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Gate12 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Gate12 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 May 2022 at 11:46am
I suppose the positive is this season has been better for the heart in the closing minutes as we haven't really done close games. We've either won or lost comfortably which is probably a sign of a team still finding it's feet and overplaying quite a bit.

There's likely a correlation somewhere between ball in play and injuries, if we're making/receiving more tackles and running more yards there'll be more injuries, we've got a better than average lineout and scrum so maybe we need to put the ball out of play a bit more.

Our attacking play has taken a big leap forward this season though and we've got a more distinct style of play under Dwayne, I'm pretty confident he's the right guy to take us forward and although there's plenty to fix at least we've had some entertainment this season, some of the rugby we were playing prior to Peel arriving was proper grim.

As mentioned above we're also seeing a lot more of our young talent, in previous seasons we've selected a lot of perceived low error count players who don't offer a great deal going forward, personally I'd rather boom or bust than mediocrity (or just below it).
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Dai Guevara View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Dai Guevara Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 May 2022 at 12:26pm
Plenty of positives in the young players coming through, and even in some of the slightly older ones beginning to flourish, -Sebastian, Nicholas, Shaun Evans. And next season we can add also Fifita to our many attacking options.
However a couple of former stalwarts have also shown their limitations - Steff Evans and Dan Jones for instance, and as their main weaknesses are a lack of pace and defensive strength, at this stage in their careers, it may be difficult to rectify these short-comings and to reach the level we need to succeed.
Another flaw that we may be able to work on is the ability to vary our game so that we have a defensive mode if/when we go a man down. Conceding 19 points to the Sprays during a 10 minute yellow card was shocking and someone should have quickly brought everyone together and called for a plan B to try to keep the O's as far as possible from our 22. Stopping the opposition from scoring 3 tries in 10 minutes is surely not an outrageous ask. Who said "it's a thinking game"- Carwyn something or other, not Tuipolotu?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Fscarlet Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 May 2022 at 12:39pm
Originally posted by Dai Guevara Dai Guevara wrote:

Plenty of positives in the young players coming through, and even in some of the slightly older ones beginning to flourish, -Sebastian, Nicholas, Shaun Evans. And next season we can add also Fifita to our many attacking options.
However a couple of former stalwarts have also shown their limitations - Steff Evans and Dan Jones for instance, and as their main weaknesses are a lack of pace and defensive strength, at this stage in their careers, it may be difficult to rectify these short-comings and to reach the level we need to succeed.
Another flaw that we may be able to work on is the ability to vary our game so that we have a defensive mode if/when we go a man down. Conceding 19 points to the Sprays during a 10 minute yellow card was shocking and someone should have quickly brought everyone together and called for a plan B to try to keep the O's as far as possible from our 22. Stopping the opposition from scoring 3 tries in 10 minutes is surely not an outrageous ask. Who said "it's a thinking game"- Carwyn something or other, not Tuipolotu?

Think you can add Rob Evans to that list, he seemed to struggle at scrum time on the weekend when he came on.

In terms of defending when we're down to 14 men, it is hard but the logical thing to do is keep the bloody ball! The opposition can't score if they don't have the ball.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote RR1972 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 May 2022 at 12:40pm
Originally posted by Gate12 Gate12 wrote:

I suppose the positive is this season has been better for the heart in the closing minutes as we haven't really done close games. We've either won or lost comfortably which is probably a sign of a team still finding it's feet and overplaying quite a bit.

There's likely a correlation somewhere between ball in play and injuries, if we're making/receiving more tackles and running more yards there'll be more injuries, we've got a better than average lineout and scrum so maybe we need to put the ball out of play a bit more.

Our attacking play has taken a big leap forward this season though and we've got a more distinct style of play under Dwayne, I'm pretty confident he's the right guy to take us forward and although there's plenty to fix at least we've had some entertainment this season, some of the rugby we were playing prior to Peel arriving was proper grim.

As mentioned above we're also seeing a lot more of our young talent, in previous seasons we've selected a lot of perceived low error count players who don't offer a great deal going forward, personally I'd rather boom or bust than mediocrity (or just below it).
thisđź‘Ť, we either win well or get stuffed is that the way of modern rugby ?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote SA14 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 May 2022 at 12:52pm
Originally posted by Wil Chips Wil Chips wrote:

Despite performances that cover the full spectrum of possible descriptions this season, the overwhelming positive aspect has been the unearthing of new young talent, and those players being given significant game time. A great coaching move in my opinion. From that game time these guys are clearly going to make it ( O'Connor, Kemsley, Tuipulotu, Steff Thomas, Jac Price, Costelow, Archie Hughes, Joe Roberts and others).

Equally pleasing is seeing the investment in young 'existing' talent leading to a break through season and them becoming match day 23 regulars ( Conbeer, Daf Hughes, Sebastien, Morgan Jones, Tom Rogers, Shaun Evans and Baldwin for example).

Having said all that I don't think I've ever seen or read so much negativity, acutely inaccurate rhetoric, or in some cases actually latent hostility towards the Scarlets coaching team and certain players as I have this season.
It's most likely me as I can't seem to process how 'supporters' actually seem to revel more in defeat and team/individual poor performances, than opt to support the team they claim to be behind.
I actually don't want to read that stuff any longer, and taking a step back from those sources, that includes this forum.
Looking forward to flying back for the last game.


Doesn’t that come with the territory of being a rugby supporter in Wales? It’s all ups and downs. There’s no in between with some. Gareth Thomas pointed it out in the recent documentary. When Wales play well they can do no wrong, when they play bad it’s the complete opposite. It’s true of not just Wales but the regions. Cardiff supporters are at the end of their tether on social media.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote GPR - Rochester Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 May 2022 at 1:34pm
Originally posted by SA14 SA14 wrote:

Originally posted by Wil Chips Wil Chips wrote:

Despite performances that cover the full spectrum of possible descriptions this season, the overwhelming positive aspect has been the unearthing of new young talent, and those players being given significant game time. A great coaching move in my opinion. From that game time these guys are clearly going to make it ( O'Connor, Kemsley, Tuipulotu, Steff Thomas, Jac Price, Costelow, Archie Hughes, Joe Roberts and others).

Equally pleasing is seeing the investment in young 'existing' talent leading to a break through season and them becoming match day 23 regulars ( Conbeer, Daf Hughes, Sebastien, Morgan Jones, Tom Rogers, Shaun Evans and Baldwin for example).

Having said all that I don't think I've ever seen or read so much negativity, acutely inaccurate rhetoric, or in some cases actually latent hostility towards the Scarlets coaching team and certain players as I have this season.
It's most likely me as I can't seem to process how 'supporters' actually seem to revel more in defeat and team/individual poor performances, than opt to support the team they claim to be behind.
I actually don't want to read that stuff any longer, and taking a step back from those sources, that includes this forum.
Looking forward to flying back for the last game.


Doesn’t that come with the territory of being a rugby supporter in Wales? It’s all ups and downs. There’s no in between with some. Gareth Thomas pointed it out in the recent documentary. When Wales play well they can do no wrong, when they play bad it’s the complete opposite. It’s true of not just Wales but the regions. Cardiff supporters are at the end of their tether on social media.

Don't think its confined to Wales in all honesty. My mate who is a long time Bath supporter is hardly ecstatic. Frankly Cardiff supporters should be at the end of their tether. If being a supporter means blindly praising everything involved regardless of the results then count me out. If it involves opinions on the way the team is developing both good and bad then I'm in. The facts are plain for all to see - most missed tackles in a season, 2nd worst points conceded. When I was full time employed if some of my core statistics were that bad I would have expected questions to be asked. 

I am sure these questions are being asked & worked on - do I feel wrong/guilty for pointing these our - absolutely not; do I consider myself a decent supporter - yes I do. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Gate12 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 May 2022 at 1:37pm
Originally posted by RR1972 RR1972 wrote:

Originally posted by Gate12 Gate12 wrote:

I suppose the positive is this season has been better for the heart in the closing minutes as we haven't really done close games. We've either won or lost comfortably which is probably a sign of a team still finding it's feet and overplaying quite a bit.

There's likely a correlation somewhere between ball in play and injuries, if we're making/receiving more tackles and running more yards there'll be more injuries, we've got a better than average lineout and scrum so maybe we need to put the ball out of play a bit more.

Our attacking play has taken a big leap forward this season though and we've got a more distinct style of play under Dwayne, I'm pretty confident he's the right guy to take us forward and although there's plenty to fix at least we've had some entertainment this season, some of the rugby we were playing prior to Peel arriving was proper grim.

As mentioned above we're also seeing a lot more of our young talent, in previous seasons we've selected a lot of perceived low error count players who don't offer a great deal going forward, personally I'd rather boom or bust than mediocrity (or just below it).
thisđź‘Ť, we either win well or get stuffed is that the way of modern rugby ?

The average winning/losing margin in the league this season is 16 points, our average is around 19 so we're fairly close to that. The average points per game this season is close to 50 whereas in the previous 2 seasons it's been around 30/35.

There's definitely a trend in our league of bigger scores, suspect it's the same in the English prem, just wish we were on the right side of the score more often!


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote scarletnut Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 May 2022 at 2:05pm
Originally posted by GPR - Rochester GPR - Rochester wrote:

Originally posted by SA14 SA14 wrote:

Originally posted by Wil Chips Wil Chips wrote:

Despite performances that cover the full spectrum of possible descriptions this season, the overwhelming positive aspect has been the unearthing of new young talent, and those players being given significant game time. A great coaching move in my opinion. From that game time these guys are clearly going to make it ( O'Connor, Kemsley, Tuipulotu, Steff Thomas, Jac Price, Costelow, Archie Hughes, Joe Roberts and others).

Equally pleasing is seeing the investment in young 'existing' talent leading to a break through season and them becoming match day 23 regulars ( Conbeer, Daf Hughes, Sebastien, Morgan Jones, Tom Rogers, Shaun Evans and Baldwin for example).

Having said all that I don't think I've ever seen or read so much negativity, acutely inaccurate rhetoric, or in some cases actually latent hostility towards the Scarlets coaching team and certain players as I have this season.
It's most likely me as I can't seem to process how 'supporters' actually seem to revel more in defeat and team/individual poor performances, than opt to support the team they claim to be behind.
I actually don't want to read that stuff any longer, and taking a step back from those sources, that includes this forum.
Looking forward to flying back for the last game.


Doesn’t that come with the territory of being a rugby supporter in Wales? It’s all ups and downs. There’s no in between with some. Gareth Thomas pointed it out in the recent documentary. When Wales play well they can do no wrong, when they play bad it’s the complete opposite. It’s true of not just Wales but the regions. Cardiff supporters are at the end of their tether on social media.

Don't think its confined to Wales in all honesty. My mate who is a long time Bath supporter is hardly ecstatic. Frankly Cardiff supporters should be at the end of their tether. If being a supporter means blindly praising everything involved regardless of the results then count me out. If it involves opinions on the way the team is developing both good and bad then I'm in. The facts are plain for all to see - most missed tackles in a season, 2nd worst points conceded. When I was full time employed if some of my core statistics were that bad I would have expected questions to be asked. 

I am sure these questions are being asked & worked on - do I feel wrong/guilty for pointing these our - absolutely not; do I consider myself a decent supporter - yes I do. 
Spot on 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote scarletabroad Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 May 2022 at 2:39pm
Defence coaches are like hens teeth at the moment, the premiership may be exciting but defensively shocking!!
We last year we couldn't score tries on an empty pitch this year we are addressing this.
Defence is an easier fix of all the issues it is about cohesion and patterns, if half the team is injured (it feels that way sometimes) you are not going to get either but over pre-season with the players coming back toward the end of this season hopefully that problem will be sorted.
My happy gene though is glad to se the break through and cementing of places from the new boys, seeing our overseas boys excelling and not dossing around milking a wage, they have been immense.
As for the old guard I'm afraid as good a servant as he's been Leigh for his own safety I think should retire, Steff Evans needs to reinvigorate himself or else he'll drop well down the pecking order as the new guard advance in their confidence. Similar too Rob Evans who I think just needs game time and Gryff John has failed to impress to be honest and should be well down the order. BUT this hopefully will trigger a fight from them both to re-establish themselves all good for the team. I have seen enough from this year to be optimistic for next year will be nice to see if we have any other new signings coming in to add some extra pizzaz.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote GPR - Rochester Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 May 2022 at 2:44pm
All our established front rowers are being asked serious questions which is testamony to the work being done by Franks. Matthias, Shaun Evans, Daf Hughes  O'Connor will be pushing hard for places in the 23 next season for sure. From what I have heard it won't be too long before Harri's younger loose head brother adds to the competition.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Fscarlet Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 May 2022 at 2:57pm
Originally posted by GPR - Rochester GPR - Rochester wrote:

All our established front rowers are being asked serious questions which is testamony to the work being done by Franks. Matthias, Shaun Evans, Daf Hughes  O'Connor will be pushing hard for places in the 23 next season for sure. From what I have heard it won't be too long before Harri's younger loose head brother adds to the competition.

Probably my break through player of the season.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote scarletabroad Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 May 2022 at 3:01pm
Originally posted by GPR - Rochester GPR - Rochester wrote:

All our established front rowers are being asked serious questions which is testamony to the work being done by Franks. Matthias, Shaun Evans, Daf Hughes  O'Connor will be pushing hard for places in the 23 next season for sure. From what I have heard it won't be too long before Harri's younger loose head brother adds to the competition.


Have been watching O'Connor closely he has really took his chances well (as my youngest hopefully will be following his pathway in the academy next season) how wonderful it must be to have someone like Franks to coach you , how old is the younger brother?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote scarletnut Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 May 2022 at 3:40pm
Originally posted by scarletabroad scarletabroad wrote:

Originally posted by GPR - Rochester GPR - Rochester wrote:

All our established front rowers are being asked serious questions which is testamony to the work being done by Franks. Matthias, Shaun Evans, Daf Hughes  O'Connor will be pushing hard for places in the 23 next season for sure. From what I have heard it won't be too long before Harri's younger loose head brother adds to the competition.


Have been watching O'Connor closely he has really took his chances well (as my youngest hopefully will be following his pathway in the academy next season) how wonderful it must be to have someone like Franks to coach you , how old is the younger brother?
By all accounts Franks is an outstanding coach. 
I still wake up late at night and think of what might have been when tim stimpson hit that jammy penalty1
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mr Ian Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 May 2022 at 3:53pm
i dont change my coaching staff with other at the moment...young coachiang talent and we need the same patience with young players...as I said befoe, maybe need an experient DoR role..
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote thommo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 May 2022 at 3:59pm
Originally posted by Mr Ian Mr Ian wrote:

i dont change my coaching staff with other at the moment...young coachiang talent and we need the same patience with young players...as I said befoe, maybe need an experient DoR role..
100%. An experienced overseer.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Dai Guevara Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 May 2022 at 4:43pm
Originally posted by Fscarlet Fscarlet wrote:

Originally posted by Dai Guevara Dai Guevara wrote:

Plenty of positives in the young players coming through, and even in some of the slightly older ones beginning to flourish, -Sebastian, Nicholas, Shaun Evans. And next season we can add also Fifita to our many attacking options.
However a couple of former stalwarts have also shown their limitations -<b style=""> Steff Evans and Dan Jones for instance, and as their main weaknesses are a lack of pace and defensive strength, at this stage in their careers, it may be difficult to rectify these short-comings and to reach the level we need to succeed.
Another flaw that we may be able to work on is the ability to vary our game so that we have a defensive mode if/when we go a man down. Conceding 19 points to the Sprays during a 10 minute yellow card was shocking and someone should have quickly brought everyone together and called for a plan B to try to keep the O's as far as possible from our 22. Stopping the opposition from scoring 3 tries in 10 minutes is surely not an outrageous ask. Who said "it's a thinking game"- Carwyn something or other, not Tuipolotu?


Think you can add Rob Evans to that list, he seemed to struggle at scrum time on the weekend when he came on.

In terms of defending when we're down to 14 men, it is hard but the logical thing to do is keep the bloody ball! The opposition can't score if they don't have the ball.


Yes, Rob Evans would also be in my last chance saloon as since his return from injury he has also managed to give away penalties that a man of his experience should be avoiding without needing to think. As you say defending with 14 men isn't easy but the best sides seem to manage it without conceding 19 points, the not so secret being keep possession. Between the half backs and the forwards we should have the ability to, at least, prevent an avalanche of scores against us and this sort of thing can be practised over the summer, assuming we have 29 fit players available!!
And Wil please don't start withdrawing from the forum - your posts are easily among the most interesting and informative in the whole forum- keep those posts coming.
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