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ladram View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ladram Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 February 2020 at 2:50pm
Originally posted by Dai38 Dai38 wrote:

I honestly can't see any sense in letting Foxy & Parkes go. if we want to be one of the best we can't leave talent like that go.

It is a huge problem for sides like the Scarlets who provide so many players to a national side.

Those players made the team successful, and then they are lost because they are in the national side.

Adams left because, he wasn't good enough at the time (his words not mine), he also felt he deserved a regular 1st team place, he eventually had a regular place some 2-3 years after leaving after getting shipped out. If he had patience, he would have come good with the Scarlets, so I don't see that it was the Scarlets fault he left.

I hope Baldwin stays and the feeling is that the Scarlets rate him, more than Adams at the same stage of their career, so lets see if this is a "paper talk" or there is some truth in it. 
how often has foxy been available in the last 3 years?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Gate12 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 February 2020 at 2:57pm
14 games last season
6 the season before
17 the season before
 
 
If 80% of his wages weren't covered by WRU compensation, and his time injured wasn't covered by insurance, then maybe there'd be a valid debate about whether we'd keep Foxy. As things stand though talk of releasing Foxy or Parkes to retain someone with promise is a bit bonkers to me.


Edited by Gate12 - 20 February 2020 at 2:58pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote GPR - Rochester Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 February 2020 at 3:01pm
Who would be a coach aye. There is a danger we get all dewy eyed about Foxy but in all honesty when was the last time he had a match winning game for us? I can't forget Halaholo & Lee Lo running through our midfield for fun last season with Parkes at 12 & Foxy at 13. Combined they are costing us £500K+ p.a. I appreciate that now we are going to receiving 80% of their costs as long as they are in the magic 38 but there is no way we have had value for money in the past 2/3 seasons. 

We would be better off letting both go along with Fonotia and signing a big South Seas Island type who can play 13 & wing all season & giving Baldwin more games. Any savings could go towards a new tight head. Also if Blade, as it seems, is going to retire then we have some money for a ball carrying 8 to back up Uzair. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote RR1972 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 February 2020 at 3:09pm
Originally posted by Wil Chips Wil Chips wrote:

I have had a few run ins on the point of young/high talent guys in the region system now being less incentivized to stay in Wales if an offer comes along from England .
This post the new Pivac recruitment policy of identifying players qualified for Wales playing in the Prem...

So following that lead, guys who have plied their trade in England all along ( I mean the likes of Holmes, Tomkins, Francis, Taylor etc) but have qualifications to play for Wales through grandparents or birthplace, means players are now presented with a chance to get a significant boost in earnings earlier in their career in the Prem, but at the same time not jeopardize a possible call up by Wales (or England)in the future.
A sort of win-win. Baldwin is a case in point.

Also it's surprising how few guys we have in the Wales squad that only qualify for Wales when you look at it.



 
we had a spell where a lot were qualified for England
 
Cuthbert north foxy   charteris  lydiate and warbs all were born in England or had an English parent.  Of the current lot moriarty and Thomas young are English qualified I believe
 
I guess not many English people move to wales for economic reasons while many of us have had to uproot to go and live and in work in England over the years
 
How long have the polish been living in west wales? some big units there don't seem to be many of them or their kids playing rugby , a possible area the wru should look at
 
same as the lack of Asian kids playing rugby wales is a small country we need to look to get as many people from every background playing and watching the game 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote matt_george Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 February 2020 at 3:11pm
Originally posted by ap sior ap sior wrote:

Originally posted by supertaf supertaf wrote:

Originally posted by 157cb 157cb wrote:


 Ken,Ryan, Daf Hughes,Mark Jones and Dom Booth .
Ah right, I wasnt taking Dom into account.

What is up with Daf and Marc? Daf has been out for an age it seems..?

Marc calf injury, Dafydd out for the season, knee problem I believe.


Anyone know what the status is with Taylor Davies, too?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote GPR - Rochester Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 February 2020 at 3:12pm
Originally posted by matt_george matt_george wrote:

Originally posted by ap sior ap sior wrote:

Originally posted by supertaf supertaf wrote:

Originally posted by 157cb 157cb wrote:


 Ken,Ryan, Daf Hughes,Mark Jones and Dom Booth .
Ah right, I wasnt taking Dom into account.

What is up with Daf and Marc? Daf has been out for an age it seems..?

Marc calf injury, Dafydd out for the season, knee problem I believe.


Anyone know what the status is with Taylor Davies, too?

He started against Edinburgh - did he get a knock?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote RR1972 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 February 2020 at 3:13pm
when does the super rugby season end? If we want a big ball carrying centre why not try to get Jamie Roberts for a year or two
 
Top player, wq, won;t be with team wales and a good role model for our younger players
 
Ifan Phillips is a good player, very mobile, but the  basics of his game are a bit shaky , his stats show as some 16 st 7 but he looks a bit smaller than that to me.
 
I think hell do ok for us, no risk signing


Edited by RR1972 - 20 February 2020 at 3:16pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (2) Thanks(2)   Quote Gate12 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 February 2020 at 3:15pm
Foxy was on an NDC, and we've always been compensation for internationals to varying levels.
 
Foxy is one of the greatest Scarlets ever, he was outstanding when we won the league and is probably only player we've got who'd get into a world 15, he could well make the next WC as well as Lions tour and is an icon or Welsh rugby.
 
 
And we're talking about releasing him to give someone who may or may not make it game time.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote GPR - Rochester Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 February 2020 at 3:15pm
Originally posted by RR1972 RR1972 wrote:

when does the super rugby season end? If we want a big ball carrying centre why not try to get Jamie Roberts for a year or two
 
Top player, wq, won;t be with team wales and a good role model for our younger players

I've heard worse ideas. Still like a South Sea Islander as well to cover 13/14. We do lack physicality. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote GPR - Rochester Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 February 2020 at 3:18pm
Originally posted by Gate12 Gate12 wrote:

Foxy was on an NDC, and we've always been compensation for internationals to varying levels.
 
Foxy is one of the greatest Scarlets ever, he was outstanding when we won the league and is probably only player we've got who'd get into a world 15, he could well make the next WC as well as Lions tour and is an icon or Welsh rugby.
 
 
And we're talking about releasing him to give someone who may or may not make it game time.

No we are talking about releasing him and getting a quality South Sea Islander who can cover 13 & wing. The benefits are huge. Foxy certainly would not get in to a World 15 based on his contributions to the Scarlets for the last few seasons. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (2) Thanks(2)   Quote Gate12 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 February 2020 at 3:24pm
We'd be better off releasing some squad players and getting someone in rather than releasing the guy who won man of the series on the last lions tour.

If we want to win big games we need people like foxy who know how to win the biggest of games. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote GPR - Rochester Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 February 2020 at 3:33pm
Originally posted by Gate12 Gate12 wrote:

We'd be better off releasing some squad players and getting someone in rather than releasing the guy who won man of the series on the last lions tour.

If we want to win big games we need people like foxy who know how to win the biggest of games. 

You are mistaking the guy who plays for Wales/Lions with the guy who plays for the Scarlets - totally different beasts. Foxy's only focus when he comes back from injury next September will be to have a few fitness boosting games for us & then his mind will turn to gaining selection for the Lions. Helping us win the pro 14 or Europe will not be very high on his agenda if the past few seasons are anything to go by. 

Liam, another World class player, is a totally different animal though. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote aber-fan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 February 2020 at 3:42pm
Originally posted by Gate12 Gate12 wrote:

We'd be better off releasing some squad players and getting someone in rather than releasing the guy who won man of the series on the last lions tour.

If we want to win big games we need people like foxy who know how to win the biggest of games. 

Absolutely - one of the greatest ever Scarlets players. We can only hope to see him back at his best next season, but as we're paying only a fraction of his salary, it'd be crazy to release him.

As for Baldwin - promising player - I hope he stays, and would have liked him to get more game time so far this season - maybe that'll come. He certainly can not as yet be compared to Foxy at a comparable stage in his career, though - I remember Foxy destroying a French side in the European tournament with two tries when he was 21 years old, v Stade Francais in 2009 as Mr Google reminds me.

“You cannot reason a man out of what he never reasoned himself into.” (Jonathan Swift)
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote GPR - Rochester Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 February 2020 at 3:52pm
Originally posted by aber-fan aber-fan wrote:

Originally posted by Gate12 Gate12 wrote:

We'd be better off releasing some squad players and getting someone in rather than releasing the guy who won man of the series on the last lions tour.

If we want to win big games we need people like foxy who know how to win the biggest of games. 

Absolutely - one of the greatest ever Scarlets players. We can only hope to see him back at his best next season, but as we're paying only a fraction of his salary, it'd be crazy to release him.

As for Baldwin - promising player - I hope he stays, and would have liked him to get more game time so far this season - maybe that'll come. He certainly can not as yet be compared to Foxy at a comparable stage in his career, though - I remember Foxy destroying a French side in the European tournament with two tries when he was 21 years old, v Stade Francais in 2009 as Mr Google reminds me.


As we are only paying 20% he may well be worth keeping. As for destroying a French side. He scored a decent try but that was hardly destroying. The main difference between Foxy at 21 and Baldwin at 21 is that Foxy was getting games in the centre his favoured position. I am sure Baldwin's performance on youtube against another French side this season could also be described as destroying. 

I don't want to appear a Foxy basher here but facts are facts - his performances, for whatever reason, have been very average for the Scarlets since our title winning season. Of course he is a top player but
his priorities appear to be elsewhere. 

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Gate12 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 February 2020 at 3:59pm
Originally posted by GPR - Rochester GPR - Rochester wrote:

Originally posted by Gate12 Gate12 wrote:

We'd be better off releasing some squad players and getting someone in rather than releasing the guy who won man of the series on the last lions tour.

If we want to win big games we need people like foxy who know how to win the biggest of games. 

You are mistaking the guy who plays for Wales/Lions with the guy who plays for the Scarlets - totally different beasts. Foxy's only focus when he comes back from injury next September will be to have a few fitness boosting games for us & then his mind will turn to gaining selection for the Lions. Helping us win the pro 14 or Europe will not be very high on his agenda if the past few seasons are anything to go by. 

Liam, another World class player, is a totally different animal though. 
 
Winning the league seemed pretty big to him from where I was sitting. Regardless of opinions on form, and the reasons for them, I think it's very unfair to suggest someone who's played 12 seasons for the Scarlets doesn't really care about the Scarlets.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote aber-fan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 February 2020 at 4:01pm
Originally posted by GPR - Rochester GPR - Rochester wrote:

Originally posted by aber-fan aber-fan wrote:

Originally posted by Gate12 Gate12 wrote:

We'd be better off releasing some squad players and getting someone in rather than releasing the guy who won man of the series on the last lions tour.

If we want to win big games we need people like foxy who know how to win the biggest of games. 

Absolutely - one of the greatest ever Scarlets players. We can only hope to see him back at his best next season, but as we're paying only a fraction of his salary, it'd be crazy to release him.

As for Baldwin - promising player - I hope he stays, and would have liked him to get more game time so far this season - maybe that'll come. He certainly can not as yet be compared to Foxy at a comparable stage in his career, though - I remember Foxy destroying a French side in the European tournament with two tries when he was 21 years old, v Stade Francais in 2009 as Mr Google reminds me.


As we are only paying 20% he may well be worth keeping. As for destroying a French side. He scored a decent try but that was hardly destroying. The main difference between Foxy at 21 and Baldwin at 21 is that Foxy was getting games in the centre his favoured position. I am sure Baldwin's performance on youtube against another French side this season could also be described as destroying. 

I don't want to appear a Foxy basher here but facts are facts - his performances, for whatever reason, have been very average for the Scarlets since our title winning season. Of course he is a top player but
his priorities appear to be elsewhere. 


He scored two tries, and destroyed the Stade defence. He made them look like schoolboys, such was his power and pace that day.

I was there - and was 100% confident that he'd be in the Wales side very soon afterwards. He was selected for the summer tour that year. 
“You cannot reason a man out of what he never reasoned himself into.” (Jonathan Swift)
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