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Sandman View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Sandman Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 October 2020 at 10:38am
Maybe our poor, inconsistent play is down to a continually revolving door of coaches? This post isn’t in defence of Glenn just a question. Is another coach with different ideas and back room staff the right answer or stay where we are and gather some continuity? 
Only one team plays in red. (Sorry, Scarlet)
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote PE SA Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 October 2020 at 10:44am
Originally posted by Mike Mike wrote:

Delaney was a reasonable continuity appointment given it was a happy camp last year with Brad, but it should have been on the proviso that a senior attack coach with pedigree was coming in as his no.2. We’ve got the best funded squad we’ve ever had. It’s obvious that Flanagan and Whiffen don’t have the pedigree to be leading a roster of Lions and international stars. 

It’s not looking good for this group to be honest and I’d be surprised if there weren’t some new faces next season.
But that's just it. They aren't coaching a backline full of internationals. They are coaching 3rd or 4th choice players with academy lads. 

I think this season the forum (unless 6N is moved) is being a tad unrealistic in our approach.

At the end of the day, what matters most? Playing pretty or winning? If we can win and play pretty then great. But this season is a season where we are without upto 20 players.
Look at the side that backline v treviso... Is that a backline that can play and attack and score tries? Personally, imo on paper it's possibly one of the weakest backlines in the league. 3rd choice 9, 3rd choice 10, 2nd choice 12, 3rd choice 13... I'm not sure what people expect here. Much has been said about our strength in depth. We have it in some positions, but 9, 12, 13, 15 we don't have it. The backs played some decent stuff last year with the same attack coaches. 
Its time we all accept that this is a season of bedding in youngsters and giving them game time. That backline we have for the rest of the season... The only ones to come in are Prydie, Conbeer and untried Roberts, Knott, Costellow and Homer. We also have Brew (not sure if it's for the season or not). 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote GPR - Rochester Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 October 2020 at 10:59am
Originally posted by PE SA PE SA wrote:

Originally posted by Mike Mike wrote:

Delaney was a reasonable continuity appointment given it was a happy camp last year with Brad, but it should have been on the proviso that a senior attack coach with pedigree was coming in as his no.2. We’ve got the best funded squad we’ve ever had. It’s obvious that Flanagan and Whiffen don’t have the pedigree to be leading a roster of Lions and international stars. 

It’s not looking good for this group to be honest and I’d be surprised if there weren’t some new faces next season.
But that's just it. They aren't coaching a backline full of internationals. They are coaching 3rd or 4th choice players with academy lads. 

I think this season the forum (unless 6N is moved) is being a tad unrealistic in our approach.

At the end of the day, what matters most? Playing pretty or winning? If we can win and play pretty then great. But this season is a season where we are without upto 20 players.
Look at the side that backline v treviso... Is that a backline that can play and attack and score tries? Personally, imo on paper it's possibly one of the weakest backlines in the league. 3rd choice 9, 3rd choice 10, 2nd choice 12, 3rd choice 13... I'm not sure what people expect here. Much has been said about our strength in depth. We have it in some positions, but 9, 12, 13, 15 we don't have it. The backs played some decent stuff last year with the same attack coaches. 
Its time we all accept that this is a season of bedding in youngsters and giving them game time. That backline we have for the rest of the season... The only ones to come in are Prydie, Conbeer and untried Roberts, Knott, Costellow and Homer. We also have Brew (not sure if it's for the season or not). 

PE SA you make very reasonable points. However it is not all about personnel but about style of play. Brad appeared to be an attack minded coach - Delaney does not appear to be. The tone is set from the top down. Blacker unfortunately had a poor game - lets be fair every 9 has experienced that and as long as he learns thats fine. However to see AOB, who is a lively natural runner dropping back time and again and putting up the bomb was heart breaking. I would gladly write off this season if we reverted to our attacking width gamer and gave a our young guns licence to play. A backline of Blacker/Homer, AOB/Costellow, Asquith/Knott, Tyler/Roberts, Steff, Conbeer, Pryide, Rogers may not be packed with Internationals but is good enough to hold its own during the International breaks as long as we play with pace, tempo & flair. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote shocker Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 October 2020 at 11:07am
We have been embarrassingly poor in the first 3 games. A question was asked how many of the next 5 we will win. If we play like this, I can only see 1 win.  I know it is early, but with the need to secure Euro rugby next year, we need a change somewhere.
Could  be either personnel or different approach of  playing
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mr Ian Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 October 2020 at 11:08am
We play with a 3 2 1 1 structure, differentely last years we have a back line so close to our forward line, as many teams did. This is used when in team there arent strong phisicall players and want to fine the break with line runs.
For do this job need strong forward, rapid recycle of the ball and spedd scrum half pass...unfortunately at the Moment miss all and coaches need time to work on..
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mike Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 October 2020 at 11:17am
Originally posted by PE SA PE SA wrote:

Originally posted by Mike Mike wrote:

Delaney was a reasonable continuity appointment given it was a happy camp last year with Brad, but it should have been on the proviso that a senior attack coach with pedigree was coming in as his no.2. We’ve got the best funded squad we’ve ever had. It’s obvious that Flanagan and Whiffen don’t have the pedigree to be leading a roster of Lions and international stars. 

It’s not looking good for this group to be honest and I’d be surprised if there weren’t some new faces next season.
But that's just it. They aren't coaching a backline full of internationals. They are coaching 3rd or 4th choice players with academy lads. 

I think this season the forum (unless 6N is moved) is being a tad unrealistic in our approach.

At the end of the day, what matters most? Playing pretty or winning? If we can win and play pretty then great. But this season is a season where we are without upto 20 players.
Look at the side that backline v treviso... Is that a backline that can play and attack and score tries? Personally, imo on paper it's possibly one of the weakest backlines in the league. 3rd choice 9, 3rd choice 10, 2nd choice 12, 3rd choice 13... I'm not sure what people expect here. Much has been said about our strength in depth. We have it in some positions, but 9, 12, 13, 15 we don't have it. The backs played some decent stuff last year with the same attack coaches. 
Its time we all accept that this is a season of bedding in youngsters and giving them game time. That backline we have for the rest of the season... The only ones to come in are Prydie, Conbeer and untried Roberts, Knott, Costellow and Homer. We also have Brew (not sure if it's for the season or not). 

Last night yes, but we’ve had decent availability for Toulon, Munster and Glasgow. I accept it’s early days, but the attacking structure and certain selection decisions ring alarm bells for me. Notwithstanding the performances so far, I don’t think the two attack coaches have the pedigree for where we need to be, regardless.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote judith Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 October 2020 at 11:24am
Originally posted by Mike Mike wrote:

Originally posted by PE SA PE SA wrote:

Originally posted by Mike Mike wrote:

Delaney was a reasonable continuity appointment given it was a happy camp last year with Brad, but it should have been on the proviso that a senior attack coach with pedigree was coming in as his no.2. We’ve got the best funded squad we’ve ever had. It’s obvious that Flanagan and Whiffen don’t have the pedigree to be leading a roster of Lions and international stars. 

It’s not looking good for this group to be honest and I’d be surprised if there weren’t some new faces next season.
But that's just it. They aren't coaching a backline full of internationals. They are coaching 3rd or 4th choice players with academy lads. 

I think this season the forum (unless 6N is moved) is being a tad unrealistic in our approach.

At the end of the day, what matters most? Playing pretty or winning? If we can win and play pretty then great. But this season is a season where we are without upto 20 players.
Look at the side that backline v treviso... Is that a backline that can play and attack and score tries? Personally, imo on paper it's possibly one of the weakest backlines in the league. 3rd choice 9, 3rd choice 10, 2nd choice 12, 3rd choice 13... I'm not sure what people expect here. Much has been said about our strength in depth. We have it in some positions, but 9, 12, 13, 15 we don't have it. The backs played some decent stuff last year with the same attack coaches. 
Its time we all accept that this is a season of bedding in youngsters and giving them game time. That backline we have for the rest of the season... The only ones to come in are Prydie, Conbeer and untried Roberts, Knott, Costellow and Homer. We also have Brew (not sure if it's for the season or not). 

Last night yes, but we’ve had decent availability for Toulon, Munster and Glasgow. I accept it’s early days, but the attacking structure and certain selection decisions ring alarm bells for me. Notwithstanding the performances so far, I don’t think the two attack coaches have the pedigree for where we need to be, regardless.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote PE SA Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 October 2020 at 11:24am
Originally posted by GPR - Rochester GPR - Rochester wrote:

Originally posted by PE SA PE SA wrote:

Originally posted by Mike Mike wrote:

Delaney was a reasonable continuity appointment given it was a happy camp last year with Brad, but it should have been on the proviso that a senior attack coach with pedigree was coming in as his no.2. We’ve got the best funded squad we’ve ever had. It’s obvious that Flanagan and Whiffen don’t have the pedigree to be leading a roster of Lions and international stars. 

It’s not looking good for this group to be honest and I’d be surprised if there weren’t some new faces next season.
But that's just it. They aren't coaching a backline full of internationals. They are coaching 3rd or 4th choice players with academy lads. 

I think this season the forum (unless 6N is moved) is being a tad unrealistic in our approach.

At the end of the day, what matters most? Playing pretty or winning? If we can win and play pretty then great. But this season is a season where we are without upto 20 players.
Look at the side that backline v treviso... Is that a backline that can play and attack and score tries? Personally, imo on paper it's possibly one of the weakest backlines in the league. 3rd choice 9, 3rd choice 10, 2nd choice 12, 3rd choice 13... I'm not sure what people expect here. Much has been said about our strength in depth. We have it in some positions, but 9, 12, 13, 15 we don't have it. The backs played some decent stuff last year with the same attack coaches. 
Its time we all accept that this is a season of bedding in youngsters and giving them game time. That backline we have for the rest of the season... The only ones to come in are Prydie, Conbeer and untried Roberts, Knott, Costellow and Homer. We also have Brew (not sure if it's for the season or not). 

PE SA you make very reasonable points. However it is not all about personnel but about style of play. Brad appeared to be an attack minded coach - Delaney does not appear to be. The tone is set from the top down. Blacker unfortunately had a poor game - lets be fair every 9 has experienced that and as long as he learns thats fine. However to see AOB, who is a lively natural runner dropping back time and again and putting up the bomb was heart breaking. I would gladly write off this season if we reverted to our attacking width gamer and gave a our young guns licence to play. A backline of Blacker/Homer, AOB/Costellow, Asquith/Knott, Tyler/Roberts, Steff, Conbeer, Pryide, Rogers may not be packed with Internationals but is good enough to hold its own during the International breaks as long as we play with pace, tempo & flair. 
Yes agree with that GPR. It seemed to be the game plan. I am hoping it's going to be a game by game basis. We can't attack all the time. How many times have we been crying on here as we have no second game plan. Could this be a bit of us building that? That's not coming over night I know. I may be being too positive. But winning ugly is something we have barely done. We have played better than last night and lost heavily. Whilst it was not pleasing on the eye the win was there. The defence was there. The character was there. I'm sure the debutants through the side and first career starts through the side last night will take big confidence from that. It's now a platform for momentum to build. the pack needs a lot of coaching obviously as we haven't had one for years. Maybe that's the issue. Most of the time so far has gone into that area as the coaches know the players won't need much time on the training field to click in attack when that game plan is called upon. What worried me last night though was basic skills in the backs. However, I'll put it down to confidence and no momentum. We have the win now. So hopefully we can now build from last night. I hope we don't chop and change the backline through the season as that won't be good for us at all. Already about to go in to a 4th league game with a 4th different backline now that Liam will be heading to Welsh camp. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote shocker Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 October 2020 at 11:25am
There is no excuse, we were poor again last night, just like our previous 2 games.  We have worked hard over the previous years to get to a competitive side that reaches play offs etc and up  until now it's not good enough.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Rob o'r Bont Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 October 2020 at 3:17pm
I don't think it's time for change at all.  We started off with confidence and purpose and if Sanjay has caught that ball early on, he was clear under the posts - 7 points up in the first few minutes.  I honestly think all we needed was a good positiver start.  

We very rarely win away to Benneton. Good Scarlets sides have gone out ther and lost.  Coming away with a win, especially given how poorly we played is a huge positive in my book. Lets see how the team performs now, with a win under their belts and lets leave talk about change for another day.


Edited by Rob o'r Bont - 24 October 2020 at 3:18pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote shocker Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 October 2020 at 3:21pm
I don't think it's  the results are the problem, it's  more like the way we play and lack of ambition on  the field with the kick away.
I could be wrong thou 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote EJPT Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 October 2020 at 3:24pm
Times are weird at the moment can’t see a coaching change this early would do well for morale or make the scarlets an attractive place to come for prospective coaches in the future. Very Premier league Soccer attitude. 

A win is a win, perhaps we should have lost this game but we got the rub of the green. Competition in the squad is something I think needs to change, some players look like they are cruising. Others look like they are playing for the badge. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ScarletBear Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 October 2020 at 3:34pm
Originally posted by KID A KID A wrote:

We've done better in our first 3 games of this season, than we did in the first 3 games of the season when we won the league.

It's poor, but it's still very early to be talking about changes to personnel just yet.

I have seen this comment dozens if times the past week. It's an utter crock.

We have had many more seasons where we started poorly and continued the season the same way.

I have never called for our coach's head before, but his whole strategy is poor. The question is who will replace him if we do chop Delaney.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Feverpitch Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 October 2020 at 3:56pm
As much as I liked Brad and his infectious nature and efforts to immerse himself in the locality, I didn't see anything he did to improve the players individually or as a team last season. In fact I believe they went backwards in style under him compared to Pivac and were poor last year.. good to see Delaney keeping up his good work !!!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Eastern outpost Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 October 2020 at 4:03pm
Originally posted by Rob o'r Bont Rob o'r Bont wrote:

I don't think it's time for change at all.  We started off with confidence and purpose and if Sanjay has caught that ball early on, he was clear under the posts - 7 points up in the first few minutes.  I honestly think all we needed was a good positiver start.  

We very rarely win away to Benneton. Good Scarlets sides have gone out ther and lost.  Coming away with a win, especially given how poorly we played is a huge positive in my book. Lets see how the team performs now, with a win under their belts and lets leave talk about change for another day.
Nice lunch?

We’re just back from ours having had a lovely time and the slough of despond from last night has faded slightly if no further than that.

After Sanjay’s dropped try chance, the spark of any life in the backline seemed to have been snuffed out. Coincidence, probably, or a measure of confidence and freedom to play heads up rugby.


Edited by Eastern outpost - 24 October 2020 at 4:05pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote scarletnut Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 October 2020 at 4:16pm
Originally posted by GPR - Rochester GPR - Rochester wrote:

Originally posted by ladram ladram wrote:

pat lam wouldn't come to our budget,something needs to change because i have seen nothing this season so far(early i know)that suggests to me we are going into games with a strategy to win games(i know we won last night) 5 weeks ago we were being touted as the best welsh region whereas at the moment we don't look anything like that,last night in the last 5 mins when they were pressing our line we forced a turnover which looked like we had saved the day,one phase of play and we were back under the cosh where are the leaders to get us up field and play the game out in their half,kicking the ball away has taken us back 10 years and is dreadful to watch.

Just dreaming Nige. Everything about our game at the moment is cautious & lacking ambition. Players who want to play with their heads up and get the ball wide are not being selected - Asquith is a prime example. Also, great prospect that Jac Morgan is, he is very much a defensive choice whereas Dan Davies is quicker and looks to take people on - remember last season in Dublin him skinning Rob Kearney & giving a great inside ball to Hardy for a score. Talent that has been attracted by the Scarlet attacking philosophy will end up looking elsewhere unless we have a change of mindset from the top. 
That's not fair at all. Jack is a really clever footballer
I still wake up late at night and think of what might have been when tim stimpson hit that jammy penalty1
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