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Welsh team v Argentina.

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Topic: Welsh team v Argentina.
Posted By: GPR - Rochester
Subject: Welsh team v Argentina.
Date Posted: 07 November 2022 at 9:31am
Many are calling for the return of Dan Lydiate at 6 for Wales. There is no doubt he is an excellent defensive option but for me the future i.e. France 2023 & beyond is someone like Tschiunza. Lets get him starting as much rugby as possible. Unlike Dan he gives us a valuable lineout option. He is bigger & quicker around the field so what is against him???? 

Elsewhere we do not have many options but its time, surely, for us to look at our options at 15. For me :-

15. Adams/LRZ 14. Adams/LRZ 13. North 12. Tompkins 11. Rio Dyer 10. Anscombe 9. Tomos
1. Thomas 2. Owens (C) 3. Francis 4. Rowlands 5. Beard 6. Tschiunza 7. Jac Morgan 8. Faletau.

16. Roberts 17. Smith 18. Lewis 19. Carter 20. Tipuric 21. Blacker 22. Costelow 23. Watkin. 



Replies:
Posted By: Tony Clifton
Date Posted: 08 November 2022 at 4:28pm
Reffell and Halfpenny out, Cuthbert and Adams possibly fit.


Posted By: Sosban89
Date Posted: 08 November 2022 at 5:00pm
I think Argentina are probably a better side than us. So I'd be impressed with a close result either way. 


Posted By: jeremy windell
Date Posted: 08 November 2022 at 5:38pm
Other than the evergreen Ken Owens, our front row options look pretty dire at the moment. Thomas Francis doesn't look in good shape at all.

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Go ahead..........Take those banana's


Posted By: RR1972
Date Posted: 08 November 2022 at 8:03pm
That boy from sarries ahead off the egg man lewis for me


Posted By: Why
Date Posted: 08 November 2022 at 8:18pm
We should start by not picking players like Beard who are a liability and offer nothing apart from maul defence. There is a reason Nicki Smith was hardly picked by Gatland as good as he is around park he can’t scrimmage.
It’s time to pick the youngsters give Christ a go in second row put Moriaty on blindside Morgan on open side Tuperic not fit in my opinion and he has a pony tail.
Give the boy Hawkins as go at centre play Tomkins at 13 George on wing with LRZ Adams at 15.
Costellow to start at 10 SH a huge problem for Wales.



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She asks why i still can't answer. I guess its in the blood.


Posted By: dyniol53
Date Posted: 08 November 2022 at 10:16pm
We’ve all had a go at Pivac for tinkering too much. 

This is a proper test match against a possible QF opponent next year.

No changes for me except Tshiunza at 6, Tipuric to 7.

Everyone else keep the same except for injuries.

We need to get closer to picking a settled side, not 5/6 changes each week. 


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https://twitter.com/exile_podcast?lang=en


Posted By: Wil Chips
Date Posted: 09 November 2022 at 5:26am
I think that's right. Minimal change.

My first thought was with Reffel being injured it addresses the 7 shirt challenge with Tips switching there, but it creates the dilemma of what to do at 6 when you haven't picked the likes of Moriarty or Wainwright.
I could see Tips staying at 6 and Morgan coming in at 7...equally Lydiate could come in at 6 of course.

I agree on Beard, he does seem to drift in to a passive state at times, and that's making him a bit of a liability against teams with a solid engine room ( Argentina have one for sure).

I think AWJ will start rather than Tshiunza though...I think the idea with Christ is he can cover 6 and 2nd row from the bench. If Morgan starts I can see Macloed coming in on the bench.

LH gamble on Gareth Thomas (limited game time) didn't really come off, and Nicky Smith didn't add that much (albeit he should have clearly started before Gareth). The curious call around not picking Carre bit back a bit.

I'm guessing Pivac is holding out for Josh Adams to be fit and start 15, and allow Anscombe to go to 10 ( Priestland to the bench).


Posted By: Legendinmybathroom
Date Posted: 09 November 2022 at 11:46am
What’s the odds on Foxy being called up to cover Halfpenny Wink


Posted By: ladram
Date Posted: 09 November 2022 at 11:56am
Originally posted by Legendinmybathroom Legendinmybathroom wrote:

What’s the odds on Foxy being called up to cover Halfpenny Wink
Don't bring me into this LOLLOLLOL


Posted By: Oracle
Date Posted: 09 November 2022 at 12:27pm
[QUOTE=Legendinmybathroom]What’s the odds on Foxy being called up to cover Halfpenny Wink[/QUOTE
Better off with Andy Hill, he maybe 82 but I still think he's faster over the first 30 minsLOL


Posted By: Maple
Date Posted: 09 November 2022 at 1:58pm
Johnny McNicol should be at 15, he's by far the best option.

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Give Blood, Play Rugby


Posted By: RR1972
Date Posted: 09 November 2022 at 2:25pm
Jonny mac should be in squad although like liam and halfpenny he is into his 30s. We really need to find a few youngsters to start becoming regulars in our test team 


Posted By: RR1972
Date Posted: 09 November 2022 at 2:55pm
How do we fix our lack of go forward and ball carrying in the pack? Moriarty would have helped there and lake and brown, can’t see any of the current squad doing much there tbh


Posted By: Sir Duckling Tuft
Date Posted: 09 November 2022 at 5:05pm
Originally posted by Maple Maple wrote:

Johnny McNicol should be at 15, he's by far the best option.

Correct


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sir duckling tuft


Posted By: Sosban89
Date Posted: 09 November 2022 at 5:12pm
Originally posted by RR1972 RR1972 wrote:

How do we fix our lack of go forward and ball carrying in the pack? Moriarty would have helped there and lake and brown, can’t see any of the current squad doing much there tbh

In all honesty I just don't think we have options there. Whether it be up and coming or veterans. Even when people talk about Moriarty I never thought he was a 'great' carrier, just solid.  


Posted By: surfing-mtber
Date Posted: 10 November 2022 at 12:45pm
Wales: Rees-Zammit; Cuthbert, North, Tompkins, Dyer; Anscombe, T Williams; G Thomas, Owens, D Lewis, Beard, Rowlands, Lydiate, Tipuric (capt), Faletau.

Replacements: Elias, R Jones, S Wainwright, Carter, Morgan, Hardy, Priestland, Watkin.

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Joshua24:15


Posted By: Scrletsfan32x
Date Posted: 10 November 2022 at 12:55pm
Cuthbert hasn’t played since the summer and he’s thrown straight into the team. When you thought Pivac couldn’t be any more delusional with his team selections this says it all. The bench is very very weak in the front row. We aren’t winning this match or even coming close to winning.


Posted By: Why
Date Posted: 10 November 2022 at 12:59pm
What a load of rubbish they will put 30 points on us Priestland on bench why not give Sam a go Rhodes Jones on bench are we that desperate for props. 

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She asks why i still can't answer. I guess its in the blood.


Posted By: gaffer
Date Posted: 10 November 2022 at 1:07pm
Originally posted by surfing-mtber surfing-mtber wrote:

Wales: Rees-Zammit; Cuthbert, North, Tompkins, Dyer; Anscombe, T Williams; G Thomas, Owens, D Lewis, Beard, Rowlands, Lydiate, Tipuric (capt), Faletau.

Replacements: Elias, R Jones, S Wainwright, Carter, Morgan, Hardy, Priestland, Watkin.

Would have preferred: Rees-Zammit; Cuthbert, North, Tompkins, Dyer; Anscombe, T Williams; G Thomas, Owens (c), D Lewis, Carter, Rowlands, Tshiunza, Morgan, Faletau.

Replacements: Elias, R Jones, S Wainwright, Beard, McLeod, Blacker, Costellow, Watkin.

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What's going on?


Posted By: Fscarlet
Date Posted: 10 November 2022 at 1:09pm
Im actually speechless.


Posted By: totallybiasedscarlet
Date Posted: 10 November 2022 at 1:39pm
Our scrum will get mullered. I'm at the point where I think we might as well start with a clean slate and try out all the youngsters we've got, because there's not much going on with all these veterans. 

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"If it's on, we back our skills and our confidence ... We've got some great players, play a good brand and we enjoy doing it." Ken Owens


Posted By: Mr Ian
Date Posted: 10 November 2022 at 2:26pm
if pumas ended to celebrate english win, for wales will be a long afternoon saturday...


Posted By: GPR - Rochester
Date Posted: 10 November 2022 at 2:29pm
I can only assume that Tschiunza, Adams & Francis are injured in addition to Halfpenny & Reffell. If not its just another case of Pivac trying to find the plot which he has mysteriously lost. 


Posted By: scarletpimp
Date Posted: 10 November 2022 at 3:18pm
Originally posted by totallybiasedscarlet totallybiasedscarlet wrote:

Our scrum will get mullered. I'm at the point where I think we might as well start with a clean slate and try out all the youngsters we've got, because there's not much going on with all these veterans. 

It underlines what I have been saying on the other thread , we have no strength  in depth in the front 5.
People can have ago at Pivac..but he is stuck either what he's got.
Not sure about youngsters to bring through ATM.?

Short time ago we had Samson(before injury wrecked him),Ken and Rob evans(at their best),wyn jones(not continually injured ,as now ) jake ball, hill, Shingler etc.
We are simply not bringing people through.

Doesn't matter what backs you have, or back row, you HAVE have a front 5, to do the spadework.Aĺl Blacks proved that last sat, by outplaying us, which allowed Smith and Savea go thrive .
It's a worry for Wales 


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I stood yer on tanner bank


Posted By: Scrletsfan32x
Date Posted: 10 November 2022 at 3:36pm
Originally posted by scarletpimp scarletpimp wrote:

Originally posted by totallybiasedscarlet totallybiasedscarlet wrote:

Our scrum will get mullered. I'm at the point where I think we might as well start with a clean slate and try out all the youngsters we've got, because there's not much going on with all these veterans. 


It underlines what I have been saying on the other thread , we have no strength  in depth in the front 5.
People can have ago at Pivac..but he is stuck either what he's got.
Not sure about youngsters to bring through ATM.?

Short time ago we had Samson(before injury wrecked him),Ken and Rob evans(at their best),wyn jones(not continually injured ,as now ) jake ball, hill, Shingler etc.
We are simply not bringing people through.

Doesn't matter what backs you have, or back row, you HAVE have a front 5, to do the spadework.Aĺl Blacks proved that last sat, by outplaying us, which allowed Smith and Savea go thrive .
It's a worry for Wales 
It’s hard to bring youngsters through when the old guard (Some over 35) are still playing and keep getting picked for whatever reason.


Posted By: Sosban89
Date Posted: 10 November 2022 at 5:09pm
Originally posted by Scrletsfan32x Scrletsfan32x wrote:

Originally posted by scarletpimp scarletpimp wrote:

Originally posted by totallybiasedscarlet totallybiasedscarlet wrote:

Our scrum will get mullered. I'm at the point where I think we might as well start with a clean slate and try out all the youngsters we've got, because there's not much going on with all these veterans. 


It underlines what I have been saying on the other thread , we have no strength  in depth in the front 5.
People can have ago at Pivac..but he is stuck either what he's got.
Not sure about youngsters to bring through ATM.?

Short time ago we had Samson(before injury wrecked him),Ken and Rob evans(at their best),wyn jones(not continually injured ,as now ) jake ball, hill, Shingler etc.
We are simply not bringing people through.

Doesn't matter what backs you have, or back row, you HAVE have a front 5, to do the spadework.Aĺl Blacks proved that last sat, by outplaying us, which allowed Smith and Savea go thrive .
It's a worry for Wales 
It’s hard to bring youngsters through when the old guard (Some over 35) are still playing and keep getting picked for whatever reason.

Not really. Look at Lewis, Brown, Smith. All had plenty of regional experience and international gametime. And neon of them are up to it. Carre the same. We just don't have talent. 


Posted By: scarletnut
Date Posted: 10 November 2022 at 5:44pm
Originally posted by Sosban89 Sosban89 wrote:

Originally posted by Scrletsfan32x Scrletsfan32x wrote:

Originally posted by scarletpimp scarletpimp wrote:

Originally posted by totallybiasedscarlet totallybiasedscarlet wrote:

Our scrum will get mullered. I'm at the point where I think we might as well start with a clean slate and try out all the youngsters we've got, because there's not much going on with all these veterans. 


It underlines what I have been saying on the other thread , we have no strength  in depth in the front 5.
People can have ago at Pivac..but he is stuck either what he's got.
Not sure about youngsters to bring through ATM.?

Short time ago we had Samson(before injury wrecked him),Ken and Rob evans(at their best),wyn jones(not continually injured ,as now ) jake ball, hill, Shingler etc.
We are simply not bringing people through.

Doesn't matter what backs you have, or back row, you HAVE have a front 5, to do the spadework.Aĺl Blacks proved that last sat, by outplaying us, which allowed Smith and Savea go thrive .
It's a worry for Wales 
It’s hard to bring youngsters through when the old guard (Some over 35) are still playing and keep getting picked for whatever reason.

Not really. Look at Lewis, Brown, Smith. All had plenty of regional experience and international gametime. And neon of them are up to it. Carre the same. We just don't have talent. 
This is the problem. It’s far too simplistic to blame everything on Pivac. The standard of player coming through is significantly inferior to what it was like a decade ago. Might sound harsh but it’s true. 

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I still wake up late at night and think of what might have been when tim stimpson hit that jammy penalty1


Posted By: Sir Duckling Tuft
Date Posted: 10 November 2022 at 6:18pm
Can one of you brainiacs wizard up a pi-chart of blame
apportioning the blame for the decade of doom weve just entered?

Ill take a stab 55% wru (their insane priorities their failure to invest enough into regional/pro rugby/academies, scraping the A team, failing to scour the world for talent n playing and coaching, putting tests on amazon so millions fewer see the welsh team play) building hotels etc), 

15% pivac bizarre decisions, 5% his support team, 15% the academies....10% unforseen circumstances such as the emergence of football as wales national sport....The demise of rugby generally as entertaining and safety concerns ......Atm I find myself watching more football, cricket, darts, boxing, snooker etc
are playing numbers up or down?





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sir duckling tuft


Posted By: ladram
Date Posted: 10 November 2022 at 9:04pm
Originally posted by Sir Duckling Tuft Sir Duckling Tuft wrote:

Can one of you brainiacs wizard up a pi-chart of blame
apportioning the blame for the decade of doom weve just entered?

Ill take a stab 55% wru (their insane priorities their failure to invest enough into regional/pro rugby/academies, scraping the A team, failing to scour the world for talent n playing and coaching, putting tests on amazon so millions fewer see the welsh team play) building hotels etc), 

15% pivac bizarre decisions, 5% his support team, 15% the academies....10% unforseen circumstances such as the emergence of football as wales national sport....The demise of rugby generally as entertaining and safety concerns ......Atm I find myself watching more football, cricket, darts, boxing, snooker etc
are playing numbers up or down?



F*** me you must be loaded them sports are all on different channels.


Posted By: Gate12
Date Posted: 11 November 2022 at 9:57am
If there's a lack of players coming through across the board then that's largely on the WRU, individual teams can't have any significant influence on things like how much rugby is played in schools and the structure of the pathways, there are things we could do better but the direction needs to be set by the WRU.

I'd agree though that a reasonable amount of blame can sit with Pivac, selections are absolutely all over the place and our reaction to lacking dynamic power last week is to bring in a 34 year old 6 who's never had a carrying game and a 32 year old wing that hasn't played in months.

He then points at AWJ's non 23 selection as looking at options yet keeps Priestland on the bench over Costelow, his rationale has no consistency and seems like he's just making throw away comments.

His dig at the regions of the fitness and form of the players was laughable too; the more time they're with Wales the better they get, well that showed up well against in the last game of the 6 nations against Italy didn't it.


Posted By: RR1972
Date Posted: 11 November 2022 at 10:15am
Originally posted by ladram ladram wrote:

Originally posted by Sir Duckling Tuft Sir Duckling Tuft wrote:

Can one of you brainiacs wizard up a pi-chart of blame
apportioning the blame for the decade of doom weve just entered?

Ill take a stab 55% wru (their insane priorities their failure to invest enough into regional/pro rugby/academies, scraping the A team, failing to scour the world for talent n playing and coaching, putting tests on amazon so millions fewer see the welsh team play) building hotels etc), 

15% pivac bizarre decisions, 5% his support team, 15% the academies....10% unforseen circumstances such as the emergence of football as wales national sport....The demise of rugby generally as entertaining and safety concerns ......Atm I find myself watching more football, cricket, darts, boxing, snooker etc
are playing numbers up or down?



F*** me you must be loaded them sports are all on different channels.
ahem fire stick


Posted By: RR1972
Date Posted: 11 November 2022 at 10:16am
Originally posted by Gate12 Gate12 wrote:

If there's a lack of players coming through across the board then that's largely on the WRU, individual teams can't have any significant influence on things like how much rugby is played in schools and the structure of the pathways, there are things we could do better but the direction needs to be set by the WRU.

I'd agree though that a reasonable amount of blame can sit with Pivac, selections are absolutely all over the place and our reaction to lacking dynamic power last week is to bring in a 34 year old 6 who's never had a carrying game and a 32 year old wing that hasn't played in months.

He then points at AWJ's non 23 selection as looking at options yet keeps Priestland on the bench over Costelow, his rationale has no consistency and seems like he's just making throw away comments.

His dig at the regions of the fitness and form of the players was laughable too; the more time they're with Wales the better they get, well that showed up well against in the last game of the 6 nations against Italy didn't it.
agree with all of the above post


Posted By: GPR - Rochester
Date Posted: 11 November 2022 at 10:47am
Originally posted by RR1972 RR1972 wrote:

Originally posted by Gate12 Gate12 wrote:

If there's a lack of players coming through across the board then that's largely on the WRU, individual teams can't have any significant influence on things like how much rugby is played in schools and the structure of the pathways, there are things we could do better but the direction needs to be set by the WRU.

I'd agree though that a reasonable amount of blame can sit with Pivac, selections are absolutely all over the place and our reaction to lacking dynamic power last week is to bring in a 34 year old 6 who's never had a carrying game and a 32 year old wing that hasn't played in months.

He then points at AWJ's non 23 selection as looking at options yet keeps Priestland on the bench over Costelow, his rationale has no consistency and seems like he's just making throw away comments.

His dig at the regions of the fitness and form of the players was laughable too; the more time they're with Wales the better they get, well that showed up well against in the last game of the 6 nations against Italy didn't it.
agree with all of the above post

I 2nd that RR. Pivac is and always has makes it up on the hoof. What about suggesting that the players who have played International rugby should, by now, realise the fitness levels that they need to be at before getting into camp. Wonder how Cuthbert's fitness levels are at the moment. 


Posted By: Gate12
Date Posted: 11 November 2022 at 10:58am
Also they get all the data from the regions on a regular basis and know what the step up is like from club to international, there's no surprises here so they need to find a solution rather than have digs, plus Ireland didn't look rusty, despite the amount of rest time their internationals get.



Posted By: Lincscarlet
Date Posted: 11 November 2022 at 2:25pm
Originally posted by Gate12 Gate12 wrote:

If there's a lack of players coming through across the board then that's largely on the WRU, individual teams can't have any significant influence on things like how much rugby is played in schools and the structure of the pathways, there are things we could do better but the direction needs to be set by the WRU.

I'd agree though that a reasonable amount of blame can sit with Pivac, selections are absolutely all over the place and our reaction to lacking dynamic power last week is to bring in a 34 year old 6 who's never had a carrying game and a 32 year old wing that hasn't played in months.

He then points at AWJ's non 23 selection as looking at options yet keeps Priestland on the bench over Costelow, his rationale has no consistency and seems like he's just making throw away comments.

His dig at the regions of the fitness and form of the players was laughable too; the more time they're with Wales the better they get, well that showed up well against in the last game of the 6 nations against Italy didn't it.

Pivac has always loved a good scapegoat, if the players need to be fit and ready for international games why is he picking players for the squad who haven't even played this season?


Posted By: Sir Duckling Tuft
Date Posted: 11 November 2022 at 3:01pm
Originally posted by RR1972 RR1972 wrote:

Originally posted by ladram ladram wrote:

Originally posted by Sir Duckling Tuft Sir Duckling Tuft wrote:

Can one of you brainiacs wizard up a pi-chart of blame
apportioning the blame for the decade of doom weve just entered?

Ill take a stab 55% wru (their insane priorities their failure to invest enough into regional/pro rugby/academies, scraping the A team, failing to scour the world for talent n playing and coaching, putting tests on amazon so millions fewer see the welsh team play) building hotels etc), 

15% pivac bizarre decisions, 5% his support team, 15% the academies....10% unforseen circumstances such as the emergence of football as wales national sport....The demise of rugby generally as entertaining and safety concerns ......Atm I find myself watching more football, cricket, darts, boxing, snooker etc
are playing numbers up or down?



F*** me you must be loaded them sports are all on different channels.
ahem fire stick

cheers Ill just ask my fellow knights of the realm how to claim it all back in expenses Wink


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sir duckling tuft


Posted By: Sir Duckling Tuft
Date Posted: 11 November 2022 at 3:02pm
lrz at full back ? Your thoughts?

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sir duckling tuft


Posted By: hoppy
Date Posted: 11 November 2022 at 6:32pm
Montoya Argentina captain out injured 

Louis Rees Zammit might be out tomorrow as he missed training today 


Posted By: Lincscarlet
Date Posted: 12 November 2022 at 5:45pm
7 penalties conceded in 12 minutes???? What are they coaching in the wales camp? 


Posted By: greypower1
Date Posted: 12 November 2022 at 6:21pm
High humidity caused by a closed roof is spoiling the game for both sides.
Commercial considerations put ahead of rugby.


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Keep the faith


Posted By: Eastern outpost
Date Posted: 12 November 2022 at 6:50pm
Originally posted by greypower1 greypower1 wrote:

High humidity caused by a closed roof is spoiling the game for both sides.
Commercial considerations put ahead of rugby.
Commercial considerations like a win?

Agree re your roof closed consequence though.


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In a world where you can be anything – Be Kind.


Posted By: surfing-mtber
Date Posted: 12 November 2022 at 7:29pm
Welcome win. Good forward effort,  Ken Owens full on from 1 minute to 80 minutes. Not sure why Tompkins was taken off, Falatau immense, we're going to miss Rowlands. Jack Morgan good going forwards and in defence. Very few turnovers at the breakdown for either side, good counter rucking by Wales.  North and Tomos had good games, LRZ played well at FB.

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Joshua24:15


Posted By: Mogwen
Date Posted: 12 November 2022 at 7:38pm
Was that the poorest advert for international rugby?

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The only true wisdom is in knowing you know nothing.


Posted By: Eastern outpost
Date Posted: 12 November 2022 at 7:43pm
Originally posted by Mogwen Mogwen wrote:

Was that the poorest advert for international rugby?
No.

We won.


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In a world where you can be anything – Be Kind.


Posted By: Oracle
Date Posted: 12 November 2022 at 8:00pm
I'm starting to think thatcostello is our best 10 for Wales



Posted By: Mogwen
Date Posted: 12 November 2022 at 8:05pm
Originally posted by Eastern outpost Eastern outpost wrote:

Originally posted by Mogwen Mogwen wrote:

Was that the poorest advert for international rugby?
No.

We won.


Doesnt matter who won. We were poor, they were worse. If you want to inspire the next generation, dont watch the replay

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The only true wisdom is in knowing you know nothing.


Posted By: Dai Guevara
Date Posted: 12 November 2022 at 8:10pm
I saw much more of Jac Morgan than Lydiate. He's not particularly big or fast but he really does make an impact and perhaps Wales should keep on playing him at 6. Excellent idea picking L R-Z at 15, Josh Adams back for Cuthbert and we will be flying back any clearances.


Posted By: Oracle
Date Posted: 12 November 2022 at 8:10pm
That comment makes no sense at all


Posted By: Eastern outpost
Date Posted: 12 November 2022 at 8:11pm
Originally posted by Mogwen Mogwen wrote:

Originally posted by Eastern outpost Eastern outpost wrote:

Originally posted by Mogwen Mogwen wrote:

Was that the poorest advert for international rugby?
No.

We won.


Doesnt matter who won. We were poor, they were worse. If you want to inspire the next generation, dont watch the replay
Agree but we need the £££££££

Won’t be re-watching


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In a world where you can be anything – Be Kind.


Posted By: Mogwen
Date Posted: 12 November 2022 at 8:30pm
Originally posted by Oracle Oracle wrote:

That comment makes no sense at all


Do u mean mine?? If so, my thinking was, the game was so poor nobody deserved to win. The Welsh team is meant to inspure the nation. That game did not. Both sides wete poor, and just because Walez won means nothing. The performance didnt improve, the playets didnt improve and the Argies made us look good. On another day Argentina would have put us to the sword. LZR went well, ken as always, Lewis was better than i tjought. The rest wete poor. Beard, tipuric, williams, anscombe shocking

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The only true wisdom is in knowing you know nothing.


Posted By: Why
Date Posted: 12 November 2022 at 8:36pm
Originally posted by Mogwen Mogwen wrote:

Originally posted by Oracle Oracle wrote:

That comment makes no sense at all


Do u mean mine?? If so, my thinking was, the game was so poor nobody deserved to win. The Welsh team is meant to inspure the nation. That game did not. Both sides wete poor, and just because Walez won means nothing. The performance didnt improve, the playets didnt improve and the Argies made us look good. On another day Argentina would have put us to the sword. LZR went well, ken as always, Lewis was better than i tjought. The rest wete poor. Beard, tipuric, williams, anscombe shocking
Williams had best game for Wales Tuperic was very good. It wasn’t the best game I’ve seen but the defensive effort bearing in mind Argentina have beaten NZ, Australia and England away was superb. A lot better with people like Dillon Lewis and Thomas starting to look like international props. 
Ageee Anscombe and Beard however. 


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She asks why i still can't answer. I guess its in the blood.


Posted By: Mogwen
Date Posted: 12 November 2022 at 8:53pm
If you watch Tipuric, yes he puts in a lot of tackles, but none are dominant. Count how many he puts in on his own.... very few. Hes a good link player, but i prefer my no7 to be at the breakdown challenging for turnovers rather than pretending to be a third centre. Theres no doubting his talent, workrate etc, but i prefer an out and out 7 that challenges at the breakdown like reffel, morgan and mcloed.

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The only true wisdom is in knowing you know nothing.


Posted By: greypower1
Date Posted: 12 November 2022 at 9:01pm
In fairness to Tipuric he was also our main line-out option, Ken found his blue skullcap great aid to his accuracy. Wink

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Keep the faith


Posted By: Scrletsfan32x
Date Posted: 12 November 2022 at 9:47pm
Originally posted by Mogwen Mogwen wrote:

Originally posted by Oracle Oracle wrote:

That comment makes no sense at all


Do u mean mine?? If so, my thinking was, the game was so poor nobody deserved to win. The Welsh team is meant to inspure the nation. That game did not. Both sides wete poor, and just because Walez won means nothing. The performance didnt improve, the playets didnt improve and the Argies made us look good. On another day Argentina would have put us to the sword. LZR went well, ken as always, Lewis was better than i tjought. The rest wete poor. Beard, tipuric, williams, anscombe shocking
Were you watching the correct game? Williams probably had his best game for Wales today! Tipuric was really good and Beard was solid. Jac Morgan was immense when he came on for Lydiate. I really enjoyed the game today (In the stadium)


Posted By: Mogwen
Date Posted: 12 November 2022 at 10:00pm
Agree to disagree.

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The only true wisdom is in knowing you know nothing.


Posted By: Mugwuffin
Date Posted: 12 November 2022 at 10:29pm
I thought that was a pretty good performance. Argentina are no mugs and have beaten the All Blacks in New Zealand and England in Twickenham recently. Wales stepped up a lot from last week and deserved to win. The defence was a more aggressive and whilst the attack wasn’t outstanding, there were plenty of interesting passages. The lineout was the main downer for me. One good catch and drive that resulted in a try, but we lost our own ball too many times. 


Posted By: scarletnut
Date Posted: 12 November 2022 at 10:38pm
Originally posted by Mogwen Mogwen wrote:

Originally posted by Eastern outpost Eastern outpost wrote:

Originally posted by Mogwen Mogwen wrote:

Was that the poorest advert for international rugby?
No.

We won.


Doesnt matter who won. We were poor, they were worse. If you want to inspire the next generation, dont watch the replay
Wales weren’t great but they certainly weren’t poor. Forwards were very good. 

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I still wake up late at night and think of what might have been when tim stimpson hit that jammy penalty1


Posted By: PritchyTheScarlet
Date Posted: 12 November 2022 at 10:52pm
Wales grew in confidence as the game wore on. We controlled the game with our defence. Of course we want to see more in attack, but at least we've recognised that rock fight rugby is our most effective path to victory.


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“Gareth Edwards just ran 30 yards and got a Knighthood, I sidestepped five players and got arthritis in both knees.” - Benny


Posted By: scarletnut
Date Posted: 13 November 2022 at 12:25am
Originally posted by Mogwen Mogwen wrote:

Originally posted by Oracle Oracle wrote:

That comment makes no sense at all


Do u mean mine?? If so, my thinking was, the game was so poor nobody deserved to win. The Welsh team is meant to inspure the nation. That game did not. Both sides wete poor, and just because Walez won means nothing. The performance didnt improve, the playets didnt improve and the Argies made us look good. On another day Argentina would have put us to the sword. LZR went well, ken as always, Lewis was better than i tjought. The rest wete poor. Beard, tipuric, williams, anscombe shocking
How on earth you have come to the conclusion that Tomos Williams was shocking is beyond me. He’s no world beater but he played very well today 

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I still wake up late at night and think of what might have been when tim stimpson hit that jammy penalty1


Posted By: Mr Ian
Date Posted: 13 November 2022 at 6:50am
good win, this one is really important for team morale...


Posted By: GPR - Rochester
Date Posted: 13 November 2022 at 8:02am
I have never been a great fan of Tomos Williams or Dillon Lewis but fair play they both played well. Tomos has certainly stepped up his game this series so far. Game was poor entertainment - Argentina were their own worst enemies butchering wonderful field positions in the 3rd quarter which they dominated. We were hanging on at times and a horrific attempt at a clearance by their 15 gifted us the win. 

LRZ should be inked in to start at 15 for the next two games. His pace and eye for the gap frightens teams and Argentina even doubled up defensively which left space elsewhere which we failed to exploit because I am afraid Anscombe is not the player he was before his injury, Priestland's legs have gone & Tompkins couldn't pick a pass at 12. Someone asked why he was hauled off on 52 minutes - well they had seen enough missed tackles and passes to everywhere except in front of his support player. 

Another forum member has made what I think is an astute observation - Costelow is the best 10 in this squad & I would suggest starting Blacker, Costelow, Hawkins & North to start against Georgia because we are still no nearer getting the ball wide into the hands of a very dangerous set of back three runners. 

Worryingly for the WRU lots of empty seats coming on top of no full house against NZ. None of the games this Autumn are being reported as sell outs. Tough economic times for sure. 


Posted By: Mogwen
Date Posted: 13 November 2022 at 8:05am
Originally posted by scarletnut scarletnut wrote:

Originally posted by Mogwen Mogwen wrote:

Originally posted by Oracle Oracle wrote:

That comment makes no sense at all


Do u mean mine?? If so, my thinking was, the game was so poor nobody deserved to win. The Welsh team is meant to inspure the nation. That game did not. Both sides wete poor, and just because Walez won means nothing. The performance didnt improve, the playets didnt improve and the Argies made us look good. On another day Argentina would have put us to the sword. LZR went well, ken as always, Lewis was better than i tjought. The rest wete poor. Beard, tipuric, williams, anscombe shocking
How on earth you have come to the conclusion that Tomos Williams was shocking is beyond me. He’s no world beater but he played very well today 


If we are happy to consider him good enough, then we have problems. It just shows how low of standards we have. He was better than last week. Apart from his charge down, his kicks were just as good as cawdors, his passing was slow and at times he wasnt even at the base of rucks. Youre right, hes no world beater. Hes not good enough. Our problem is, we dont have anyone else

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The only true wisdom is in knowing you know nothing.


Posted By: N14
Date Posted: 13 November 2022 at 8:19am
I was encouraged by the performance. Sorry Mogwen I think your assessment is totally off it. Agree Tomos was brilliant (and I’m not usually a fan of his). For Ken to put in such a good shift for 80mins at international level is incredible at 35 years old. Gutted for him that he couldn’t clinch his try. Lineout is an ongoing problem though which needs addressing, not good enough for this standard of rugby. Please let’s see Costellow start next week!


Posted By: N14
Date Posted: 13 November 2022 at 8:21am
Also LRZ at fullback went far better than expected. We certainly shouldn’t get carried away and declare it as his new permanent position, but I do agree he should play there the next couple of games and see how he goes. He can be very dangerous with the time and space he gets with the ball in hand at full back.


Posted By: SA14
Date Posted: 13 November 2022 at 12:31pm
Originally posted by Lincscarlet Lincscarlet wrote:

7 penalties conceded in 12 minutes???? What are they coaching in the wales camp? 

The Scarlets way?


Posted By: Oracle
Date Posted: 13 November 2022 at 12:34pm
I like penalties as it gives me time to go to the toiletBig smile


Posted By: Fscarlet
Date Posted: 14 November 2022 at 8:17am
I don't think the coaches can be blamed for the penalties, a lot of it is over eagerness to get off the line. Make no mistake, Argentina are a tough team to play against & that was a big victory for us, we got better as the game went on. LRZ, Ken, Tomos & Tompkins impressed the most for me.

I feel sorry for Tompkins as he, for me, is currently one of the first names on the teamsheet & he keeps getting taken off early when playing well. The best move would have been to take Cuthbert off & move North to wing.




Posted By: GPR - Rochester
Date Posted: 14 November 2022 at 8:31am
Originally posted by Fscarlet Fscarlet wrote:

I don't think the coaches can be blamed for the penalties, a lot of it is over eagerness to get off the line. Make no mistake, Argentina are a tough team to play against & that was a big victory for us, we got better as the game went on. LRZ, Ken, Tomos & Tompkins impressed the most for me.

I feel sorry for Tompkins as he, for me, is currently one of the first names on the teamsheet & he keeps getting taken off early when playing well. The best move would have been to take Cuthbert off & move North to wing.



I cannot share your sympathy for Tompkins - I find myself for once agreeing with Pivac. He is all action I admit but I fail to see any end product. He isn't big enough to take the ball up so you expect a clever kicker/distributor which he is neither. His passing is woeful for an international 12 & he isn't the best defensively. For me he wouldn't be in the squad let alone the team. 


Posted By: Gate12
Date Posted: 14 November 2022 at 8:51am
9, 10, 12, 13 remains a problem for Wales, we haven't really got anyone in any of those positions that offers control and attacking prowess and haven't for a while. Out of all the older players the 1 I'd probably have brought back would have been Webb if it's a case of not looking further than the WC.


Posted By: RR1972
Date Posted: 14 November 2022 at 9:07am
I thought priestland played well when he came on in fairness


Posted By: Gate12
Date Posted: 14 November 2022 at 9:41am
Yeah he was good, the game suited him when he came on.

If we're not looking further that the WC and going to try and bludgeon our way through a la Gats then we could do a lot worse than having Webb, Priestland, JBW and North as our 9, 10, 12, 13 combo.


Posted By: GPR - Rochester
Date Posted: 14 November 2022 at 9:51am
Originally posted by Gate12 Gate12 wrote:

Yeah he was good, the game suited him when he came on.

If we're not looking further that the WC and going to try and bludgeon our way through a la Gats then we could do a lot worse than having Webb, Priestland, JBW and North as our 9, 10, 12, 13 combo.

Webb is playing as well/better than Cawdor & Hardy thats for sure but surely the idea must be to play with tempo so, for me, Tomos and we should give Blacker a start this weekend. Priestland was assured & can close out a game with good tactical kicking but as above we must surely be looking to play with tempo.

We are not going to succeed in 6 nations or World Cup by trying to bully teams. Ireland, France & England will more than match us up front; we don't have a dominant scrum; without Francis we don't trust our bench tight head with more than 10 minutes; our lineout is iffy & we are short of carriers. Pivac's selections have been scatter gun with no sign of a co-ordinated playing style. 


Posted By: Fscarlet
Date Posted: 14 November 2022 at 9:56am
I want us to go strong this weekend, rather than make the usual wholesale changes, & actually look to put a big score on Georgia. 




Posted By: Gate12
Date Posted: 14 November 2022 at 10:21am
Originally posted by GPR - Rochester GPR - Rochester wrote:

Originally posted by Gate12 Gate12 wrote:

Yeah he was good, the game suited him when he came on.

If we're not looking further that the WC and going to try and bludgeon our way through a la Gats then we could do a lot worse than having Webb, Priestland, JBW and North as our 9, 10, 12, 13 combo.

Webb is playing as well/better than Cawdor & Hardy thats for sure but surely the idea must be to play with tempo so, for me, Tomos and we should give Blacker a start this weekend. Priestland was assured & can close out a game with good tactical kicking but as above we must surely be looking to play with tempo.

We are not going to succeed in 6 nations or World Cup by trying to bully teams. Ireland, France & England will more than match us up front; we don't have a dominant scrum; without Francis we don't trust our bench tight head with more than 10 minutes; our lineout is iffy & we are short of carriers. Pivac's selections have been scatter gun with no sign of a co-ordinated playing style. 

I'd agree with all that but we don't appear to be looking to play a high tempo game so might as well select a team that can defend, kick well and have some gain line who can do a job against Fiji and potentially Oz. We've then probably got England who we could potentially frustrate and see where we go from there.

We're nearly there now in terms of the WC so can't see a big shift in selection or style.


Posted By: Lincscarlet
Date Posted: 14 November 2022 at 12:21pm
my summary:

When we cut out the lazy penalties, we took control for 50 minutes.  If we can give away 6 or less a game going forwards we will always have a chance. 

What Priestland offers is a calm head and a big boot, I quite like the idea of him on the bench to close out games.  Anscombe...never been a fan, I don't think he's up to it but the coaches do.  You used to be able to count and every 3rd pass he received he would kick it away - regardless of other options.  Would love to see Sam get a start at 10, I imagine his line kicking is holding him back at the moment. 

Tomos Williams had a good game, he's inconsistent but which welsh 9 isn't out of the current crop?  His defence was really good and I would imagine that's one of the things the coaches like about him. 

Tipuric didn't really offer much aside from a few tackles, thoroughly shown up by Jac Morgan.  When Elias came on at 6 I had flashbacks of Ken playing 8 for us the other year lol.   It's a shame we can't play them both at the same time because we sorely need ball carriers in the pack.  Would be very interested to see Josh and Jac with Faletau as the back row for the next 2 games.

It's a bit worrying that Pivac has had 3.5 years to get an A team and a B team in place with a unified game plan and playing style, yet we seem to have none of that.  Still, it's not going to change so I'll just be crossing my fingers until the world cup.  With Italy looking better with every game, scotland consistently inconsistent, ireland and france demolishing everyone and england full of big game players the 6N should be pretty tasty next year is all I can say.


Posted By: hoppy
Date Posted: 14 November 2022 at 6:16pm
app

Wales have suffered a double blow before the Tests against Georgia and Australia, with flanker Dan Lydiate and lock Will Rowlands ruled out by injury.

Ospreys' Lydiate damaged an arm and Dragons' Rowlands hurt a shoulder in last weekend's win against Argentina.

Wales coach Wayne Pivac has called up two uncapped locks, Exeter's Dafydd Jenkins, 19, and Ospreys' Rhys Davies, 24, into their squad.

But Pivac has not brought in a direct back-row replacement for Lydiate.

Wales face Georgia in Cardiff on Saturday, having bounced back from defeat by New Zealand to beat the Pumas.



Posted By: RR1972
Date Posted: 14 November 2022 at 6:30pm
We lose a lock and 6 call up two locks. Why aren’t moriarty or waiwright called up for lydiate?


Posted By: RR1972
Date Posted: 14 November 2022 at 6:32pm
Originally posted by Fscarlet Fscarlet wrote:

I want us to go strong this weekend, rather than make the usual wholesale changes, & actually look to put a big score on Georgia. 


adams back for wknd get him on. I take it lrz misses the oz gane as out of test window?  I’d give him another go at 15, him adams and dyer be a rapid back 3 morgan and josh to start in back riw  be nice to see some one else get a start at 8


Posted By: Scrletsfan32x
Date Posted: 14 November 2022 at 6:48pm
I’d start one of the young locks with Carter and the other on the bench this weekend. Let’s blood them early against Georgia and keep Beard and AWJ for Australia.


Posted By: ladram
Date Posted: 14 November 2022 at 9:08pm
Jenkins captained Exeter the weekend 


Posted By: scarletpimp
Date Posted: 15 November 2022 at 12:06am
A very interesting set of assessments.
One thing is for sure, very few people gave Wales hope of beating a side that had beaten NZ a short time ago, AND triumphed at Twickenham, a week before.

Overall, it was a far better, more physical, more committed performance from Wales.
After the NZ, I mentioned in a post, that Wales get better as the Autumn series progresses, and this proved the point. We were awful that game, in terms of not making the All blacks really WORK for their points. Same for the Scots, who looked rusty against Fiji, but could have beaten NZ.
After the level of rugby our teams having been playing for the regions, All Blacks, first up...a disaster!
Would we have beaten them, playing them last, possibly not, but it would be far more competitive.

The issue in rugby, and it hasn't changed over decades, is that you have to win the collisions, or be competitive. When Llanelli played all blacks in 72, same for the lions in 71, and 74 in SA, they would NOT, be physically intimidated or dominated.
Being together longer, in camp at least gives you a chance to increase the intensity, & edge which you need playing top international sides.

The major problem Wales have, however, is the lack of depth in the front 5, and this is worrying, with the world cup on the horizon.
It worth repeating, what I mentioned, in the other post, that when Gatland was there., and just over a year ago, we had Jake Ball and Hill in the second row, both different type of players, but both effective.
Now both are playing abroad sadly. To add to this AWJ was then playing at the top of his game, but now, after injury, looks a shadow of the player he was!
In the front row, we had a fully fit samson Lee (now destroyed by injury), Wyn Jones (now injury prone). Rob Evans (now a shadow of the player, again due to injury).
Very few of the current crop fill you with confidence, although Thomas, did better against ARG.
Two players with suspect scrummaging, but with the physicality are Carre, and Brown, both good ball carriers, we badly need. Carre not included in squad, and Brown, injured.
Both need to be involved in some way in future.

The other issue of course, on which gats built his success, was the aggressive defence, for which he had the best defence coach in the world Shaun Edwards. 
Much better defence v ARG, but in Gethin Jenkins, we have a young coach, learning at the top level (and everyone has to at some stage). He will be a really great coach in future, I am sure.

There are also selection and tactics, which Pivac , rightly or wrongly has been criticised for.
Gatland also got criticised, don't forget, for a limited gameplan.
Pivac has tried to expand the gameplan, and some have described as "scattergun "approach.

Personally, I think he has tried to do the right thing, maybe it's been executed badly.
We are never going to dominate teams up front, so we have to try something different.
This again had led to some bizarre selections, with Pivac trying different combinations.
Let's be honest about it he has very few quality options open to him, so has pursued as many avenues as possible.

Looking ahead there are different permutations in some positions, but in general we can see the bulk of his A side nailed down.
The questions?
Who plays FB, in the continues absence of Liam Williams (who's fitness is totally unreliable)
Who will play OH Biggar/ Anscombe?
Who plays 6 and 7.

I think Wales will beat Georgia and possibly Australia. Not sure about 6N

All the above, is a sideshow, however.
The real Mcoy is what the WRU will do to eradicate the decline of the game in Wales.
At the moment the structure of the WRU is not fit for purpose with small clubs, dictating.
The net result is that we cannot move forward as we should.

There should be a total Independant review of the game in Wales. Root and branch
This has been done with the women's game, and we have seen a few green shoots of success. The success here is to initially develop the game and greater participation in schools, then at U16/U18 & U20. 
The regional academies the league structure. leading up to the premiership and regions should be looked at.
what is happening ATM, clearly is not good enough, which is why we have a relatively small number of qualities international players to pick from.
Whether we have change or whether we stumble on as, we are, remains to be seen.

Finally, just a word about being a coach.
I spent 15 years as a player (played in a few finals), and near the end of my career, ended my time Unsurprisingly in the 2nds, playing with some of my older pupils (from 6th form) How embarrassing, which is when I packed it in Confused.LOL
Nothing however prepares you for being a coach. 
My dad was an excellent at this, a real student of the game, with the South African Dannie Craven his real inspiration.
In contrast I found it quite difficult, despite my time as a player and my dad's template.  
As it happened, we had a family and the extra demands of teaching meant I shelved my coaching until much later when i coached the junior section, which I can honestly say was pure joy, and so rewarding, even though we didn't always win!

Pivac and Peel have had their critics on here, but are doing their best in circumstances which are far from ideal
It's a lonely old job, and undoubtedly both have made mistakes, at some stage!
Who would be a coach Ouch ? 
When it's done well is done well, it's amazing. Just look at the job Smith has done for NZ women and the impact he's made!



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I stood yer on tanner bank


Posted By: Fscarlet
Date Posted: 15 November 2022 at 9:28am
Wales are set to announce their side to face Georgia today with the WOL suggesting that Josh might finally get his first cap. 



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