| Author |
 Topic Search  Topic Options
|
lofty evans 
Rambler
Joined: 20 September 2007
Location: Gorseinon
Status: Offline
Points: 53074
|
 Post Options
 Thanks(1)
 Quote  Reply
 Posted: 04 January 2023 at 2:20pm |
 GPR - Rochester wrote:
RR1972 wrote:
GPR - Rochester wrote:
I'm afraid I've heard all the reasons many times before - fight your way out of poverty, good for discipline etc but the reality is always the same. Encouraging head contact multiple times per 3 minutes will inevitably lead to health damage.
Deaths from horse riding may be more than in the ring but I wonder if a long term study has been done to gauge the longer term health damage to boxers in general. I would have a wager that the study would find far greater deterioration than shall we say for jockeys.
The final reason of it would drive it underground is not really a reason is it - its a cop out. Why ban anything in this world if it will drive it underground. For sure if it went underground with no TV coverage, no sports washing finance from Saudi land, no massive TV/newspaper build up, no sell out Wembleys - far less money would be available so far less participation. Personally I admire the physical conditioning & dedication of the top boxers but that doesn't make it acceptable. It is barbaric full stop. |
prizefighting has been happeming for humdreds of years. It won’t stop if you ban it . People will rightly or wrongly always want to see and be willing to pay to see people fight and to gamble on the outcome. I boxed as a kid and in the army it was something i enjoyed doing , i respect your views on the matter but i remain unashamedly pro boxing and i always will be. Will my health suffer in the future? Maybe but that was my choice to make. Compare that to say fox hunting or coursing and to me they are barbaric past times |
I agree with you about fox hunting & coursing. For sure there will always be a market for prize fighting but the point I am making is that if you take away massive income potential then you dramatically reduce numbers thereby dramatically reducing the numbers being harmed. |
Some great thoughts and comments in this and I'm grateful for all the contributions. I love boxing, used to box my twin brother to sort our any arguments...yep really.
But it's a tough one, there are guys and ladies out there who have a skill for fighting. As a species its unfortunately a part of our make up and Humans will always fight, some are excellent at it most are not and im part of them. But I enjoy watching 2 highly trained individuals pitting their skills against each other. I do not want anyone badly injured and losing their lives in the ring, the World throughout sport has woken up to to the simple fact we are all soft tissue held up by a Skeleton and delicate. Media and films contribute to this imaginary thought that the human.body can take all sort of punishment, you can train to take impacts and blows and remain alive, boxers punches are classed as a dangerous weapon and cannot and should not be used on Joe average, they are lethal. So these guys train, train and train to do something I believe they actually enjoy. And with it comes substantial rewards but there are risks and they know them, life is a risk, there are no guarantees for anything so its a personal choice.
On that note of personal choice when Jonny Owen died on the 4th November 1980 aged only 24 after falling into a coma from a fight, the Matchstick Man, he was one of 8 children I watched him fight and he was a brilliant boxer. Yet he was a shy and modest man , so shy he dies at 24 never really having a genuine date with a girl . Yet in the ring he was transformed , possessed by a furious aggression to wear down his opponents ...his thin and unmuscular body through the hardest punches. He was one of my hero's, I cried when he died. And now today the ring provides an opportunity, dangerous or not we are all surrounded by risks. Jeremy Renner of Marvel films critically ill in hospital after being run over by a snow plough, An American footballer Damar Hamlin after a heavy tackle in the NFL collapses after getting back on his feet , had CPR twice...he died twice.....everything we do in life has a degree of risk, I could go on and on about this but these two instances are over the last 2 days....so it all.coes down to personal choice. Everyone has choices, it's the roads we all take everyday.
As for bloodsport and the foxes, badgers and Stag hunting and trophy hunting and getting off on cruelty to animals and all the cruelty the human race dishes out to each other and the widelife we share this planet with, if we killed humans in the quantity we slaughter animals the human race would be wiped out in a few months.....my thoughts on that would fill this forums library. For me I truly believe in Karma ....life is an echo what you send out will come back to you. So be kind always.
I still love boxing.
|
|
In 1972, Roy Bergiers scored that try and said "that was for you lofty"
"All you have to decide is what to do with the time that is given to us"
|
 |
|
Sponsored Links
|
|
|
RR1972
Veteran
Joined: 27 April 2009
Status: Offline
Points: 17747
|
Post Options
Thanks(1)
Quote Reply
Posted: 04 January 2023 at 6:38pm |
|
It’s s moot point anyhow, no way boxing gets banned. Too many people enjoy it and it makes too much money. Futy vs uysk will be a nigh on billion pound event when everything is taken into account
|
|
scarletpimp
Veteran
Joined: 22 November 2015
Location: llanelli
Status: Offline
Points: 2276
|
Post Options
Thanks(1)
Quote Reply
Posted: 04 January 2023 at 9:36pm |
lofty evans wrote:
GPR - Rochester wrote:
RR1972 wrote:
GPR - Rochester wrote:
I'm afraid I've heard all the reasons many times before - fight your way out of poverty, good for discipline etc but the reality is always the same. Encouraging head contact multiple times per 3 minutes will inevitably lead to health damage.
Deaths from horse riding may be more than in the ring but I wonder if a long term study has been done to gauge the longer term health damage to boxers in general. I would have a wager that the study would find far greater deterioration than shall we say for jockeys.
The final reason of it would drive it underground is not really a reason is it - its a cop out. Why ban anything in this world if it will drive it underground. For sure if it went underground with no TV coverage, no sports washing finance from Saudi land, no massive TV/newspaper build up, no sell out Wembleys - far less money would be available so far less participation. Personally I admire the physical conditioning & dedication of the top boxers but that doesn't make it acceptable. It is barbaric full stop. |
prizefighting has been happeming for humdreds of years. It won’t stop if you ban it . People will rightly or wrongly always want to see and be willing to pay to see people fight and to gamble on the outcome. I boxed as a kid and in the army it was something i enjoyed doing , i respect your views on the matter but i remain unashamedly pro boxing and i always will be. Will my health suffer in the future? Maybe but that was my choice to make. Compare that to say fox hunting or coursing and to me they are barbaric past times |
I agree with you about fox hunting & coursing. For sure there will always be a market for prize fighting but the point I am making is that if you take away massive income potential then you dramatically reduce numbers thereby dramatically reducing the numbers being harmed. |
Some great thoughts and comments in this and I'm grateful for all the contributions. I love boxing, used to box my twin brother to sort our any arguments...yep really.
But it's a tough one, there are guys and ladies out there who have a skill for fighting. As a species its unfortunately a part of our make up and Humans will always fight, some are excellent at it most are not and im part of them. But I enjoy watching 2 highly trained individuals pitting their skills against each other. I do not want anyone badly injured and losing their lives in the ring, the World throughout sport has woken up to to the simple fact we are all soft tissue held up by a Skeleton and delicate. Media and films contribute to this imaginary thought that the human.body can take all sort of punishment, you can train to take impacts and blows and remain alive, boxers punches are classed as a dangerous weapon and cannot and should not be used on Joe average, they are lethal. So these guys train, train and train to do something I believe they actually enjoy. And with it comes substantial rewards but there are risks and they know them, life is a risk, there are no guarantees for anything so its a personal choice.
On that note of personal choice when Jonny Owen died on the 4th November 1980 aged only 24 after falling into a coma from a fight, the Matchstick Man, he was one of 8 children I watched him fight and he was a brilliant boxer. Yet he was a shy and modest man , so shy he dies at 24 never really having a genuine date with a girl . Yet in the ring he was transformed , possessed by a furious aggression to wear down his opponents ...his thin and unmuscular body through the hardest punches. He was one of my hero's, I cried when he died. And now today the ring provides an opportunity, dangerous or not we are all surrounded by risks. Jeremy Renner of Marvel films critically ill in hospital after being run over by a snow plough, An American footballer Damar Hamlin after a heavy tackle in the NFL collapses after getting back on his feet , had CPR twice...he died twice.....everything we do in life has a degree of risk, I could go on and on about this but these two instances are over the last 2 days....so it all.coes down to personal choice. Everyone has choices, it's the roads we all take everyday.
As for bloodsport and the foxes, badgers and Stag hunting and trophy hunting and getting off on cruelty to animals and all the cruelty the human race dishes out to each other and the widelife we share this planet with, if we killed humans in the quantity we slaughter animals the human race would be wiped out in a few months.....my thoughts on that would fill this forums library. For me I truly believe in Karma ....life is an echo what you send out will come back to you. So be kind always.
I still love boxing.
|
I love boxing too. I remember getting up as a boy, to watch mohamed ali(casius clay) fighting Joe frazer and later George foreman with my dad....Great Times, we all rooting for Ali of course.
Regarding bloodsport, I agree with Lofty. Disgusting activity. Tories have tried turning a blind eye to what's been going on in the last 10 years, with minimal prosecutions. Tory MP'S like Simon Hart, have been employed by the countryside alliance previous to him being elected, and have supported him since.
|
|
I stood yer on tanner bank
|
|
GPR - Rochester
Veteran
Joined: 01 December 2014
Location: Rhydcymerau
Status: Offline
Points: 17885
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 05 January 2023 at 7:48am |
All interesting but dare I say very predictable responses. My initial question was " Yet here we have a "sport" which encourages participants to actually knock out their victims. In what parallel universe does this make any sense?
I love boxing does not really answer that does it? Of course we are all entitled to our opinions & respect for those opinions. I don't love boxing for all the reasons stated.
|
|
GPR - Rochester
Veteran
Joined: 01 December 2014
Location: Rhydcymerau
Status: Offline
Points: 17885
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 05 January 2023 at 8:22am |
scarletpimp wrote:
lofty evans wrote:
GPR - Rochester wrote:
RR1972 wrote:
GPR - Rochester wrote:
I'm afraid I've heard all the reasons many times before - fight your way out of poverty, good for discipline etc but the reality is always the same. Encouraging head contact multiple times per 3 minutes will inevitably lead to health damage.
Deaths from horse riding may be more than in the ring but I wonder if a long term study has been done to gauge the longer term health damage to boxers in general. I would have a wager that the study would find far greater deterioration than shall we say for jockeys.
The final reason of it would drive it underground is not really a reason is it - its a cop out. Why ban anything in this world if it will drive it underground. For sure if it went underground with no TV coverage, no sports washing finance from Saudi land, no massive TV/newspaper build up, no sell out Wembleys - far less money would be available so far less participation. Personally I admire the physical conditioning & dedication of the top boxers but that doesn't make it acceptable. It is barbaric full stop. |
prizefighting has been happeming for humdreds of years. It won’t stop if you ban it . People will rightly or wrongly always want to see and be willing to pay to see people fight and to gamble on the outcome. I boxed as a kid and in the army it was something i enjoyed doing , i respect your views on the matter but i remain unashamedly pro boxing and i always will be. Will my health suffer in the future? Maybe but that was my choice to make. Compare that to say fox hunting or coursing and to me they are barbaric past times |
I agree with you about fox hunting & coursing. For sure there will always be a market for prize fighting but the point I am making is that if you take away massive income potential then you dramatically reduce numbers thereby dramatically reducing the numbers being harmed. |
Some great thoughts and comments in this and I'm grateful for all the contributions. I love boxing, used to box my twin brother to sort our any arguments...yep really.
But it's a tough one, there are guys and ladies out there who have a skill for fighting. As a species its unfortunately a part of our make up and Humans will always fight, some are excellent at it most are not and im part of them. But I enjoy watching 2 highly trained individuals pitting their skills against each other. I do not want anyone badly injured and losing their lives in the ring, the World throughout sport has woken up to to the simple fact we are all soft tissue held up by a Skeleton and delicate. Media and films contribute to this imaginary thought that the human.body can take all sort of punishment, you can train to take impacts and blows and remain alive, boxers punches are classed as a dangerous weapon and cannot and should not be used on Joe average, they are lethal. So these guys train, train and train to do something I believe they actually enjoy. And with it comes substantial rewards but there are risks and they know them, life is a risk, there are no guarantees for anything so its a personal choice.
On that note of personal choice when Jonny Owen died on the 4th November 1980 aged only 24 after falling into a coma from a fight, the Matchstick Man, he was one of 8 children I watched him fight and he was a brilliant boxer. Yet he was a shy and modest man , so shy he dies at 24 never really having a genuine date with a girl . Yet in the ring he was transformed , possessed by a furious aggression to wear down his opponents ...his thin and unmuscular body through the hardest punches. He was one of my hero's, I cried when he died. And now today the ring provides an opportunity, dangerous or not we are all surrounded by risks. Jeremy Renner of Marvel films critically ill in hospital after being run over by a snow plough, An American footballer Damar Hamlin after a heavy tackle in the NFL collapses after getting back on his feet , had CPR twice...he died twice.....everything we do in life has a degree of risk, I could go on and on about this but these two instances are over the last 2 days....so it all.coes down to personal choice. Everyone has choices, it's the roads we all take everyday.
As for bloodsport and the foxes, badgers and Stag hunting and trophy hunting and getting off on cruelty to animals and all the cruelty the human race dishes out to each other and the widelife we share this planet with, if we killed humans in the quantity we slaughter animals the human race would be wiped out in a few months.....my thoughts on that would fill this forums library. For me I truly believe in Karma ....life is an echo what you send out will come back to you. So be kind always.
I still love boxing.
|
I love boxing too. I remember getting up as a boy, to watch mohamed ali(casius clay) fighting Joe frazer and later George foreman with my dad....Great Times, we all rooting for Ali of course.
Regarding bloodsport, I agree with Lofty. Disgusting activity. Tories have tried turning a blind eye to what's been going on in the last 10 years, with minimal prosecutions. Tory MP'S like Simon Hart, have been employed by the countryside alliance previous to him being elected, and have supported him since. |
Thats a very interesting observation you make Pimp. Blood sports are a disgusting activity whereas I love boxing. Its ok for two people to attempt for money to cause as much damage as possible to one another in front of paying spectators throughout the World sometimes.
I see everyday the effects that dementia/alzheimers can have on an individual's life and therefore doing everything possible to avoid such outcomes would be pretty close to the top of my agenda.
|
|
RR1972
Veteran
Joined: 27 April 2009
Status: Offline
Points: 17747
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 05 January 2023 at 10:13am |
|
One thing i would add is that boxing has weight classes it is men/women of equal size competing against each other(bar heavyweight) .contact Sports like rugby nfl etc you can get collisions between people 5 6 or7 stone heavier than each other you won’t get that in a boxing ring. Another thing is that while contact sports such as boxing do make head trauma more likely by keeping you fit they also reduce likely hood of obesity, heart attacks strokes etc. As for knock outs you rarely see them in school boy boxing or even amatuer boxing with head guards erc. You do get them in the pro game but if your a pro boxer you know the risks and most pros know how to avoid injury. This isn’ “milling” or two guys slugging it out in a pub these are skilled professionals who have been trained for years in avoiding getting hit . There is also a set period between fights if you are kod and strict and regular medicals before your ok’d to fight. Boxing has never been safer in the uk but it will never be totally safe then again neither wull horse riding, motor cycling, ski jumping, rugby, mountaineering etc
Edited by RR1972 - 05 January 2023 at 10:30am
|
|
lofty evans
Rambler
Joined: 20 September 2007
Location: Gorseinon
Status: Offline
Points: 53074
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 05 January 2023 at 10:37am |
GPR - Rochester wrote:
All interesting but dare I say very predictable responses. My initial question was " Yet here we have a "sport" which encourages participants to actually knock out their victims. In what parallel universe does this make any sense?
I love boxing does not really answer that does it? Of course we are all entitled to our opinions & respect for those opinions. I don't love boxing for all the reasons stated. |
I have had this discussion with my daughter who won't watch it , even though I've encouraged her ...so I understand your viewpoint.
Yes in respect its a primeval sport, basic in every form , it's the contest of who is the better man.
|
|
In 1972, Roy Bergiers scored that try and said "that was for you lofty"
"All you have to decide is what to do with the time that is given to us"
|
|
GPR - Rochester
Veteran
Joined: 01 December 2014
Location: Rhydcymerau
Status: Offline
Points: 17885
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 05 January 2023 at 10:40am |
lofty evans wrote:
GPR - Rochester wrote:
All interesting but dare I say very predictable responses. My initial question was " Yet here we have a "sport" which encourages participants to actually knock out their victims. In what parallel universe does this make any sense?
I love boxing does not really answer that does it? Of course we are all entitled to our opinions & respect for those opinions. I don't love boxing for all the reasons stated. |
I have had this discussion with my daughter who won't watch it , even though I've encouraged her ...so I understand your viewpoint.
Yes in respect its a primeval sport, basic in every form , it's the contest of who is the better man.
|
I won't start a new topic based on "the better man" comment or we will be here for years. Suffice for us all to agree to disagree.
|
|
lofty evans
Rambler
Joined: 20 September 2007
Location: Gorseinon
Status: Offline
Points: 53074
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 05 January 2023 at 10:43am |
I've ridden motorbikes for 50 years and suggest has a higher risk of anything compared to a trained prizefighter. I get GPRs concern for individuals hitting the hell out of each other. But I believe the reason is the term prize fighter....they do it for what they can attain.
For me watching Sugar Ray Leonard displaying his boxing skills in the ring was magic, sorry GPR
|
|
In 1972, Roy Bergiers scored that try and said "that was for you lofty"
"All you have to decide is what to do with the time that is given to us"
|
|
lofty evans
Rambler
Joined: 20 September 2007
Location: Gorseinon
Status: Offline
Points: 53074
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 05 January 2023 at 10:46am |
GPR - Rochester wrote:
lofty evans wrote:
GPR - Rochester wrote:
All interesting but dare I say very predictable responses. My initial question was " Yet here we have a "sport" which encourages participants to actually knock out their victims. In what parallel universe does this make any sense?
I love boxing does not really answer that does it? Of course we are all entitled to our opinions & respect for those opinions. I don't love boxing for all the reasons stated. |
I have had this discussion with my daughter who won't watch it , even though I've encouraged her ...so I understand your viewpoint.
Yes in respect its a primeval sport, basic in every form , it's the contest of who is the better man.
|
I won't start a new topic based on "the better man" comment or we will be here for years. Suffice for us all to agree to disagree. |
It's great to debate....differing viewpoints are an interesting read and will provoke thought and surely a good thing. We all have stories to tell, so let's get on with it.....enlightenment is a fab thing.....right or wrong....when we stop learning we are dead.
|
|
In 1972, Roy Bergiers scored that try and said "that was for you lofty"
"All you have to decide is what to do with the time that is given to us"
|
|
lofty evans
Rambler
Joined: 20 September 2007
Location: Gorseinon
Status: Offline
Points: 53074
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 05 January 2023 at 10:48am |
RR1972 wrote:
It’s s moot point anyhow, no way boxing gets banned. Too many people enjoy it and it makes too much money. Futy vs uysk will be a nigh on billion pound event when everything is taken into account |
Agree on the money involved with this one...
|
|
In 1972, Roy Bergiers scored that try and said "that was for you lofty"
"All you have to decide is what to do with the time that is given to us"
|
|
GPR - Rochester
Veteran
Joined: 01 December 2014
Location: Rhydcymerau
Status: Offline
Points: 17885
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 05 January 2023 at 12:52pm |
lofty evans wrote:
GPR - Rochester wrote:
lofty evans wrote:
GPR - Rochester wrote:
All interesting but dare I say very predictable responses. My initial question was " Yet here we have a "sport" which encourages participants to actually knock out their victims. In what parallel universe does this make any sense?
I love boxing does not really answer that does it? Of course we are all entitled to our opinions & respect for those opinions. I don't love boxing for all the reasons stated. |
I have had this discussion with my daughter who won't watch it , even though I've encouraged her ...so I understand your viewpoint.
Yes in respect its a primeval sport, basic in every form , it's the contest of who is the better man.
|
So very true Lofty.
I won't start a new topic based on "the better man" comment or we will be here for years. Suffice for us all to agree to disagree. |
It's great to debate....differing viewpoints are an interesting read and will provoke thought and surely a good thing. We all have stories to tell, so let's get on with it.....enlightenment is a fab thing.....right or wrong....when we stop learning we are dead.
|
|
|
RR1972
Veteran
Joined: 27 April 2009
Status: Offline
Points: 17747
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 13 January 2023 at 11:20pm |
|
Eubano vs snith. A good big un vs a good little un. Who we got? Smith on points for me
Edited by RR1972 - 13 January 2023 at 11:20pm
|
|
RR1972
Veteran
Joined: 27 April 2009
Status: Offline
Points: 17747
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 13 January 2023 at 11:21pm |
GPR - Rochester wrote:
lofty evans wrote:
GPR - Rochester wrote:
lofty evans wrote:
GPR - Rochester wrote:
All interesting but dare I say very predictable responses. My initial question was " Yet here we have a "sport" which encourages participants to actually knock out their victims. In what parallel universe does this make any sense?
I love boxing does not really answer that does it? Of course we are all entitled to our opinions & respect for those opinions. I don't love boxing for all the reasons stated. |
I have had this discussion with my daughter who won't watch it , even though I've encouraged her ...so I understand your viewpoint.
Yes in respect its a primeval sport, basic in every form , it's the contest of who is the better man.
|
So very true Lofty.
I won't start a new topic based on "the better man" comment or we will be here for years. Suffice for us all to agree to disagree. |
It's great to debate....differing viewpoints are an interesting read and will provoke thought and surely a good thing. We all have stories to tell, so let's get on with it.....enlightenment is a fab thing.....right or wrong....when we stop learning we are dead.
|
|
spot on my friend 
|
|
lofty evans
Rambler
Joined: 20 September 2007
Location: Gorseinon
Status: Offline
Points: 53074
|
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Quote Reply
Posted: 14 January 2023 at 12:39pm |
RR1972 wrote:
Eubano vs snith. A good big un vs a good little un. Who we got? Smith on points for me
|
Usyk already starting mind games.
|
|
In 1972, Roy Bergiers scored that try and said "that was for you lofty"
"All you have to decide is what to do with the time that is given to us"
|
|
Tweet
