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dyniol53 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote dyniol53 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 August 2021 at 12:46pm
I don’t like the denigration of scrums as a contest. They’re a crucial part of the game and what makes rugby Union distinct from league. 

The value competitive, contestible scums bring is they mean teams require 2 extra distinct body types on the pitch. 

If you take away the importance of props and a scrummaging hooker you’ll have 6 players with the physique of back rowers on the pitch, meaning there will be less space for attackers and less value for the small players and running fullback who target the 120kg props to create gaps in defence.

Rugby Unions charm is in having a place for a Shane Williams and a Uini Antonio and Antoine DuPont and a Samson Lee, you don’t get such variety in Rugby League
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote GPR - Rochester Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 August 2021 at 12:53pm
Originally posted by dyniol53 dyniol53 wrote:

I don’t like the denigration of scrums as a contest. They’re a crucial part of the game and what makes rugby Union distinct from league. 

The value competitive, contestible scums bring is they mean teams require 2 extra distinct body types on the pitch. 

If you take away the importance of props and a scrummaging hooker you’ll have 6 players with the physique of back rowers on the pitch, meaning there will be less space for attackers and less value for the small players and running fullback who target the 120kg props to create gaps in defence.

Rugby Unions charm is in having a place for a Shane Williams and a Uini Antonio and Antoine DuPont and a Samson Lee, you don’t get such variety in Rugby League

That is very true. Wyn Jones' value to his teams will decrease because in all honesty refs cannot be entrusted on using the current rulebook to get it right. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote aber-fan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 August 2021 at 2:20pm
Originally posted by dyniol53 dyniol53 wrote:

I don’t like the denigration of scrums as a contest. They’re a crucial part of the game and what makes rugby Union distinct from league. 

The value competitive, contestible scums bring is they mean teams require 2 extra distinct body types on the pitch. 

If you take away the importance of props and a scrummaging hooker you’ll have 6 players with the physique of back rowers on the pitch, meaning there will be less space for attackers and less value for the small players and running fullback who target the 120kg props to create gaps in defence.

Rugby Unions charm is in having a place for a Shane Williams and a Uini Antonio and Antoine DuPont and a Samson Lee, you don’t get such variety in Rugby League

I agree - BUT THE SA 9 was allowed to BLATANTLY put the ball into the second row, right in front of the ref. It certainly isn't a 'fair contest' if refs allow that - it was very poor indeed.
“You cannot reason a man out of what he never reasoned himself into.” (Jonathan Swift)
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Fscarlet Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 August 2021 at 2:46pm
Originally posted by aber-fan aber-fan wrote:

Originally posted by dyniol53 dyniol53 wrote:

I don’t like the denigration of scrums as a contest. They’re a crucial part of the game and what makes rugby Union distinct from league. 

The value competitive, contestible scums bring is they mean teams require 2 extra distinct body types on the pitch. 

If you take away the importance of props and a scrummaging hooker you’ll have 6 players with the physique of back rowers on the pitch, meaning there will be less space for attackers and less value for the small players and running fullback who target the 120kg props to create gaps in defence.

Rugby Unions charm is in having a place for a Shane Williams and a Uini Antonio and Antoine DuPont and a Samson Lee, you don’t get such variety in Rugby League

I agree - BUT THE SA 9 was allowed to BLATANTLY put the ball into the second row, right in front of the ref. It certainly isn't a 'fair contest' if refs allow that - it was very poor indeed.

Greenwood asked Nigel what he thought & he agreed that more needs to be done about it but Nige also said the ref's are focussing on lots at scrum time so I am not sure what can be done.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Kentexile Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 August 2021 at 8:14am
Agree completely just another attempt to turn union into league .scrums line  outs and before that old style contested rucks and mauls keep forwards out of the defensive line as well as tiring them out which creates space.
The changes on tap and go will have the opposite effect
How long after these law changes to dropping two forwards to create a bit more room on the pitch?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote aber-fan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 August 2021 at 11:00am
Originally posted by Fscarlet Fscarlet wrote:

Originally posted by aber-fan aber-fan wrote:

Originally posted by dyniol53 dyniol53 wrote:

I don’t like the denigration of scrums as a contest. They’re a crucial part of the game and what makes rugby Union distinct from league. 

The value competitive, contestible scums bring is they mean teams require 2 extra distinct body types on the pitch. 

If you take away the importance of props and a scrummaging hooker you’ll have 6 players with the physique of back rowers on the pitch, meaning there will be less space for attackers and less value for the small players and running fullback who target the 120kg props to create gaps in defence.

Rugby Unions charm is in having a place for a Shane Williams and a Uini Antonio and Antoine DuPont and a Samson Lee, you don’t get such variety in Rugby League

I agree - BUT THE SA 9 was allowed to BLATANTLY put the ball into the second row, right in front of the ref. It certainly isn't a 'fair contest' if refs allow that - it was very poor indeed.

Greenwood asked Nigel what he thought & he agreed that more needs to be done about it but Nige also said the ref's are focussing on lots at scrum time so I am not sure what can be done.

Maybe so, but the SA 9 was doing the most blatant feeding I have seen for a long time... I suspect that, if the ref had awarded a free kick against him early on, he'd have been more careful from then on.
“You cannot reason a man out of what he never reasoned himself into.” (Jonathan Swift)
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mundoscarlet Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 August 2021 at 11:53am
I wohkd say,the way to stop.it,would be 2 video refs,1 specific to focus on offsides and put in at scrum and also throwing in straight.these are areas where I think lots of things are getting missed,giving teams unfair advantages 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote John Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 August 2021 at 1:42pm
Originally posted by aber-fan aber-fan wrote:

Originally posted by Fscarlet Fscarlet wrote:

Originally posted by aber-fan aber-fan wrote:

Originally posted by dyniol53 dyniol53 wrote:

I don’t like the denigration of scrums as a contest. They’re a crucial part of the game and what makes rugby Union distinct from league. 

The value competitive, contestible scums bring is they mean teams require 2 extra distinct body types on the pitch. 

If you take away the importance of props and a scrummaging hooker you’ll have 6 players with the physique of back rowers on the pitch, meaning there will be less space for attackers and less value for the small players and running fullback who target the 120kg props to create gaps in defence.

Rugby Unions charm is in having a place for a Shane Williams and a Uini Antonio and Antoine DuPont and a Samson Lee, you don’t get such variety in Rugby League

I agree - BUT THE SA 9 was allowed to BLATANTLY put the ball into the second row, right in front of the ref. It certainly isn't a 'fair contest' if refs allow that - it was very poor indeed.

Greenwood asked Nigel what he thought & he agreed that more needs to be done about it but Nige also said the ref's are focussing on lots at scrum time so I am not sure what can be done.

Maybe so, but the SA 9 was doing the most blatant feeding I have seen for a long time... I suspect that, if the ref had awarded a free kick against him early on, he'd have been more careful from then on.

The rule, admittedly 2-3 seasons ago, was that the scrum half had to have the point of his left shoulder in line with the centre of the front row channel. He then had to put the ball in straight. The saffer 9s were barely abiding by the first part of this and absolutely weren't putting the ball in straight. 

What is needed is a return to 70s scrums where the front rows just folded into their binds, sometimes before the players on the ground had stood up. But getting that to happen is not going to be easy. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote RR1972 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 August 2021 at 4:34pm
Could go either way this. If you got a strong driving line out maul and a good kicker from hamd you can easily make a game plan out of this
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