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Scrum v has gone awful

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Eastern outpost Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 February 2022 at 6:49pm
Originally posted by Gate12 Gate12 wrote:

Originally posted by Wil Chips Wil Chips wrote:

Originally posted by Gate12 Gate12 wrote:

Glad this thread has taken a different direction as I haven't watched scrum v for a long time.

The second career, post career or back up plan for players is a tricky one and there's clearly not a one size fits all solution.

There's a lot of parties involved in professional development including the employer (club), governing body (WRU), employees representative (agent), union (WRPA) and employee (player) and the main thing really is a good understanding between all parties who's responsible for which bits.

One of things I'm not a huge fan of is youngsters being driven too much in the direction of college and uni. It's great for those that want to continue education in that format but there's plenty of other options out there and they shouldn't feel like they've got to go to college or uni if they want their rugby career to progress which may ultimately harm their careers outside of rugby.

Doing an apprenticeship or working in a family company shouldn't reduce youngsters chances of making it, also we haven't got the player pool to potentially miss out on that talent.


Absolutely aligned that academic pursuits are not for everyone.
The truth is that most players who come through the standard development pathway are laser focussed on being rugby players, most have never thought or contemplated an alternative or secondary pursuit, until or unless they face up to life post rugby. That’s where I think the club, as the most influential stakeholder, can do more.

Linkage to local companies, club sponsors for example, can offer that secondary skill set. There’s a stack of vocational training programs available, and of course the club can host a monthly financial planning clinic, where players can get solid professional advice around all sorts of fiscal planning.

The entities you mention in your first paragraph all have a mandate in this space I guess, but none are absolutely charged to address that aspect of player welfare and long term planning.


As well as local companies and club sponsors there's also the potential avenue of the club itself which would have a host of side benefits. There are challenges recruiting in a lot of areas with rugby clubs like physiotherapists, strength and conditioning, sales and marketing, accounts, events, web design etc. that players could begin getting engaged in and are transferrable skills to other industries either during a rugby career or post it.

I'd imagine you'd get a better player out of it too with greater engagement, understanding and interest in the club and it may also help with retention as a player and subsequently as a general employee.
Well said!
In a world where you can be anything – Be Kind.
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RR1972 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote RR1972 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 February 2022 at 7:05pm
Scrum v back to it’s usual dross . Steve spiers singing who think that’s a good use of limited air time. Shanklin and alfie dire pundits how to beat france “be brave” well that is so insightful chaps
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote roy munster Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 February 2022 at 7:11pm
Its absolute rubbish I dont watch it anymore
Did watch rugby special england with monye jiffy and dylan hartley, far more analytical 
one staggering stat that shows why we got done over 1st half
their props carried 24 times, ours carried ONCE

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jones2004 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 February 2022 at 7:24pm
They should employ Squidge Rugby if they want to improve the show. Brilliant analysis, mixed in with tremendous humour. I just watch his youtube videos, it gives me a great understanding of where the game was won / lost and is ten minutes of brilliant entertainment as well. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote RR1972 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 February 2022 at 8:44pm
The wru should employ squidge, he is top analyst of the game. He can be too heavy on the humor sometines he is much funnier than the scrum v lot and he is very bright and always worth a watch 

Edited by RR1972 - 27 February 2022 at 8:51pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote scarletnut Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 February 2022 at 8:51pm
Originally posted by Jones2004 Jones2004 wrote:

They should employ Squidge Rugby if they want to improve the show. Brilliant analysis, mixed in with tremendous humour. I just watch his youtube videos, it gives me a great understanding of where the game was won / lost and is ten minutes of brilliant entertainment as well. 
Clap
I still wake up late at night and think of what might have been when tim stimpson hit that jammy penalty1
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote dyniol53 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 February 2022 at 9:34pm
Agree - just one point. I don’t mind Sara Elgin, Catrin Heledd or Ross Harries individually - but I don’t see why you need two presenters. There’s then 4 pundits - most of whom aren’t very insightful, but they’re given not a lot of time to get their point across, because there’s 6 people Sat around the table. What’s the point?

Just need one presenter two pundits, maybe have one ex-international in the wings for an anecdote or two but there a dearth of insight really rubbish.

They let Squidge on a few years ago for a short video - not sure the show producers get it. 

There’s so many good analysts out there on YouTube that cast shade on Sean Holley’s analysis but at the moment Holleys bit isthe only bit worth watching.

But if the shows producers want to improve they should start with cutting the numbers of presenters and pundits in half to allow more depth.


Edited by dyniol53 - 27 February 2022 at 9:35pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote dyniol53 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 February 2022 at 9:43pm
Originally posted by roy munster roy munster wrote:

Its absolute rubbish I dont watch it anymore
Did watch rugby special england with monye jiffy and dylan hartley, far more analytical 
one staggering stat that shows why we got done over 1st half
their props carried 24 times, ours carried ONCE


We don’t use our props like that though do we - don’t know what the rucks hit stats would be but Wyn and Francis/Brown might have done more work in that area. When carrying is not either of their strengths it doesn’t make sense to make them do it - whereas Sinkler and Genge are natural carriers.

Someone on twitter made the point that although Basham is very talented, strong carrier and tackles well - his clear out work in the ruck is below par for his position. 

Squidge made the point in the Ireland wales video that were nowhere at the breakdown. I think our attack and ball retention improved a lot when Jac Morgan came on and Basham came off yesterday. It might be a big call but I’d go for Morgan, Moriarty, Faletau vs France. I’ve never not been impressed by a JM’s performance, even when we were humbled by Sale he made a difference. 


Edited by dyniol53 - 27 February 2022 at 9:49pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote roy munster Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 February 2022 at 10:07pm
Originally posted by dyniol53 dyniol53 wrote:

Originally posted by roy munster roy munster wrote:

Its absolute rubbish I dont watch it anymore
Did watch rugby special england with monye jiffy and dylan hartley, far more analytical 
one staggering stat that shows why we got done over 1st half
their props carried 24 times, ours carried ONCE


We don’t use our props like that though do we - don’t know what the rucks hit stats would be but Wyn and Francis/Brown might have done more work in that area. When carrying is not either of their strengths it doesn’t make sense to make them do it - whereas Sinkler and Genge are natural carriers.

Someone on twitter made the point that although Basham is very talented, strong carrier and tackles well - his clear out work in the ruck is below par for his position. 

Squidge made the point in the Ireland wales video that were nowhere at the breakdown. I think our attack and ball retention improved a lot when Jac Morgan came on and Basham came off yesterday. It might be a big call but I’d go for Morgan, Moriarty, Faletau vs France. I’ve never not been impressed by a JM’s performance, even when we were humbled by Sale he made a difference. 

Totally agree on that about basham , morgan has outshone basham last few games
id go with that back row and Id also bring wainwright back on the bench, am I the only 1 who rates him lol
as for the props yes hitting the rucks is important as is scrummaging but 24 carries to 1 is too much of a chasm and part explains the reason they keep smashing us in the first half hour. Our props need to do more. perhaps even try out gareth thomas as a ball carrying prop. This was where rob evans edged wyn jones, but hes disappeared off the map mysteriously
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote dyniol53 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 February 2022 at 10:15pm
Originally posted by roy munster roy munster wrote:

Our props need to do more. perhaps even try out gareth thomas as a ball carrying prop. This was where rob evans edged wyn jones, but hes disappeared off the map mysteriously

Would be great but our scrummaging is sound with Wyn and Francis. If we give away parity at the scrum we’re f***ed, even if it means our attack suffers
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote roy munster Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 February 2022 at 10:30pm
Originally posted by dyniol53 dyniol53 wrote:

Originally posted by roy munster roy munster wrote:

Our props need to do more. perhaps even try out gareth thomas as a ball carrying prop. This was where rob evans edged wyn jones, but hes disappeared off the map mysteriously

Would be great but our scrummaging is sound with Wyn and Francis. If we give away parity at the scrum we’re f***ed, even if it means our attack suffers

Cant hurt them to try carry a bit more, at least with rowlands carrying more and faletaua moriarty back it gives us more ball carriers
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote greypower1 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 February 2022 at 10:44pm
Before you can carry you need the ball. Didn't  see a lot of it first half and when we got it we gave away penalties. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote RR1972 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 February 2022 at 10:54pm
Watching jiffy and both spoke really well, jiffy rightly calling out russell lack of work rate and scotlands obession with missed passes. Wales convert 20 per cent of our line breaks france Are 65 per cent and ireland 55 per cent

Edited by RR1972 - 27 February 2022 at 10:56pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote RR1972 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 February 2022 at 10:58pm
Originally posted by greypower1 greypower1 wrote:

Before you can carry you need the ball. Didn't  see a lot of it first half and when we got it we gave away penalties. 
most of those pens were wales taking into contact, francis carried 0 tines wyn once elias 6
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote GPR - Rochester Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 February 2022 at 7:24am
Lack of ball carrying is something we have struggled with for a while. I would start Gareth Thomas & Brown - they will give us some options. Brown seemed to go Ok when he came on for Francis' HIA at set piece. Jac has to replace Basham who is so ineffective at the breakdown.

Our attacking play seems unstructured/unplanned. Support lines just aren't being run. The French and Irish seem to flood the danger areas either side of the player making the break hence they finish off more opportunities. If our props were out carried by Sinckler & Genge wait until Baille & friends arrive in Cardiff. Add in Marchand's work at the breadown & that is one hell of a front row. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote N14 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 February 2022 at 8:25am
Originally posted by dyniol53 dyniol53 wrote:

Originally posted by roy munster roy munster wrote:

Our props need to do more. perhaps even try out gareth thomas as a ball carrying prop. This was where rob evans edged wyn jones, but hes disappeared off the map mysteriously

Would be great but our scrummaging is sound with Wyn and Francis. If we give away parity at the scrum we’re f***ed, even if it means our attack suffers

Spot on, scrummaging ability has to be the top priority. Adam Jones was in no way a carrier, in fact I always thought he offered little around the park. But he was our first choice tighthead for a number of years, and rightly so in my opinion, because of his scrummaging ability. 


Edited by N14 - 28 February 2022 at 8:26am
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