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Dic Penderyn View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Dic Penderyn Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 January 2021 at 3:06pm
I think it a little early to judge the results of Brexit,whatever side of the debate we occupy.We haven't been out of the EU for a fortnight yet!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote GPR - Rochester Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 January 2021 at 3:10pm
Originally posted by aber-fan aber-fan wrote:

Originally posted by GPR - Rochester GPR - Rochester wrote:

Originally posted by Eastern outpost Eastern outpost wrote:

Thanks Aber.

If anyone knows of good fresh fish suppliers that deliver in the U.K., please could they let us know?

As scarce as hens teeth EO even if your within easy reach of Cardigan Bay. Most of the seafood is exported to France & Spain where consumers are prepared to pay better prices & eat a lot more per capita. A few years ago I was on holiday near Perpignan and managed to get Cardigan Bay crab in the local supermarket. I have a hell of job to find any in Cardigan - funny old world. 

How true - hence the problem.

Our local fish shop usually supplies excellent fresh fish and seafood from Cardigan Bay and elsewhere -https://www.facebook.com/JonahsFishMarket/

However, the post-holiday reopening is now "DELAYED UNTIL
WEDNESDAY 3RD FEBRUARY 2021*
THIS IS DUE TO VARIOUS
EXTERNAL FACTORS THAT HAS MASSIVELY AFFECTED OUR
SUPPLY OF FRESH FISH."

I don't know what the factors are, but will ask next time I get the chance... so this is SPECULATION: could it be that the fishermen can't be bothered to fish until they know they can safely export most of their catch to the EU? (I must add that the weather hasn't been too good the last couple of days, but was calm for quite a while before that.) - So, that bit is not a FACT (yet).

There you go EO they may be able to help you with onjline deliveries. May I suggest Aber that the external factors may include lockdown issues. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote aber-fan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 January 2021 at 3:12pm
Originally posted by GPR - Rochester GPR - Rochester wrote:

Originally posted by aber-fan aber-fan wrote:

Originally posted by GPR - Rochester GPR - Rochester wrote:

Originally posted by aber-fan aber-fan wrote:

I did ask for FACTS rather than commentary.

Here is another one - Scottish fishermen are now landing their catch in Denmark, to avoid the red tape:


A quote:

Wither also explained on Twitter that if boats fish in UK waters, but land in Denmark, processors here are cut out of trade. He also pointed out that fish on boats that dock in Denmark is traded within single market, which is advantageous as it avoids a lot of bureaucracy.

Facts without commentary are pretty meaningless Aber. Where do the so called facts come from for instance - to borrow Donald's favourite term fake news surrounds us. However I will desist from commenting in future when you roll out your FACTS. 

I'm astonished to see this comment.

I have posted links to NEWS REPORTS where you can VERY EASILY track down the quotes I provide. (Most so far have been links to BBC reports.)

If you don't like the FACTS, then by all means stick to FACT-FREE COMMENTARY. 

If that's what floats your boat!

In the meantime, I'll continue to post FACTS whether people like it or not.

Steady on Aber - no need to blow a gasket. My comment was pretty reasonable - facts can be gleaned from all sorts of places many, including the BBC are open to debate. I didn't say any of your quoted facts were incorrect so you need to slow down a little. All the facts that I have quoted, which so far you haven't commented on, are actually based on my personal experiences. 

I hadn't seen your comment - but as I have no knowledge of your business, can't really say anything sensible about it.

My comments are more to do with large scale effects on many people, or on SECTORS of the economy such as fishing.

It seems that the bureaucracy relating to the export of fish and shellfish is leading to catches being lost due to red tape delays at the ports, and to fishermen from Scotland landing their catches in Denmark to avoid all that. 

Do you dispute any of that? If so, on what grounds? (I did say I'd stick to one topic at a time, so unless you export fish there's nothing I can debate with you!)
“You cannot reason a man out of what he never reasoned himself into.” (Jonathan Swift)
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Dic Penderyn Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 January 2021 at 3:12pm
LOLLOLLOLLOLLOL
Headers on here,fair play!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote aber-fan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 January 2021 at 3:14pm
Originally posted by GPR - Rochester GPR - Rochester wrote:

Originally posted by aber-fan aber-fan wrote:

Originally posted by GPR - Rochester GPR - Rochester wrote:

Originally posted by Eastern outpost Eastern outpost wrote:

Thanks Aber.

If anyone knows of good fresh fish suppliers that deliver in the U.K., please could they let us know?

As scarce as hens teeth EO even if your within easy reach of Cardigan Bay. Most of the seafood is exported to France & Spain where consumers are prepared to pay better prices & eat a lot more per capita. A few years ago I was on holiday near Perpignan and managed to get Cardigan Bay crab in the local supermarket. I have a hell of job to find any in Cardigan - funny old world. 

How true - hence the problem.

Our local fish shop usually supplies excellent fresh fish and seafood from Cardigan Bay and elsewhere -https://www.facebook.com/JonahsFishMarket/

However, the post-holiday reopening is now "DELAYED UNTIL
WEDNESDAY 3RD FEBRUARY 2021*
THIS IS DUE TO VARIOUS
EXTERNAL FACTORS THAT HAS MASSIVELY AFFECTED OUR
SUPPLY OF FRESH FISH."

I don't know what the factors are, but will ask next time I get the chance... so this is SPECULATION: could it be that the fishermen can't be bothered to fish until they know they can safely export most of their catch to the EU? (I must add that the weather hasn't been too good the last couple of days, but was calm for quite a while before that.) - So, that bit is not a FACT (yet).

There you go EO they may be able to help you with onjline deliveries. May I suggest Aber that the external factors may include lockdown issues. 

i shall try to find out. In the meantime - it's a pity they are not re-opening yet.
“You cannot reason a man out of what he never reasoned himself into.” (Jonathan Swift)
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote aber-fan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 January 2021 at 3:15pm
Originally posted by Dic Penderyn Dic Penderyn wrote:

LOLLOLLOLLOLLOL
Headers on here,fair play!

Headers with FACTS - some of us, anyway!Wink
“You cannot reason a man out of what he never reasoned himself into.” (Jonathan Swift)
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Dic Penderyn Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 January 2021 at 3:20pm
Great stuff,boys-honestly.Inadvertently or not,you've lifted a little of my gloom today.
ClapClapClapClapClapClap
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote aber-fan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 January 2021 at 3:24pm
Originally posted by Dic Penderyn Dic Penderyn wrote:

Great stuff,boys-honestly.Inadvertently or not,you've lifted a little of my gloom today.
ClapClapClapClapClapClap

You know - I was a bit down before Christmas (that went so well, didn't it?) but have got the bit between my teeth this new year!
“You cannot reason a man out of what he never reasoned himself into.” (Jonathan Swift)
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote GPR - Rochester Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 January 2021 at 3:26pm
Originally posted by aber-fan aber-fan wrote:

Originally posted by GPR - Rochester GPR - Rochester wrote:

Originally posted by aber-fan aber-fan wrote:

Originally posted by GPR - Rochester GPR - Rochester wrote:

Originally posted by aber-fan aber-fan wrote:

I did ask for FACTS rather than commentary.

Here is another one - Scottish fishermen are now landing their catch in Denmark, to avoid the red tape:


A quote:

Wither also explained on Twitter that if boats fish in UK waters, but land in Denmark, processors here are cut out of trade. He also pointed out that fish on boats that dock in Denmark is traded within single market, which is advantageous as it avoids a lot of bureaucracy.

Facts without commentary are pretty meaningless Aber. Where do the so called facts come from for instance - to borrow Donald's favourite term fake news surrounds us. However I will desist from commenting in future when you roll out your FACTS. 

I'm astonished to see this comment.

I have posted links to NEWS REPORTS where you can VERY EASILY track down the quotes I provide. (Most so far have been links to BBC reports.)

If you don't like the FACTS, then by all means stick to FACT-FREE COMMENTARY. 

If that's what floats your boat!

In the meantime, I'll continue to post FACTS whether people like it or not.

Steady on Aber - no need to blow a gasket. My comment was pretty reasonable - facts can be gleaned from all sorts of places many, including the BBC are open to debate. I didn't say any of your quoted facts were incorrect so you need to slow down a little. All the facts that I have quoted, which so far you haven't commented on, are actually based on my personal experiences. 

I hadn't seen your comment - but as I have no knowledge of your business, can't really say anything sensible about it.

My comments are more to do with large scale effects on many people, or on SECTORS of the economy such as fishing.

It seems that the bureaucracy relating to the export of fish and shellfish is leading to catches being lost due to red tape delays at the ports, and to fishermen from Scotland landing their catches in Denmark to avoid all that. 

Do you dispute any of that? If so, on what grounds? (I did say I'd stick to one topic at a time, so unless you export fish there's nothing I can debate with you!)

A question you asked was linked to red tape hence my response as someone who has suffered with the red tape myself. I do not see that you need to know my business to understand my response. Most if not all of your facts to date revolve around the fishing industry. Of course any delays when you export fresh goods are unwelcome. Anyone involved needs to make sure that not only their paperwork is in order but also their customers. 

The fishing industry was always going to be a problem. I would make the following observations though - if our seafood had such good demand from Europe before 31/12/2020 I cannot see any valid insurmountable problem for it not to be equally as attractive post 31/12/2020. In the grand scheme of things the fishing industry equates to a very small % of our GDP.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote GPR - Rochester Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 January 2021 at 3:30pm
Originally posted by aber-fan aber-fan wrote:

Originally posted by Dic Penderyn Dic Penderyn wrote:

LOLLOLLOLLOLLOL
Headers on here,fair play!

Headers with FACTS - some of us, anyway!Wink

Help me out here Dic munCry. Just cos Aber's wife is French he's gone all De Gaulle on meConfusedWink
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote aber-fan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 January 2021 at 3:37pm
Originally posted by GPR - Rochester GPR - Rochester wrote:

Originally posted by aber-fan aber-fan wrote:

Originally posted by GPR - Rochester GPR - Rochester wrote:

Originally posted by aber-fan aber-fan wrote:

Originally posted by GPR - Rochester GPR - Rochester wrote:

Originally posted by aber-fan aber-fan wrote:

I did ask for FACTS rather than commentary.

Here is another one - Scottish fishermen are now landing their catch in Denmark, to avoid the red tape:


A quote:

Wither also explained on Twitter that if boats fish in UK waters, but land in Denmark, processors here are cut out of trade. He also pointed out that fish on boats that dock in Denmark is traded within single market, which is advantageous as it avoids a lot of bureaucracy.

Facts without commentary are pretty meaningless Aber. Where do the so called facts come from for instance - to borrow Donald's favourite term fake news surrounds us. However I will desist from commenting in future when you roll out your FACTS. 

I'm astonished to see this comment.

I have posted links to NEWS REPORTS where you can VERY EASILY track down the quotes I provide. (Most so far have been links to BBC reports.)

If you don't like the FACTS, then by all means stick to FACT-FREE COMMENTARY. 

If that's what floats your boat!

In the meantime, I'll continue to post FACTS whether people like it or not.

Steady on Aber - no need to blow a gasket. My comment was pretty reasonable - facts can be gleaned from all sorts of places many, including the BBC are open to debate. I didn't say any of your quoted facts were incorrect so you need to slow down a little. All the facts that I have quoted, which so far you haven't commented on, are actually based on my personal experiences. 

I hadn't seen your comment - but as I have no knowledge of your business, can't really say anything sensible about it.

My comments are more to do with large scale effects on many people, or on SECTORS of the economy such as fishing.

It seems that the bureaucracy relating to the export of fish and shellfish is leading to catches being lost due to red tape delays at the ports, and to fishermen from Scotland landing their catches in Denmark to avoid all that. 

Do you dispute any of that? If so, on what grounds? (I did say I'd stick to one topic at a time, so unless you export fish there's nothing I can debate with you!)

A question you asked was linked to red tape hence my response as someone who has suffered with the red tape myself. I do not see that you need to know my business to understand my response. Most if not all of your facts to date revolve around the fishing industry. Of course any delays when you export fresh goods are unwelcome. Anyone involved needs to make sure that not only their paperwork is in order but also their customers. 

The fishing industry was always going to be a problem. I would make the following observations though - if our seafood had such good demand from Europe before 31/12/2020 I cannot see any valid insurmountable problem for it not to be equally as attractive post 31/12/2020. In the grand scheme of things the fishing industry equates to a very small % of our GDP.

GPR - if you care to look back to my first post in this thread, you will see that I made it crystal clear that each post of mine would deal with a SINGLE issue - for the very good reason that, if we start to debate a lot of different sectors, soon no-one can see the wood for the trees.

So - the thread (so far) deals with fishing, the increased bureaucracy caused by Brexit, the fact that fish and seafood 'go off' pretty quickly if trapped at posts, and the fact that this puts companies and jobs at risk. 

You have not contradicted any of these points.

I did invite EVERYONE -  brexiters as well as remainers - to post FACTS relating to how things have changed since 1 January.

My idea is this - people can post POSITIVE stories on how Brexit has improved their lives, or NEGATIVE stories on how it has made things more difficult - without commentary.

Instead of attempting to undermine (unsuccessfully) what I have posted so far about fishing, would it not be more profitable for you to post some 'good news stories' about Brexit as a balance?

I would only ask that you post FACTUALLY BASED stories about what is happening NOW, not some pie-in- the sky promises about what might happen at some undefined future date. That sort of thing doesn't count.
“You cannot reason a man out of what he never reasoned himself into.” (Jonathan Swift)
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote GPR - Rochester Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 January 2021 at 3:47pm
Originally posted by aber-fan aber-fan wrote:

Originally posted by GPR - Rochester GPR - Rochester wrote:

Originally posted by aber-fan aber-fan wrote:

Originally posted by GPR - Rochester GPR - Rochester wrote:

Originally posted by aber-fan aber-fan wrote:

Originally posted by GPR - Rochester GPR - Rochester wrote:

Originally posted by aber-fan aber-fan wrote:

I did ask for FACTS rather than commentary.

Here is another one - Scottish fishermen are now landing their catch in Denmark, to avoid the red tape:


A quote:

Wither also explained on Twitter that if boats fish in UK waters, but land in Denmark, processors here are cut out of trade. He also pointed out that fish on boats that dock in Denmark is traded within single market, which is advantageous as it avoids a lot of bureaucracy.

Facts without commentary are pretty meaningless Aber. Where do the so called facts come from for instance - to borrow Donald's favourite term fake news surrounds us. However I will desist from commenting in future when you roll out your FACTS. 

I'm astonished to see this comment.

I have posted links to NEWS REPORTS where you can VERY EASILY track down the quotes I provide. (Most so far have been links to BBC reports.)

If you don't like the FACTS, then by all means stick to FACT-FREE COMMENTARY. 

If that's what floats your boat!

In the meantime, I'll continue to post FACTS whether people like it or not.

Steady on Aber - no need to blow a gasket. My comment was pretty reasonable - facts can be gleaned from all sorts of places many, including the BBC are open to debate. I didn't say any of your quoted facts were incorrect so you need to slow down a little. All the facts that I have quoted, which so far you haven't commented on, are actually based on my personal experiences. 

I hadn't seen your comment - but as I have no knowledge of your business, can't really say anything sensible about it.

My comments are more to do with large scale effects on many people, or on SECTORS of the economy such as fishing.

It seems that the bureaucracy relating to the export of fish and shellfish is leading to catches being lost due to red tape delays at the ports, and to fishermen from Scotland landing their catches in Denmark to avoid all that. 

Do you dispute any of that? If so, on what grounds? (I did say I'd stick to one topic at a time, so unless you export fish there's nothing I can debate with you!)

A question you asked was linked to red tape hence my response as someone who has suffered with the red tape myself. I do not see that you need to know my business to understand my response. Most if not all of your facts to date revolve around the fishing industry. Of course any delays when you export fresh goods are unwelcome. Anyone involved needs to make sure that not only their paperwork is in order but also their customers. 

The fishing industry was always going to be a problem. I would make the following observations though - if our seafood had such good demand from Europe before 31/12/2020 I cannot see any valid insurmountable problem for it not to be equally as attractive post 31/12/2020. In the grand scheme of things the fishing industry equates to a very small % of our GDP.

GPR - if you care to look back to my first post in this thread, you will see that I made it crystal clear that each post of mine would deal with a SINGLE issue - for the very good reason that, if we start to debate a lot of different sectors, soon no-one can see the wood for the trees.

So - the thread (so far) deals with fishing, the increased bureaucracy caused by Brexit, the fact that fish and seafood 'go off' pretty quickly if trapped at posts, and the fact that this puts companies and jobs at risk. 

You have not contradicted any of these points.

I did invite EVERYONE -  brexiters as well as remainers - to post FACTS relating to how things have changed since 1 January.

My idea is this - people can post POSITIVE stories on how Brexit has improved their lives, or NEGATIVE stories on how it has made things more difficult - without commentary.

Instead of attempting to undermine (unsuccessfully) what I have posted so far about fishing, would it not be more profitable for you to post some 'good news stories' about Brexit as a balance?

I would only ask that you post FACTUALLY BASED stories about what is happening NOW, not some pie-in- the sky promises about what might happen at some undefined future date. That sort of thing doesn't count.

Clearly Aber you feel very strongly about this which, of course, is your prerogative. I do not intend to spend my time searching for good news stories which only serve to wind up further those on here who do not share my views. I have given first hand experience of my small export business which has suffered some minor disruption. My view remains strongly that leaving was by far the correct decision. On that note I think I will take my leave of this thread. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Rob o'r Bont Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 January 2021 at 4:49pm
Well here's a FACT.  Goods being delivered to my business from France that were due last week will not now arrive until next month at the earliest or so I'm told.

And don't forget.........

........the trade deal on services has not yet been done, only the trade deal on goods.  A long way to go before we can really judge. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote aber-fan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 January 2021 at 4:50pm
I forgot to post this earlier - the Fisheries Minister could not be bothered to read the relevant section of the final text of the agreement. She was too busy - sorting out a nativity!

You could not make it up.


Downing Street has said Boris Johnson maintains confidence in the fisheries minister after she admitted not reading the post-Brexit trade deal with Brussels when it was agreed because she was busy organising a nativity trail.

Victoria Prentis faced calls for her to quit after the comments, but the prime minister is standing by the Department for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs (Defra) minister.

The SNP’s Brexit spokesperson, Philippa Whitford, said: “Due to Brexit-induced bureaucracy, Scotland’s fishing communities are already experiencing severe disruption and cannot get their produce to their customers in the EU market on time.

“For the Tory government’s fisheries minister to then admit that she did not even bother to read the details of the damaging deal because she was too busy is unbelievable and makes her position untenable.”

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote aber-fan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 January 2021 at 4:56pm
I see that 'supporters of Brexit' have so far been unable to post any good news stories relating to the event.

Not even the £350 million a week for the NHS? No?

So, in the absence of any good news from Brexiters, I'll help them out with one or two: here's the first - 


Boris Johnson's dad has applied for French citizenship. The fewer Johnsons in the UK, the better - aas far as I'm concerned.

It will be even better news when Boris follows suit.
“You cannot reason a man out of what he never reasoned himself into.” (Jonathan Swift)
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Eastern outpost Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 January 2021 at 7:09pm
Originally posted by GPR - Rochester GPR - Rochester wrote:

Originally posted by aber-fan aber-fan wrote:

Originally posted by GPR - Rochester GPR - Rochester wrote:

Originally posted by Eastern outpost Eastern outpost wrote:

Thanks Aber.

If anyone knows of good fresh fish suppliers that deliver in the U.K., please could they let us know?

As scarce as hens teeth EO even if your within easy reach of Cardigan Bay. Most of the seafood is exported to France & Spain where consumers are prepared to pay better prices & eat a lot more per capita. A few years ago I was on holiday near Perpignan and managed to get Cardigan Bay crab in the local supermarket. I have a hell of job to find any in Cardigan - funny old world. 

How true - hence the problem.

Our local fish shop usually supplies excellent fresh fish and seafood from Cardigan Bay and elsewhere -https://www.facebook.com/JonahsFishMarket/

However, the post-holiday reopening is now "DELAYED UNTIL
WEDNESDAY 3RD FEBRUARY 2021*
THIS IS DUE TO VARIOUS
EXTERNAL FACTORS THAT HAS MASSIVELY AFFECTED OUR
SUPPLY OF FRESH FISH."

I don't know what the factors are, but will ask next time I get the chance... so this is SPECULATION: could it be that the fishermen can't be bothered to fish until they know they can safely export most of their catch to the EU? (I must add that the weather hasn't been too good the last couple of days, but was calm for quite a while before that.) - So, that bit is not a FACT (yet).

There you go EO they may be able to help you with onjline deliveries. May I suggest Aber that the external factors may include lockdown issues. 
Thanks Aber. I’ll give them a call and see if I can find out anything.
In a world where you can be anything – Be Kind.
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