Scarlet Fever Llanelli Rugby Sport Wales Tickets Homepage
Forum Home Forum Home > RUGBY > SCARLETS GENERAL
  New Posts New Posts RSS Feed - Scarlets v Sale match thread.
  FAQ FAQ  Forum Search   Register Register  Login Login


Scarlets v Sale match thread.

 Post Reply Post Reply Page  <1 212223
Author
Message
Wil Chips View Drop Down
Rambler
Rambler
Avatar

Joined: 23 August 2009
Location: Africa
Status: Offline
Points: 45504
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Wil Chips Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 April 2021 at 11:52am
Absolutely. I give him immense credit to him for realizing that shoveling s**t ball out for the sake of it was totally pointless. Likewise to Costellow who a tried to mix it.

Now that begs the question when we have Cawdor, Jonny, Foxy, Leigh, Sanjay and McNichol in the back line, all pros for more than a decade, why did we not figure out that all Sale were going to do was the blitz defence.

Because our forwards could get no real momentum, our 9/10 kept passing dead ball out to backs who were on the back foot and/or standing still in the face of a rushing defence. I would want to see any of those senior players screaming at Cawdor and Dan to mix it up...grubber, chip, up and under, cross field kicks are all great foils to a rushing defence. I don't recall seeing any of them.
I hold senior guys accountable for not working this out.

The Sale backs had a stroll in the park...



Edited by Wil Chips - 06 April 2021 at 11:53am
Back to Top
Sponsored Links


Back to Top
GPR - Rochester View Drop Down
Veteran
Veteran
Avatar

Joined: 01 December 2014
Location: Rhydcymerau
Status: Offline
Points: 12175
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote GPR - Rochester Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 April 2021 at 12:48pm
Originally posted by Wil Chips Wil Chips wrote:

Absolutely. I give him immense credit to him for realizing that shoveling s**t ball out for the sake of it was totally pointless. Likewise to Costellow who a tried to mix it.

Now that begs the question when we have Cawdor, Jonny, Foxy, Leigh, Sanjay and McNichol in the back line, all pros for more than a decade, why did we not figure out that all Sale were going to do was the blitz defence.

Because our forwards could get no real momentum, our 9/10 kept passing dead ball out to backs who were on the back foot and/or standing still in the face of a rushing defence. I would want to see any of those senior players screaming at Cawdor and Dan to mix it up...grubber, chip, up and under, cross field kicks are all great foils to a rushing defence. I don't recall seeing any of them.
I hold senior guys accountable for not working this out.

The Sale backs had a stroll in the park...


Spot on Wil. Likewise where were Ken, Wyn, Jake, Sione & Aaron in realising that we weren't at the races physically. 
Back to Top
Exkixu View Drop Down
Veteran
Veteran
Avatar

Joined: 18 October 2008
Status: Offline
Points: 3507
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Exkixu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 April 2021 at 1:36pm
Originally posted by scarletnut scarletnut wrote:

Originally posted by Exkixu Exkixu wrote:

Other than POM, did Munster have any other starters injured? 
They still lost.

If Sale is a 2nd/3rd tier European team that had 2 starters missing on international duty, then we are a 2nd/3rd tier European team that had 9 starters (23 squad) on international duty (both in November and during the 6N) on top of the worst injury list in many years.

Sure, the coaching staff doesn't help, but lets not pretend we are currently in a better situation than Sale.

So Rob Evs, Hardy and McLeod, whom you rate better than Jac, on top of Patchell and Samson would not start or be in the 23 squad? Right.

This team at its best, with few injuries and fewer international call ups, would stand a chance in knock out rugby, and that's how we won the Pro'12. A few more injuries/departures and international commitments and the chances decrease, and that's how we lost to Leinster in the HEC semi. As it is now, next to zero. And if you think this will be sorted by changing the coaching staff, well, you clearly weren't paying attention to Pivac's last year or many other seasons before them. 

And I'm off now. Discussing how much respect they showed for the shirt and traditions will lead us nowhere.
 

Your points are valid but it still doesn’t excuse getting stuffed by 50 odd points at home to Sale. The Scarlets had 605 caps in comparison to Sale’s 166 caps. You’d expect them to be a bit rusty but such a heavy defeat suggest deeper problems  [/QUOTE]

A bit rusty is a quite the understatement. Look at the teams the Scarlets have fielded through the season. Between injuries and international camps, how many times have we seen any of those 605 caps? How many times have we seen some of those 605 caps playing together as a unit? You can have 1,000 caps in a BaaBaas game and they will still look out of sorts in a meaningul match against a well structured team (and Sale is much better than that)


Sure, the way we lost was unexcusable and the coaching staff needs to be changed. But if you think the team at its current composition plus injuries/call ups is capable of winning a title then I don't know what to say. 

The deeper problems are that half our players are getting long in the tooth and/or coming back from injuries and concussions and the other half is way too young, with very few players in their prime.  And the coaching staff cannot get hold of them for any meaninful period of time.

Pat Lam or Scott Robertson would struggle to make this team competitive in knock out rugby unless a lot of things change. One of the reasons, by the way, why they wouldn't change Bristol or the Crusaders for the Scarlets, unless they see it as a path towards the Wales gig and frankly, in our current state, they probably are better off staying where they are even if they were aiming at the Wales HC position.

1 Xavier Rush   2 Rhys Priestland   3 David Lyons   Cardiff Blues - Scarlets, 26/09/09      

More carries than any of our forwards. Priestland Fan Club Proud Member
Back to Top
turkishrebel View Drop Down
Veteran
Veteran
Avatar

Joined: 26 November 2004
Location: Ammanford
Status: Offline
Points: 5229
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote turkishrebel Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 April 2021 at 3:21pm
Stayed off the site as i have only just now calmed down....so so depressing.
We seem to have stagnated since Brad Mooar left us. I think we were caught out by him going to the All Blacks and made the costly decision of not really looking for a replacement.
Ever since our coaching team has been short in experience and the ability to get hold of the squad and to develop a meaningful game plan. We have tried to play a physical kicking game which does not suit us, we cant beat packs up and to be honest its a boring style of play.
What does appear to also be is that as time has gone by a lot of the players have not bought into this game plan. 
Our general body language of the players has been poor and our basic skills have been horrendous. We have always been a skill side and not a brunt force team.
We have a couple of young coaches learning their way in Kelly and flanaghan and whiffin. But we genuinely needed someone to come in to take control and give the rugby side of the region guidance.

We have been very unlucky with covid, long term injuries and wales games taking chunks of the squad out. this has further damaged our position. We have not seen some players for well over a year and maybe longer.
Covid has taken away a lot of our finances and that has also been further damaged by the WRU and its total lack of help. We are tied down and at the moment just looking to be in survival mode. 

Future i am more worried now than i have been for some time. When we come out of this we will have an aging squad with a lot of players out long term. Will they come back to anything like they were? 
A coaching team that needs a spark (would say 2 or 3  good coaches to galvanise the players).

We are losing some experienced players and as we have apparently got 60 players on the book we will need to cut it down by probably a 3rd and then be able to recruits 2/3 better quality players. Whether this is enough i dont know. I do hope we can continue to blood some of our very good youngsters coming through and to keep them long term. 

We are well lead in the off the field management, Simon Muderack and the board have done and are doing a great job. IF anyone has been on a Crys16 meeting you can see that. Jon Daniels too.

The next few weeks in my mind are critical for us going forward, i do feel we need the coaches in sooner rather than later. Who i dont know, Peel could be one? who knows but even then it will take time to change the feeling coming out of the playing side. 
I honestly dont mind if we struggle for a while while developing some youngsters and a game plan. would rather see that than carry on with the turgid stuff of this season. 
Well thats me done. off for a cuppa now

Once a Scarlet, always a Scarlet!
Back to Top
EJPT View Drop Down
Veteran
Veteran
Avatar

Joined: 14 February 2012
Location: Berkshire
Status: Offline
Points: 2516
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote EJPT Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 April 2021 at 5:04pm
Good post Turkishrebel. Players have shown little flashes of what they can do throughout the season but its not been good enough. Discipline, lineout, mauls (defending and attacking), general handling and passing, we can go back and pickout points in the season where these have been major issues. I would say that the Scrum has held up well apart from edinburgh at home where the ref got it in his head we were committing the most heinous of sin and penalised us something like 12 times in the Scrum alone.

Back to Top
roy munster View Drop Down
Veteran
Veteran
Avatar

Joined: 30 August 2010
Status: Offline
Points: 14320
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote roy munster Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 April 2021 at 5:34pm
Surely to goodness a side with over 500 caps can suss out 1) we're up against a ferocious rush defence and 2) we needed to implement ways around it not through it. 
We didnt suss out 1 so we never even tried 2. 

We need a footballer at 12 sometimes, this is why the endless ommision of asquith has bemused us all

Basic rugby intelligence is critical, at club regional or test level... Take superstars like du pont or Barrett or Carter or BOD etc, they read the game so well , play whats in front of them adapt to the conditions and opponents and use their wide ranging skill set ...Even when his pace was gone BODs rugby IQ still made him quicker in thought and deed than other centres. ..Were not usiing our noggins munUnhappy


Edited by roy munster - 06 April 2021 at 5:36pm
ROYMOND MUNTER MBE (FOR SERVICES TO THE COMBOVER)
Back to Top
Wil Chips View Drop Down
Rambler
Rambler
Avatar

Joined: 23 August 2009
Location: Africa
Status: Offline
Points: 45504
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Wil Chips Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 April 2021 at 5:41pm
Aye. Good post.
Back to Top
Tony Clifton View Drop Down
Groupie
Groupie
Avatar

Joined: 14 February 2021
Status: Offline
Points: 121
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Tony Clifton Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 April 2021 at 6:03pm
That’s a great post TR. Nothing more to add to it! Sometimes it takes pain to make the change come around, we had our pain, let’s take something from it and push forward.
Back to Top
Eastern outpost View Drop Down
Veteran
Veteran
Avatar

Joined: 13 March 2012
Location: South Suffolk
Status: Offline
Points: 17419
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Eastern outpost Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 April 2021 at 7:17pm
Add my thanks for TR’s post.

I wanted the match stopped at the hour Mark; well before then actually. The hour Mark was when hope had officially been extinguished over here.

Having the game clock on fast forward would’ve been an acceptable compromise.

Looking at the results over the weekend, I think that ours was the worst. Even Harlequins (mostly youth) did better, relatively, against Ulster than our experienced collective.

I can sympathise with Edinburgh’s being taken to the cleaners in Racing. They’re established big hitters playing at home.

We’ve had a year away from the routine of trips to y Parc to watch exciting and reasonably successful rugby. Habits change, whether for season ticket holders or sponsors. It doesn’t need the style of play to aggravate that threat to the club.
In a world where you can be anything – Be Kind.
Back to Top
SA14 View Drop Down
Moderator Group
Moderator Group
Avatar
Don't blink

Joined: 15 August 2004
Location: Pemberton
Status: Offline
Points: 21071
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote SA14 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 April 2021 at 8:08pm
Jake very lucky to get away with no ban. 
Back to Top
Eastern outpost View Drop Down
Veteran
Veteran
Avatar

Joined: 13 March 2012
Location: South Suffolk
Status: Offline
Points: 17419
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Eastern outpost Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 April 2021 at 8:23pm
Originally posted by SA14 SA14 wrote:

Jake very lucky to get away with no ban. 
Karma? Sympathy vote for, I nearly said yesterday’s, Sale debacle?

Maybe the citing commissioners are sending Faf a message that they’ve grown tired of his antics.

Or, does Jake have Irish antecedents?
In a world where you can be anything – Be Kind.
Back to Top
reesytheexile View Drop Down
Veteran
Veteran
Avatar

Joined: 11 August 2012
Location: Machynys
Status: Offline
Points: 14518
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote reesytheexile Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 April 2021 at 10:04pm
Originally posted by Eastern outpost Eastern outpost wrote:

Originally posted by SA14 SA14 wrote:

Jake very lucky to get away with no ban. 
Karma? Sympathy vote for, I nearly said yesterday’s, Sale debacle?

Maybe the citing commissioners are sending Faf a message that they’ve grown tired of his antics.

Or, does Jake have Irish antecedents?
Ouch !! 😂 
"I'd rather have been a judge than a miner.Being a miner,as soon as you are too old and tired and sick and stupid to do the job properly,you have to go.The very opposite applies with judges!"P.Cook
Back to Top
hoppy View Drop Down
Veteran
Veteran


Joined: 22 May 2009
Status: Offline
Points: 1397
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote hoppy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 April 2021 at 10:22pm
Makes you wonder what is going on the training ground to prepare these players for games 
Back to Top
Busy View Drop Down
Newbie
Newbie


Joined: 17 April 2021
Status: Offline
Points: 1
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Busy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 April 2021 at 8:28pm
Hi guys
Back to Top
Wasp View Drop Down
Veteran
Veteran
Avatar

Joined: 29 April 2008
Location: Sunny Pembs
Status: Offline
Points: 15425
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Wasp Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 April 2021 at 11:03am
Originally posted by Busy Busy wrote:

Hi guys
Morning Busy Big smile
We're still still here!
Back to Top
 Post Reply Post Reply Page  <1 212223
  Share Topic   

Forum Jump Forum Permissions View Drop Down

Forum Software by Web Wiz Forums® version 12.04
Copyright ©2001-2021 Web Wiz Ltd.

This page was generated in 0.078 seconds.