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Wil Chips View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Wil Chips Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 April 2021 at 10:44am
It's not great though is it....years of strife in Welsh rugby, seems never ending.

It must overshadow the product when you look through the lens of any type of investor.

I'm whining here.
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RR1972 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote RR1972 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 April 2021 at 11:13am
Grass roots want more money the womens game want more money the semi pro game wants more money the pro game wants more money.  Investing in hotels etc seems less of a priorty to me. Hasn’t the hospitality had their worst year ever? The wru are going to come along in a competitve mArket place with zero experience in that field and make a fortune? 😂😂👍
 I remain to be convinced for me id put money into the regions for welsh players or nwq project players and into school and age group rugby. 


Edited by RR1972 - 30 April 2021 at 11:18am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote greypower1 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 April 2021 at 11:19am
What are the other nations doing with the CVC windfall?  Are they distributing it to the clubs and Regions or investing in vanity projects like the WRU.?  
Keep the faith
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote RR1972 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 April 2021 at 11:37am
Originally posted by greypower1 greypower1 wrote:

What are the other nations doing with the CVC windfall?  Are they distributing it to the clubs and Regions or investing in vanity projects like the WRU.?  
i don’t think the others are opening up hotels and the likes!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Eastern outpost Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 April 2021 at 12:28pm
With Wil’s point re grey are/moral point etc, is that still the case when we’ve sold our share of future competition income and they’ve kept the proceeds to date?
Is it more than moral, also, when they don’t pay for the use of our contracted players for their fixtures?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote RR1972 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 April 2021 at 12:30pm
Originally posted by Eastern outpost Eastern outpost wrote:

With Wil’s point re grey are/moral point etc, is that still the case when we’ve sold our share of future competition income and they’ve kept the proceeds to date?
Is it more than moral, also, when they don’t pay for the use of our contracted players for their fixtures?
arent most of the top players 80 per cent contracted to the wru? Irb rules prevent us from with holding players from test duty i think
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote GPR - Rochester Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 April 2021 at 12:33pm
Am I understanding this correctly - I thought the chosen 38 were paid 80% by the WRU. Are posters now suggesting that the regions actually make the payments and collect off the WRU who have not paid what they owe i.e. the 80%. If that is the case they are surely in breach of contract, nothing to do with morals etc its a blatant breach and should be placed in the hands of a legal team.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jones2004 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 April 2021 at 4:17pm
Originally posted by GPR - Rochester GPR - Rochester wrote:

Am I understanding this correctly - I thought the chosen 38 were paid 80% by the WRU. Are posters now suggesting that the regions actually make the payments and collect off the WRU who have not paid what they owe i.e. the 80%. If that is the case they are surely in breach of contract, nothing to do with morals etc its a blatant breach and should be placed in the hands of a legal team.
From what I’ve read of the interviews (and I could easily be wrong), it seems that the WRU themselves have only given the regions £3m between them since Covid hit. That is never enough to cover 80% and therefore it does seem a breach of contract in my untrained eyes. This is only if they don’t count the Welsh Government grant or NatWest loan as covering the 80% of course.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Wil Chips Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 April 2021 at 4:57pm
Just to clarify the 38 Wales squad guidance..

The Welsh coaching set up select their 38 players in *January of each year, it applies for a 1 calendar year only, and is for the following playing season.. i.e. 38 man squad selected in January 2021 is for the season that starts in September 2021.

The WRU then cover ( directly from their pockets) 80% of the players salary, the remaining 20% is paid for by the players region.

*It may seem odd timings, but the governance on player contracts means you can't sign for another team before January of each year ( in reality this is nonsense as everyone is mostly done and dusted by then, but dem da rules).

It does mean that players, like for example George North, will be in the 38, but of course will likely now not play in 2021...see Anscombe for 2020. You can't change the 38 once selected, even for long term injury or if someone decides to leave etc.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote roy munster Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 April 2021 at 6:18pm
Originally posted by RR1972 RR1972 wrote:

Originally posted by greypower1 greypower1 wrote:

What are the other nations doing with the CVC windfall?  Are they distributing it to the clubs and Regions or investing in vanity projects like the WRU.?  
i don’t think the others are opening up hotels and the likes!

didnt the rfu open a new twickenham hotel a couple of yrs ago ? not sure how much of it they funded 
ROYMOND MUNTER MBE (FOR SERVICES TO THE COMBOVER)
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote GPR - Rochester Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 May 2021 at 7:59am
Originally posted by Wil Chips Wil Chips wrote:

Just to clarify the 38 Wales squad guidance..

The Welsh coaching set up select their 38 players in *January of each year, it applies for a 1 calendar year only, and is for the following playing season.. i.e. 38 man squad selected in January 2021 is for the season that starts in September 2021.

The WRU then cover ( directly from their pockets) 80% of the players salary, the remaining 20% is paid for by the players region.

*It may seem odd timings, but the governance on player contracts means you can't sign for another team before January of each year ( in reality this is nonsense as everyone is mostly done and dusted by then, but dem da rules).

It does mean that players, like for example George North, will be in the 38, but of course will likely now not play in 2021...see Anscombe for 2020. You can't change the 38 once selected, even for long term injury or if someone decides to leave etc.

Thanks Wil so that suggests that the regions are not owed anything from the WRU for their Internationals. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Eastern outpost Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 May 2021 at 9:43am
Originally posted by GPR - Rochester GPR - Rochester wrote:

Originally posted by Wil Chips Wil Chips wrote:

Just to clarify the 38 Wales squad guidance..

The Welsh coaching set up select their 38 players in *January of each year, it applies for a 1 calendar year only, and is for the following playing season.. i.e. 38 man squad selected in January 2021 is for the season that starts in September 2021.

The WRU then cover ( directly from their pockets) 80% of the players salary, the remaining 20% is paid for by the players region.

*It may seem odd timings, but the governance on player contracts means you can't sign for another team before January of each year ( in reality this is nonsense as everyone is mostly done and dusted by then, but dem da rules).

It does mean that players, like for example George North, will be in the 38, but of course will likely now not play in 2021...see Anscombe for 2020. You can't change the 38 once selected, even for long term injury or if someone decides to leave etc.

Thanks Wil so that suggests that the regions are not owed anything from the WRU for their Internationals. 
Has the money actually been handed over?
It still leaves the competition income being withheld.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote GPR - Rochester Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 May 2021 at 9:47am
Originally posted by Eastern outpost Eastern outpost wrote:

Originally posted by GPR - Rochester GPR - Rochester wrote:

Originally posted by Wil Chips Wil Chips wrote:

Just to clarify the 38 Wales squad guidance..

The Welsh coaching set up select their 38 players in *January of each year, it applies for a 1 calendar year only, and is for the following playing season.. i.e. 38 man squad selected in January 2021 is for the season that starts in September 2021.

The WRU then cover ( directly from their pockets) 80% of the players salary, the remaining 20% is paid for by the players region.

*It may seem odd timings, but the governance on player contracts means you can't sign for another team before January of each year ( in reality this is nonsense as everyone is mostly done and dusted by then, but dem da rules).

It does mean that players, like for example George North, will be in the 38, but of course will likely now not play in 2021...see Anscombe for 2020. You can't change the 38 once selected, even for long term injury or if someone decides to leave etc.

Thanks Wil so that suggests that the regions are not owed anything from the WRU for their Internationals. 
Has the money actually been handed over?
It still leaves the competition income being withheld.

I'm a little confused about this Steve. I thought Muderack & the other chairmen were complaining that they hadn't received money for the release of their Internationals for the 6 nations. From what Wil is saying the 80% for the 38 man list is paid direct to the players so the only thing they could be talking about is payment for players not in the named 38 man squad. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Eastern outpost Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 May 2021 at 3:01pm
Originally posted by GPR - Rochester GPR - Rochester wrote:

Originally posted by Eastern outpost Eastern outpost wrote:

Originally posted by GPR - Rochester GPR - Rochester wrote:

Originally posted by Wil Chips Wil Chips wrote:

Just to clarify the 38 Wales squad guidance..

The Welsh coaching set up select their 38 players in *January of each year, it applies for a 1 calendar year only, and is for the following playing season.. i.e. 38 man squad selected in January 2021 is for the season that starts in September 2021.

The WRU then cover ( directly from their pockets) 80% of the players salary, the remaining 20% is paid for by the players region.

*It may seem odd timings, but the governance on player contracts means you can't sign for another team before January of each year ( in reality this is nonsense as everyone is mostly done and dusted by then, but dem da rules).

It does mean that players, like for example George North, will be in the 38, but of course will likely now not play in 2021...see Anscombe for 2020. You can't change the 38 once selected, even for long term injury or if someone decides to leave etc.

Thanks Wil so that suggests that the regions are not owed anything from the WRU for their Internationals. 
Has the money actually been handed over?
It still leaves the competition income being withheld.

I'm a little confused about this Steve. I thought Muderack & the other chairmen were complaining that they hadn't received money for the release of their Internationals for the 6 nations. From what Wil is saying the 80% for the 38 man list is paid direct to the players so the only thing they could be talking about is payment for players not in the named 38 man squad. 
I think the vast majority are confused. It’d be great to get it cleared up.

If we employ an international in the list of 38, the contract is between the club and the player. I’d have thought that the WRU would have had to send money to the club. 
The contract presumably says, “Scarlets (or other of the pro clubs) pays Player X, salary Y”. 

The accountants on here will be able to say whether the WRU, who aren’t the employer, can deduct and remit PAYE tax. Also what happens re Employer’s National Insurance? 

I’d be much more inclined to believe our Board than any piece of guff from the WRU about these matters.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Legendinmybathroom Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 May 2021 at 11:03am
I’ve just been reading the WOL (I know I shouldn’t but there’s nothing else to do), I see that the WRU are now fighting for there to be a place in the champions cup for at least on team from Wales in 2022, through fear that the SA teams may finish in the automatic qualifying positions in the Pro16 ahead of the welsh sides - how hypocritical is that considering that the WRU fought hard to change the old system in order to increase the number of places on offer to the welsh regions.
They wouldn’t have to worry about the regions failing to qualify if the just got their priorities right and spent the money on the regions and not on some vanity projects in Westgate Street, and also released players back to the regions when not used.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote GPR - Rochester Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 May 2021 at 11:10am
Originally posted by Legendinmybathroom Legendinmybathroom wrote:

I’ve just been reading the WOL (I know I shouldn’t but there’s nothing else to do), I see that the WRU are now fighting for there to be a place in the champions cup for at least on team from Wales in 2022, through fear that the SA teams may finish in the automatic qualifying positions in the Pro16 ahead of the welsh sides - how hypocritical is that considering that the WRU fought hard to change the old system in order to increase the number of places on offer to the welsh regions.
They wouldn’t have to worry about the regions failing to qualify if the just got their priorities right and spent the money on the regions and not on some vanity projects in Westgate Street, and also released players back to the regions when not used.

Yes its utter nonsense. Does that also mean that Scotland & Italy should all be guaranteed a place at the top table. Pep Guardiola summed it up best when he said that if a competition is decided not on merit then it isn't sport.

The four regions have, between them, some pretty heavy hitters; certainly heavier hitters than the clown running the WRU. The time is well overdue for a stand & show of strength from the regions. 
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