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dyniol53 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote dyniol53 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 July 2021 at 2:54pm
Originally posted by GPR - Rochester GPR - Rochester wrote:

Originally posted by KID A KID A wrote:

Rassie Erasmus has released an hour long rant criticising the Lions management and the officiating. He doesn't look in the best of health to me:

https://vimeo.com/579940415

Think Rassie is losing the plot in all honesty. Gatland is winning the mind game hands down at the moment. He is looking and sounding like a man under extreme pressure & if that gets through to his players they are going to need a very convincing first 20 minutes on Saturday. If the Lions can stay with them for the first 40 minutes it could well be all over. 

Lol yeah i was enjoying the Jaco Johan banter earlier on in the week but 1 hour video to try and put pressure on the officials this Sat is well beyond the Lions questioning whether a TMO should be the same nationality as the the home country.

I for one would welcome each coach having a 1 hour 'tear down' of every questionable refereeing decision after each game, only on the condition that a rival fan was allowed in the room/dialed in on zoom giving the coach sh*t for their partisan takes.

"What's your 5 doing in that ruck Rassie?" 
"Are you sure your ruler is straight...?"


Edited by dyniol53 - 29 July 2021 at 2:57pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote GPR - Rochester Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 July 2021 at 7:54am
Originally posted by aber-fan aber-fan wrote:

Originally posted by GPR - Rochester GPR - Rochester wrote:

If DVM keeps Kolbe quiet again then we cannot argue. One of the things nagging away at me as kick off approaches is the fact that a clearly tiring Boks team scored one try and had two other close calls in the 2nd half whilst I don't recall the Lions looking like scoring another try. Yes Henshaw's break should have resulted in a supporting player - Price of DVM getting a chance. 

My point really is that the Boks are labelled an attritional, kick chase, defensively minded team yet they created more - funny old game. 

Half right - they had more (apparent) try chances, but didn't 'create' anything... one opportunity came when Kolbe knocked on and Hogg threw a wild pass..., another when after a Lions' kick ahead, all three chasers, oddly, missed the guy fielding the ball - that was very poor, unless they were blocked off (it didn't look like it).

So - more chances; no more creativity. If the Lions cut out those daft errors (and I think Gats will have something to say about that), then it should not be an issue.

A greater worry - for me - is the selection of the slow and predictable Murray at 9. But, we'll see.

A fair point Aber but whether they create chances through line breaks or defensive pressure forcing mistakes doesn't make a blind bit of difference when we look back at the result in weeks/months. I guess my biggest worry is this all happened in the 2nd half when the Boks were, in most opinions, tiring badly. The million rand question this week is how much better/fitter they will be for that game. They clearly knew that they needed to conserve energy last week as they had no problem kicking out on the full on many occasions. They will have worked very hard on the Lions lineout this week for sure - Lawes may well be singled out for some attention. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote aber-fan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 July 2021 at 1:15pm
Originally posted by GPR - Rochester GPR - Rochester wrote:

Originally posted by aber-fan aber-fan wrote:

Originally posted by GPR - Rochester GPR - Rochester wrote:

If DVM keeps Kolbe quiet again then we cannot argue. One of the things nagging away at me as kick off approaches is the fact that a clearly tiring Boks team scored one try and had two other close calls in the 2nd half whilst I don't recall the Lions looking like scoring another try. Yes Henshaw's break should have resulted in a supporting player - Price of DVM getting a chance. 

My point really is that the Boks are labelled an attritional, kick chase, defensively minded team yet they created more - funny old game. 

Half right - they had more (apparent) try chances, but didn't 'create' anything... one opportunity came when Kolbe knocked on and Hogg threw a wild pass..., another when after a Lions' kick ahead, all three chasers, oddly, missed the guy fielding the ball - that was very poor, unless they were blocked off (it didn't look like it).

So - more chances; no more creativity. If the Lions cut out those daft errors (and I think Gats will have something to say about that), then it should not be an issue.

A greater worry - for me - is the selection of the slow and predictable Murray at 9. But, we'll see.

A fair point Aber but whether they create chances through line breaks or defensive pressure forcing mistakes doesn't make a blind bit of difference when we look back at the result in weeks/months. I guess my biggest worry is this all happened in the 2nd half when the Boks were, in most opinions, tiring badly. The million rand question this week is how much better/fitter they will be for that game. They clearly knew that they needed to conserve energy last week as they had no problem kicking out on the full on many occasions. They will have worked very hard on the Lions lineout this week for sure - Lawes may well be singled out for some attention. 

Yes, but the Lions made stupid errors when NOT under pressure, which was part of what I was trying to argue. If Gatland and Tandy have given them a bit of the old hair-drier treatment after the last game, I'd expect to see improvement tomorrow.

And form SA as well, of course.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote aber-fan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 July 2021 at 6:17pm
SA a bit lucky with the cards, IMO - de Klerk with a high tackle on Murray, and the hooker doing a no-arm tackle 10m or less from the line... Kolbe could have seen a red, too...

Lions edging it ATM, but the breaks in play will suit SA, slowing the tempo... Murray a couple of times miles from the ruck, allowing SA to counter-ruck, and no-one else taking responsibility -Watson ran to the wing instead of claiming the ball.

Ref not controlling the breakdown - far too messy, allowing SA players to go over and beyond the ball, and around the sides. He also doesn't insist on players releasing after the tackle - Mpimpi won one pen for 'not releasing', when he was part of the tackle and should have been penalised himself. I get the impression that the ref has been intimidated by the Erasmus blast, and is giving SA the benefit of any doubts there are.

Lions still look a bit stronger overall, but it could go either way.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote aber-fan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 July 2021 at 7:23pm
SA 27 Lions 9

Well, the Boks completely ruled that second half, winning nearly all the aerial battles and most of the breakdowns... if it was possible, I'd drop all of the back 3 on that performance! Surely, Liam and Adams must start next week, though in whose place I really don't know. Will they risk giving LRZ a run, too? He surely can't do any worse than the boys out there today.

I won't say that the selection of Murray on place of Price was major factor, since there were so many breaks in play in the first half - but it didn't help. Biggar did what they asked of him, but maybe Russell is worth a shot. I'd bring Navidi into the back row, and maybe a big boy onto the bench in place of Beirne or Faletau - Beard or Hill... Lions were overpowered second half.

TBH, after that SA will be strong favourites in the last test, but who knows? It's all to play for, now.

Edit: Wyn Jones to come in, too - if fit.


Edited by aber-fan - 31 July 2021 at 7:24pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote gaffer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 July 2021 at 7:25pm
A complete hammering in the second half - the centres and the back 3 are the poorest combination I've ever seen in a Lions team. Selection of Scottish show-ponies for the tour also a disaster.

George, Wyn Jones, Beirne, Falatau, Adams, Liam, at least have to start with Henshaw moving to 13 and Farrell/Aki at 12. LCD, Sinkler, MV to bench along with Lawes, Beard. Murray, Smith, Daly.

Only AWJ, Currie, Itoje and Furlong can hold their heads up today. Biggar, Murray, Conan, Lawes were ordinary. The rest were imposters.


Edited by gaffer - 31 July 2021 at 7:25pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mogwen Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 July 2021 at 7:31pm
Nothing less than what Gatland and co deserved. They picked poorly and got punished. Hogg,watson, vdm were poor( and thats being generous). The subs made no impact. Overall, the lions were a shsmbles. Completly lost the scrum, ariel battle and contact area. People are going to blame the ref, but you must adapt to how the ref interperets the game. Poor, poor
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote KID A Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 July 2021 at 7:31pm
Originally posted by KID A KID A wrote:

I really don't see what Hogg does to merit a place. He was abysmal in the 1st test and nearly cost the game. He's an O'Gara situation #2 in the making. Panics in his own half and makes howlers. I'd have Watson 15.

And Harris at 13 just shows the lack of quality centres in the game.


Anybody still sticking with Hogg at 15?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote greypower1 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 July 2021 at 8:04pm
Smashed up front.  Gave away far too many penalties and couldn't complete any phases.  You could have the NZ backs behind the lions pack and it would not make any difference to the result.
Back three couldn't catch the high balls and our overall discipline was terrible.  Got what we deserved.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Wil Chips Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 July 2021 at 8:24pm
There’s no coming back from the pack being splintered like they were in the 2nd half.

To be competitive for an hour we need Wyn, Beirne and Faletau in the pack. Biggar and Farrell at 10/12, Adams and Sanjay.

Even then the Bok bench is just too good.

Edited by Wil Chips - 31 July 2021 at 8:25pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote gaffer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 July 2021 at 8:40pm
Originally posted by Wil Chips Wil Chips wrote:

There’s no coming back from the pack being splintered like they were in the 2nd half.

To be competitive for an hour we need Wyn, Beirne and Faletau in the pack. Biggar and Farrell at 10/12, Adams and Sanjay.

Even then the Bok bench is just too good.



...and no Scots near the 23 except, perhaps, Price.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote roy munster Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 July 2021 at 11:05pm
Originally posted by aber-fan aber-fan wrote:

SA 27 Lions 9

Well, the Boks completely ruled that second half, winning nearly all the aerial battles and most of the breakdowns... if it was possible, I'd drop all of the back 3 on that performance! Surely, Liam and Adams must start next week, though in whose place I really don't know. Will they risk giving LRZ a run, too? He surely can't do any worse than the boys out there today.

I won't say that the selection of Murray on place of Price was major factor, since there were so many breaks in play in the first half - but it didn't help. Biggar did what they asked of him, but maybe Russell is worth a shot. I'd bring Navidi into the back row, and maybe a big boy onto the bench in place of Beirne or Faletau - Beard or Hill... Lions were overpowered second half.

TBH, after that SA will be strong favourites in the last test, but who knows? It's all to play for, now.

Edit: Wyn Jones to come in, too - if fit.

5 english forwards? why why why bottom of the 6 nations hammered twice lost at home to the scots?

cawdor is by far the best scrum half of the lot, no idea why hes off the radar
Whilst I accknowledge the lions have no class centres and struggling at half backs I still think gats has made a horlicks of selection......his back 3 is a shambles his back row a shambles and his loose head cant scrummage

worst selections were of course dropping beirne and adams....after that faletau for conan? 
curry and watson are NOT better than navidi theyre just more hyped...murray is a busted flush, cawdor should start next week...back 3 change the lot...centres well its a shambles, there is no class, maybe aki ? farell no chance hes had a shcoking season....


Edited by roy munster - 31 July 2021 at 11:10pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Legendinmybathroom Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 July 2021 at 11:22pm
Gary will definitely earn his money if manages to turn this around next week.  Completely smashed in the second half, lacking any game management when chasing the game, still playing the kick chase game (without the latter) when they were 14 points down summed them up really.
They caught the SAs cold last weekend due to their lack of preparation (no competitive game since World Cup final), but South Africa managed to play for 80 minutes today and looked more assured and cohesive this afternoon.
Gatland’s selections (inc Murray and Biggar at halfbacks) meant that we were only likely to go through 1 or 2 phrases of play before choosing the aerial game, but then you have to win those aerial challenges.  South Africa were better in those aerial battles and the lions had no game plan B when needed.
Gatland will need to make some changes for the final test, but will he change his game plan, which failed to work today, I’m not too sure, we all know with Wales, he can be extremely stubborn when it comes to selections and his game plans
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote dyniol53 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 July 2021 at 11:31pm
Just watched it - iesu grist! Completely dominated. 

Kid A proven correct on Hogg. Also think the Van Der Merwe sceptics probably proven right. 

Good news for Williams and Adams who ive never seen dominated like that under the high ball. 

Generally AWJ and Itoje fantastic, but neither of them were able to disrupt that SA maul (Adam Beard?!) 

Thought Curry was good too. 

Congratulations to Rassie Erasmus who’s bizarre interventions earned his team a few favourable calls today. Kolbe’s is a red all day, Faf de Klerk shoulder charged Murray to the head and that Am try wasn’t under control. But I can accept that SA got a raw deal last week so maybe this evens it out.

Other than the back three I’m not sure where the lions turn!!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote roy munster Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 August 2021 at 12:21am
Originally posted by dyniol53 dyniol53 wrote:

Just watched it - iesu grist! Completely dominated. 

Kid A proven correct on Hogg. Also think the Van Der Merwe sceptics probably proven right. 

Good news for Williams and Adams who ive never seen dominated like that under the high ball. 

Generally AWJ and Itoje fantastic, but neither of them were able to disrupt that SA maul (Adam Beard?!) 

Thought Curry was good too. 

Congratulations to Rassie Erasmus who’s bizarre interventions earned his team a few favourable calls today. Kolbe’s is a red all day, Faf de Klerk shoulder charged Murray to the head and that Am try wasn’t under control. But I can accept that SA got a raw deal last week so maybe this evens it out.

Other than the back three I’m not sure where the lions turn!!

finn russell?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote aber-fan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 August 2021 at 6:17am
Originally posted by dyniol53 dyniol53 wrote:

Just watched it - iesu grist! Completely dominated. 

Kid A proven correct on Hogg. Also think the Van Der Merwe sceptics probably proven right. 

Good news for Williams and Adams who ive never seen dominated like that under the high ball. 

Generally AWJ and Itoje fantastic, but neither of them were able to disrupt that SA maul (Adam Beard?!) 

Thought Curry was good too. 

Congratulations to Rassie Erasmus who’s bizarre interventions earned his team a few favourable calls today. Kolbe’s is a red all day, Faf de Klerk shoulder charged Murray to the head and that Am try wasn’t under control. But I can accept that SA got a raw deal last week so maybe this evens it out.

Other than the back three I’m not sure where the lions turn!!

 I am certainly not going to claim that the Lions deserved anything from that game, but your points in bold are correct... the ref team were intimidated by Erasmus, and went soft on SA. Kolbe's tackle on Murray is a red all day, but even if he gets away with that, he should have had another yellow for going in high and head-butting (accidentally, but that doesn't matter) a Lion - so two yellows make a red.
Your other points are valid, too.
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