hit by cars.

3. Will it cut pollution? Yes.

4. To the personal example regarding safety - there is a long, steep hill leading into Aberystwyth from the north - Penglais hill. Just before the town starts, there is a 40mph limit which is already a bit generous IMO, since just after a bend you get a crossroads at the top of the hill with commuters joining from the minor road on the right, and more form the left... plus, many parents are turning right across the road to deliver their kids to Penglais school in the morning. 

Further down, another major junction with the university campus on the left - but with commuting students and staff coming up the hill and turning right across the road.

At around the point where 40mph becomes 30mph, another double junction on the left - the second is more important as it is for the national Library of Wales, and staff must turn right across the traffic to get to work if coming out from town.

Just after the 30 mph limit starts - the hospital car park on the left, so cars from town must again turn right across the flow; there is an exit from the car park another 20m further on, and another road into my part of town another 20m after that! Doing a right turn here is really stressful, as many drivers DO NOT stick to even 30mph but are doing much more... and some/many idiots who have a bit of a gap in front, instead of allowing a turn to be made actually accelerate to close any gaps! After all that pointless speed, the traffic slows to a crawl as the jam backs up from Coopers corner... so nothing gained. 

This is why driving too fast in town is so annoying - not only is it dangerous, but it doesn't gain any significant amount of time.

As for the centre - you'd be lucky to do 20mph there most of the day. It's not possible.
how will loads of vehcles being stuck in endless traffic jams cut pollution? It’s a load of hot air (pardon the pun)

Newer cars cut out plus there’ll be more electric cars. It’ll all level out in the end. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Raised By Peregos Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 September 2023 at 11:11am
As for the centre - you'd be lucky to do 20mph there most of the day. It's not possible.
[/QUOTE]

Speed bumps pot holes 20 mph congestion m scrapping road improvements and relief roads and endless changes of speed often on the time strip of road will combined increase polution. Not just exhaust fumes but tyre polution from the endless stop start

Surey most intelligent countries target the dangerous roads and thats where they put 20 mph zones

[/QUOTE]

They have targeted the most dangerous roads. Statistically the 30mph zones are by far the worst. 


 

The point about electric cars is valid. It IS hard to drive consistently at 20mph but it will be less so in electric and future vehicles... and all petrol and diesel are being phased out anyway. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote roy munster Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 September 2023 at 11:20am
Originally posted by Raised By Peregos Raised By Peregos wrote:

As for the centre - you'd be lucky to do 20mph there most of the day. It's not possible.

Speed bumps pot holes 20 mph congestion m scrapping road improvements and relief roads and endless changes of speed often on the time strip of road will combined increase polution. Not just exhaust fumes but tyre polution from the endless stop start

Surey most intelligent countries target the dangerous roads and thats where they put 20 mph zones

[/QUOTE]

They have targeted the most dangerous roads. Statistically the 30mph zones are by far the worst. 


 

The point about electric cars is valid. It IS hard to drive consistently at 20mph but it will be less so in electric and future vehicles... and all petrol and diesel are being phased out anyway. 
[/QUOTE]

It's not it's pretty much all roads in built up areas
The whole world going electric is a fantasy , not only are they way less reliable far more expensive , thousands of charging ports , you have lithium wars lithium mines lithium burials 
The carbon footprint is way underestimated too
Millions using the grid will lead to power cuts
This Draconian one size fits all no flexibility will lead to calamity
The roads will be strewn with broken down cars too
Hybrid cars were never given enough chance their footprint isn't much more and they're reliable and avoid all of these problems too
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote RR1972 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 September 2023 at 11:21am
Out of curio how do 40 mph  roafs compare to 30 mph injury wise? ? If they are lower Maybe we should increase not reduce soeed! There are a lot more (well there were a lot more) 30 mph roads than 20 mph roads than 30 mph so it stands to reason there will be more fatalities on these roads. I dare say there are less pedestrians killed and injured on motor ways then there are on 20 mph and 30 mph roads? See how easy it is to bend  stats to your view point

Edited by RR1972 - 19 September 2023 at 11:43am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote reesytheexile Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 September 2023 at 11:23am
I have just discovered ( page 120 or whatever of my manual) that our 3 year old Skoda Kamiq has a speed limiter ! I had no idea and suspect many cars up to say 5-6 years old are the same. Dare I try it fiddle with it but is there any point as these 20 mph zones don’t last long? 🤔
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