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The Brexit bonus...

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GPR - Rochester View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote GPR - Rochester Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 February 2022 at 12:14pm
Originally posted by totallybiasedscarlet totallybiasedscarlet wrote:

Originally posted by GPR - Rochester GPR - Rochester wrote:

Originally posted by totallybiasedscarlet totallybiasedscarlet wrote:

Originally posted by GPR - Rochester GPR - Rochester wrote:

Originally posted by totallybiasedscarlet totallybiasedscarlet wrote:

Originally posted by RR1972 RR1972 wrote:

Your mixing up logic and the people who vote in the uk

LOL Damit, I knew there was a flaw LOL

I can advise you TBS that is not the only flaw in your argument. Putting the current cost of living increases at the door of Brexit is really stretching credibility to the limit. You may have noticed since early 2020 that we, along with the rest of the World, have been suffering at the hands of Covid. The damage to economies all over the world has been catastrophic. The Uk economy is growing as much if not faster than all other European economies so to paint the repercussions of Brexit as you are is incorrect. 

That's wrong GPR. Your bias is showing through. Data shows the UK economy fell harder and is further behind pre pandemic levels than other economies. It has also been shown that Brexit is exacerbating inflation, bringing in additional costs on top of those all countries are experiencing. You are also mischaracterising what I said (and you say I'm stretching credibility). Brexit isn't soley responsible - it is making things worse. 

My bias is showing through - thats a good one TBS. Have a little read back through the last 20 pages or so if you want to see bias. I did not say that the EU ruined our steel industry - read my comment - in part. I am already on record recently as saying that the de-industrialisation of the Uk over the past 20/30 years has been our biggest mistake by far.

As for a European defence alliance - we already have one its called NATO. Why do we need another expensive layer???? Comments like the British people will have to suffer the consequences of their Brexit decision is the absolute worse case of bias - clearly your opinion matters more & is worth more than 54% of the voting public. 

Yes, all the comments lifted from the Leave campaign. All dishonest propaganda that you appear to have fallen for. Plenty of bias there. And you did blame the EU for the demise of the Steel industry. I did read your comment. That's why I refuted it. As for NATO, did you not notice the noises coming out of America under Trump? America's reliability as a partner has been undermined by his administration. It's only a matter of time until the Republicans get in power again and just take a look at the state on them. On top of that you've got the French President calling NATO "brain dead" ... Europe would be wise to ensure it can defend itself without US support if necessary. 

As for my comment about the public sufferring the consequences of Brexit ... what? Do you think it's arrogant to point out the facts? Leave voters were all either complicit or duped. Don't shoot the messenger. And yes, people are suffering as a consequence of this vote. Well I hope people learn from their mistake. Is my opinion more important than theirs ... my opinion counts as much as my vote. And that's just it isn't it GPR ... an opinion. Like I said before, we don't have to agree do we.

Of course we don't have to agree but the least we should expect is to be quoted accurately. "constraints placed on individual member states which contributed, in part, to the demise of our once great Steel Industry" Those were the words I used yesterday - does not read like me blaming the EU for the demise more like playing a part which is what I said. 

As for your inference that NATO is on its last legs because of the state of American politics - this beggers belief. NATO and the strong alliances forged since the 2nd World War have been the single most reason for security in the Northern Hemisphere which has survived regardless of the US leadership. Trump, in many ways, was a fool but one of the things he did get right was calling out many European countries for not living up to their financial commitments. As fro Macron suggesting that NATO is brain dead my temptation is to say well it takes one to know one.........
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GPR - Rochester View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote GPR - Rochester Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 February 2022 at 12:20pm
"There have been far too many mistakes made by British governments over the years to list but the asset stripping away of our ability to manufacture is by far the greatest. Coal, steel, shipbuilding, automotive, water, power ....... the list goes on. "

In further support of my point in my last post above is a post made yesterday on another thread. No mention made of the EU in this one by the way. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote totallybiasedscarlet Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 February 2022 at 4:29pm
Yes I saw what you wrote GPR. You keep telling us stuff that we all heard during the referendum campaign. It was hyperbole then, it still is now. You like to tell us that Brexit is a good idea, how undemocratic the EU is and how bad it was for us, yet none of it is true. You might think it's true but I think you were sold a pup ... like a great many were to be fair. You bemoaned Johnson's handling of Brexit and posited that opportunities are being missed. What did you think Brexit was about? I guess any person can say what it was about for them personally but perhaps we ought to look at the personalities and money behind the Leave campaign ... then it becomes perfectly apparent what it was about. Like I said, you can't seperate Brexit from this government and their backers. It's their project, their mandate and their motives. I didn't like what I saw in the run up to 2016 and I like it even less now. These people are taking you and I and all the rest of us for a ride. Our problems are, for the greatest part, a consequence of dire domestic governance and not the EU. So yes, I do think the electorate made a big dumb mistake and I'm not afraid to say it. I can only hope that it's put a few more nails in the UK coffin so we can get on with the job of rebuilding Wales and doing a decent job of it.

If my opinion upsets you, so be it. I don't mean to personally upset you. I respect you but I don't have to like what you say or voted for. I'm sure you feel likewise.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote GPR - Rochester Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 February 2022 at 8:17am
Originally posted by totallybiasedscarlet totallybiasedscarlet wrote:

Yes I saw what you wrote GPR. You keep telling us stuff that we all heard during the referendum campaign. It was hyperbole then, it still is now. You like to tell us that Brexit is a good idea, how undemocratic the EU is and how bad it was for us, yet none of it is true. You might think it's true but I think you were sold a pup ... like a great many were to be fair. You bemoaned Johnson's handling of Brexit and posited that opportunities are being missed. What did you think Brexit was about? I guess any person can say what it was about for them personally but perhaps we ought to look at the personalities and money behind the Leave campaign ... then it becomes perfectly apparent what it was about. Like I said, you can't seperate Brexit from this government and their backers. It's their project, their mandate and their motives. I didn't like what I saw in the run up to 2016 and I like it even less now. These people are taking you and I and all the rest of us for a ride. Our problems are, for the greatest part, a consequence of dire domestic governance and not the EU. So yes, I do think the electorate made a big dumb mistake and I'm not afraid to say it. I can only hope that it's put a few more nails in the UK coffin so we can get on with the job of rebuilding Wales and doing a decent job of it.

If my opinion upsets you, so be it. I don't mean to personally upset you. I respect you but I don't have to like what you say or voted for. I'm sure you feel likewise.

No worries TBS - nothing on this forum would ever upset me - I understand & respect all views held whether I agree or not. My views on the EU have been long held and have absolutely nothing to do with the Brexit campaign waged in the run up to the referendum. 


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote aber-fan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 February 2022 at 9:02am
More 'good Brexit news' - not.

I think that the farmers voted for Brexit - is that right? If so, they are yet another group who clearly regret doing so.

This is from the President of the NFU:

The government has shown a “total lack of understanding of how food production works”, introduced “completely contradictory policies” on farming, and risks “repeatedly running into crises” through the lack of a post-Brexit plan for UK farming, the leading representative of British farmers will say today.

Minette Batters, president of the National Farmers’ Union, will make a scathing attack on ministers’ failures, unprecedented in recent memory in its ferocity from a farming leader.

Her withering assessment of the government’s actions reflects widespread anger and alarm among many sections of the UK’s farming and food production industries, one of the country’s biggest manufacturing industries and employers. Farmers have suffered from plunging exports and reams of new red tape owing to Brexit, staff shortages as EU seasonal workers have left, and the prospect of floods of cheap low-quality imports after post-Brexit trade deals.


We haven't got to the death of the first-born - yet - but I'm keeping an eye out...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote dr_martinov Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 February 2022 at 11:30am
Originally posted by aber-fan aber-fan wrote:

More 'good Brexit news' - not.

I think that the farmers voted for Brexit - is that right? If so, they are yet another group who clearly regret doing so.

This is from the President of the NFU:

The government has shown a “total lack of understanding of how food production works”, introduced “completely contradictory policies” on farming, and risks “repeatedly running into crises” through the lack of a post-Brexit plan for UK farming, the leading representative of British farmers will say today.

Minette Batters, president of the National Farmers’ Union, will make a scathing attack on ministers’ failures, unprecedented in recent memory in its ferocity from a farming leader.

Her withering assessment of the government’s actions reflects widespread anger and alarm among many sections of the UK’s farming and food production industries, one of the country’s biggest manufacturing industries and employers. Farmers have suffered from plunging exports and reams of new red tape owing to Brexit, staff shortages as EU seasonal workers have left, and the prospect of floods of cheap low-quality imports after post-Brexit trade deals.


We haven't got to the death of the first-born - yet - but I'm keeping an eye out...

Majority of farmers supported Brexit, the NFU did not:


I'm sure we'd all agree the Tories are making a pig's ear of things.
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