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Fscarlet View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Fscarlet Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 January 2021 at 9:24am
I just feel that coaches don't have the confidence in players handling skills now.

If you look at what Wales did under Gatland, incredible defence aside, Wales handling skills were very good & they did the basics right. How many times now do we see a prop or hooker as first receiver & there's a little fumble? 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote scarletnut Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 January 2021 at 9:37am
Originally posted by GPR - Rochester GPR - Rochester wrote:

Yes interesting comments from Cipriani. Would I pay more to travel to watch a team with Cipriani playing 10 and allowed to play what was in front him over watching Farrell continually kick - for sure. The defensive negative tactics employed by most in the game will mean that England will always be there or thereabouts in competitions. However, as South Africa proved, no plan B = defeat when plan A doesn't work. 

When they come up against a side they cannot bully, who meet them head on the gainline and compete just as hard at set pieces they are going to need more. They may well come unstuck this season against France for that very reason. 
I love watching Cipriani play when he’s at his best but he’s like a sieve in defence 
I still wake up late at night and think of what might have been when tim stimpson hit that jammy penalty1
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote dr_martinov Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 January 2021 at 9:40am
Originally posted by Fscarlet Fscarlet wrote:

Originally posted by Dic Penderyn Dic Penderyn wrote:

The mind-set is depressing,and it's logical conclusion is to avoid passing/handling/running with the ball.I do think there's a valid argument re.subs.

It is very depressing. I never thought I wouldn't be incredibly excited about the 6 nations but I am not feeling it this year as I know that the sides are now preferring to kick the ball away & prey on mistakes from the oppostion.

The interview with Cips says that Eddie doesn't want England to have the ball but in all truth with the 2 flankers & backs they have got they are capable of playing a very attractive style of rugby.

When many teams actively don't want the ball I think the sport has an issue. Dic's comment about the breakdown being about winning the penalty and not the ball is also very insightful. We could also look at changing the points for tries, conversion, penalties again, either increasing a try to 6 points or decreasing a penalty to 2. There would still be a lot of penalties kicked deep for lineouts but then at least there's options from that: catch and drive, ruck, out quick to backs.

The downside of course would possibly be teams cynically giving away more penalties if there's a lower er... penalty but if you then bring in cards for cynical stuff that could address that. I still think my point that refs should not be expected to explain the law constantly to both sides as some sort of running coach-commentator. If someone does something wrong, ping them and then explain why. They are professional rugby players who should know the laws. The ref's interpretation will always play a large part in the game I know but refs having to say "there's the offside line" or "no, you can't go in from that angle" or even "no, don't touch it" when a player is about to catch a ball in an offside position is silly when you compare it to other sports and it means players play the ref, not the actual laws. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Eastern outpost Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 January 2021 at 2:19pm
Originally posted by scarletnut scarletnut wrote:

Originally posted by GPR - Rochester GPR - Rochester wrote:

Yes interesting comments from Cipriani. Would I pay more to travel to watch a team with Cipriani playing 10 and allowed to play what was in front him over watching Farrell continually kick - for sure. The defensive negative tactics employed by most in the game will mean that England will always be there or thereabouts in competitions. However, as South Africa proved, no plan B = defeat when plan A doesn't work. 

When they come up against a side they cannot bully, who meet them head on the gainline and compete just as hard at set pieces they are going to need more. They may well come unstuck this season against France for that very reason. 
I love watching Cipriani play when he’s at his best but he’s like a sieve in defence 
Shame he never played on the same side as Sivivatu. Wink
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote dyniol53 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 January 2021 at 12:07pm
Originally posted by Dic Penderyn Dic Penderyn wrote:

Originally posted by Fscarlet Fscarlet wrote:

Originally posted by Dic Penderyn Dic Penderyn wrote:

Much of the problem lies with the coaches,and not the law-makers.

I don't know what the answer is but if you look at lower league, we have less subs (yes I know its not even close to being on the same level as the pro game but still) & I feel the game is better for it. 
The mind-set is depressing,and it's logical conclusion is to avoid passing/handling/running with the ball.I do think there's a valid argument re.subs.

Just reading an interview with a recently retired Irish centre who “didn’t fulfil his potential” in Leinster or Ireland; here’s what he says about coaching

Joe Schmidt came in as Leinster boss in 2010 and Macken admits “it wouldn’t take a rocket scientist to realise I didn’t get on particularly well with Joe.” There was no hostility, Macken stresses, but he never felt Schmidt backed him to be the player he wanted to be.

“He wanted me to be crash, bang, and wallop, which wasn’t how I played. I liked using my pass but I was told not to throw miss passes.”

https://www.the42.ie/brendan-macken-leinster-retirement-5332536-Jan2021/


Certainly is depressing to see that - when you read the article you hear that this kid was expected to go far but the Irish system didn’t suit how he wanted to play so essentially spat him out.

I think about Bierne and how incredible he was for us - and how the Irish system hasn’t fully managed to let him blossom. 

Then of  think how many of these incredibly skilful players is rugby spitting out because they’re “not heavy enough, not powerful enough” etc

https://twitter.com/exile_podcast?lang=en
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote dyniol53 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 February 2021 at 5:36pm
3 weeks into the 6Nations, has anyone changed their minds?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote SA14 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 February 2021 at 5:52pm
If the Lions tour goes ahead I’d be a worried Gatland. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote greypower1 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 February 2021 at 5:57pm
The forming of long caterpillars to protect the scrum half has got to be the most boring aspect of the modern game closely followed by the crouch, set, engage, collapse and start all over again routine of the time consuming scrum.  Whilst I'm at it, the "meeting" before the lineout followed by the slow walk to form the lineout.  I'm sure I've missed a few more boring aspects. 
Keep the faith
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Fscarlet Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 February 2021 at 6:00pm
Originally posted by greypower1 greypower1 wrote:

The forming of long caterpillars to protect the scrum half has got to be the most boring aspect of the modern game closely followed by the crouch, set, engage, collapse and start all over again routine of the time consuming scrum.  Whilst I'm at it, the "meeting" before the lineout followed by the slow walk to form the lineout.  I'm sure I've missed a few more boring aspects. 

I’ll give the ref his dues, when a scrum went down yesterday he told the 9 to use it if it was available rather than reset it. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote scarletnut Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 February 2021 at 6:17pm
Originally posted by SA14 SA14 wrote:

If the Lions tour goes ahead I’d be a worried Gatland. 
South Africa haven’t played since the 2019 RWC final.
I still wake up late at night and think of what might have been when tim stimpson hit that jammy penalty1
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ap sior Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 February 2021 at 6:23pm
1. Players must get to the line out quicker, failure, sanction free kick.

2. Refs must apply the 5 second rule at ruck time after they've called 'ball available', or change rules to make the charge down of SH's kick a free kick offence. This will reduce the caterpillar or make it defunct.

3. Change the law so that teams cannot choose a penalty scrum, unless it's an attacking 5m scrum.

Those are my recommendations for change. 

Feel free to criticise. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote aber-fan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 February 2021 at 6:25pm
Originally posted by greypower1 greypower1 wrote:

The forming of long caterpillars to protect the scrum half has got to be the most boring aspect of the modern game closely followed by the crouch, set, engage, collapse and start all over again routine of the time consuming scrum.  Whilst I'm at it, the "meeting" before the lineout followed by the slow walk to form the lineout.  I'm sure I've missed a few more boring aspects. 

Quite right - we need a lot more of this.

The rugby these last few weeks is nowhere near the standard of boringness we have been used to, and to which we have an absolute right!

Come on, players!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote SA14 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 February 2021 at 6:50pm
Originally posted by scarletnut scarletnut wrote:

Originally posted by SA14 SA14 wrote:

If the Lions tour goes ahead I’d be a worried Gatland. 
South Africa haven’t played since the 2019 RWC final.

The Lions haven’t played since 2017. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote dyniol53 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 March 2021 at 2:55pm
Major League Rugby (American) are trialling some tweaks to the laws:


In addition to the enhanced communications for the referees MLR will be trialing new law variations which the referees will be implementing as the 2021 season begins March 20.

• Kickers will have 60 seconds as opposed 90 seconds for any kick (conversion/penalty) and will have a kick clock to help guide them.

• Seven points will be automatically awarded for any try scored directly under the posts and no conversion will be necessary.

• Referees will work with stricter protocols that will limit the number of scrums to two per incident – the original plus one reset for a collapse, penalty, or freekick.

• The offside line will be the feed line/channel of the scrum to allow for unimpeded access to the ball at the back of the scrum for the attacking team.

• No longer will a red card mean a team plays a man down for the remainder of the match. Under the new law a red card would lead to a player being sent off and the team goes down to 14 players for 20 minutes. After 20 minutes, the player can be replaced with another player on the bench. The red carded players cannot return to the field in any event and will go through subsequent disciplinary procedures.

“Our goal is to continue to offer fans and teams fast paced, competitive rugby that is safe and balanced.” said Jonathan Kaplan, Match Official Director. “We believe these new laws will enhance our on-field product while staying true to the spirit of rugby.”

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote dyniol53 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 March 2021 at 3:17pm
Originally posted by me me wrote:

Originally posted by Jones2004 Jones2004 wrote:

Lastly I’d put a limit of three subs per game (excluding HIA). Teams would be allowed 6 or 7 players on their bench to reduce chances of uncontested scrums but only three of them could come on. This should force players (especially tight 5 forwards) to lose a bit of size, therefore reducing the size of hits and number of subsequent injuries. It should also allow more space to develop in the last twenty minutes, making the games more exciting. 

I agree reducing the number of subs would be a good thing but the issue is how not to incentivise another “blood gate” where a team could confer a massive advantage in big games from faking injuries. 

I think they should try and reduce the subs to 3 - we should expect props to be able to play Tight head and loose head.
We already see some modern hookers are able to play 8, 2nd rows on the flank, 9s at 10, 10 at 12 etc etc. 

I think the game would benefit from a little less specialisation and thus more fatigue in the final 20 minutes.

Interestingly the Aussie Rules League is introducing injury subs in response to concussion guidelines. But fans have pointed out that teams are likely to abuse it. They are suggesting that any player who comes off as an injury sub has to miss the next fixture (any game in the following 10 days). 

I think a similar thing could be useful in rugby. 3 normal subs allowed and up to 8 injury subs but an inj subbed off player has to miss a game.


Edited by dyniol53 - 19 March 2021 at 3:18pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mrfwon Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 March 2021 at 3:20pm
Originally posted by dyniol53 dyniol53 wrote:

Since the pandemic there have been lots of rugby commentators saying the game is becoming boring - too much kicking, too many big blokes running directly into other big blokes, scrums taking too long, too many mauls, the caterpillar ruck, Exeter pick and going from 5m out even when there’s an overlap outside etc

I’m wondering what fans on this forum think is the actual problem and what changes (if any) the law-makers should amend to create a more entertaining game

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